I'm just going with a measly iron block 383 and a Vortech. What a pu$$y I am!

 

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by JimmyKash:
<strong>about time someone gets serious and puts on a FAST system</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">With the power these cars are going to be putting out I don't see how the stock computer will be able to deal with the airflow readings. I'd think the FAST system or one like it would almost be mandatory. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

How are you big power guys dealing with the MAF flow limitations of the stock computer?

 

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Bad *** LS1:
<strong>I'm just going with a measly iron block 383 and a Vortech. What a pu$$y I am!</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I think you can have one <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="gr_eek2.gif" /> for that. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="gr_tounge.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

John

 

The extra cubes don't mean a whole lot.
It's the blower/turbo mass flow ahead of the motor that will determine ultimate power in any forced inducted engine.
Your blower/turbo is always the ultimate limiter of power.

If you cram let's say 70lbs/min into a 422 or a 346 they will make about the same peak power.The bigger cubes will just shuffle around the power curves.Although you can make the same power with less intake boost if that is the goal..
I have a feeling some of you may create so much low end hit it may be very difficult to hook up.

I have my maf reset to 67lbs/min.
About 670 FLWHP before it becomes a fixed mechanical injection system.
But I can also pump in another 100+ hp or so of alcohol <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />
Just a slightly modifed G-trim system and forged pistoned 346 here. kid stuff eh? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

 

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by SJH:
The extra cubes don't mean a whole lot.

If you cram let's say 70lbs/min into a 422 or a 346 they will make about the same peak power</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"><img src="http://blackls1ta.com/smilies/bsflag.gif" alt=" - " /> <img border="0" alt="[jester]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_jest.gif" />

 

you have no idea what you are talking about.
Let me guess, first supercharged motor huh?
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

 

Let's just say I don't believe you. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

 

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Black LS1 T/A:
<strong>Let's just say I don't believe you. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I'm just catching the tail end of this but SJH you are right if I am reading this correctly. If the motor moves 70#'s / min. It is the same HP But with the bigger motor it will take less blower to do this. On a blower motor you really don't pick up a ton of power by adding cubes. You pick up a ton of tq. It takes air to make power. If you flow the same air on a 4 cyl as you do an 8 cyl, your making the same power. It's just easier on the bigger motor.

 

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I'm just catching the tail end of this but SJH you are right if I am reading this correctly. If the motor moves 70#'s / min. It is the same HP But with the bigger motor it will take less blower to do this. On a blower motor you really don't pick up a ton of power by adding cubes. You pick up a ton of tq. It takes air to make power. If you flow the same air on a 4 cyl as you do an 8 cyl, your making the same power. It's just easier on the bigger motor. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Yes, that is what I was trying to say. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

 

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Guido:
<strong>How about 406ci and a PT88??

<---------

But its a SBC. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">how about 183" and a Greddy T88? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

its ALLLLLLLL relative <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

 

SJH, with all my joking, I thought I'd better clarify my position... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

I don't doubt your experienced remark about theoretical or calculated volumes and expected power.

I simply don't believe that 346 CID and say, 10 to 12 PSI is a better, more reliable situation than a 422 and 5 or 6 PSI of boost situation, other factors being equal. (That's a loose example... don't get technical on me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> )

My concurrence that "There's No Replacement For Displacement" stands, because, I believe if you buld a 346 and a 422 similiarly and give them the same amount of boost, the 422 will be on top. OR, that you could build the 422 conservatively, put conservative boost to it, and match the 346 setup's performance or exceed it, but more reliably and effortlessly (for the motor).

But then again, it could just all be a matter of taste. <img border="0" alt="[chug]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_chug.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

 

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Black LS1 T/A:
[QB]

I simply don't believe that 346 CID and say, 10 to 12 PSI is a better, more reliable situation than a 422 and 5 or 6 PSI of boost situation, other factors being equal. (That's a loose example... don't get technical on me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> )[/b]</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">with the same SIZE blower/turbo this is going to be debatable....now if you said 10psi on the 422 and 20psi on the 346 you are correct but with boost levels under even 12psi....you shouldn't have reliability problems imho *IF* and thats a big if...you know what you are doing tuning wise. Otherwise even 4psi can destroy your motor if you dont know what is going on

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">My concurrence that "There's No Replacement For Displacement" stands, because, I believe if you buld a 346 and a 422 similiarly and give them the same amount of boost, the 422 will be on top. OR, that you could build the 422 conservatively, put conservative boost to it, and match the 346 setup's performance or exceed it, but more reliably and effortlessly (for the motor).

But then again, it could just all be a matter of taste. <img border="0" alt="[chug]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_chug.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">again it depends on the size of the blower/turbo and the amount of air it is producing.....why do you think bob reiger's 427 twin turbo small block runs very similar times to connely's twin turbo 440 (i think) big block? they are both running the same size turbos (T76s) and more that likely maxing out the lbs/min and therefore making similar power

personally, i'd rather have a smaller cubic inch motor with a little bit bigger turbo/blower and produce the same amount of power under less boost because once you have a big inch motor combined with boost you are going to have one hell of a torque spike that is going to be hard to control.

but everyone has their own opinion and likes/dislikes <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

<small>[ June 12, 2002, 07:47 PM: Message edited by: JimmyKash ]</small>

 

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> I simply don't believe that 346 CID and say, 10 to 12 PSI is a better, more reliable situation than a 422 and 5 or 6 PSI of boost situation, other factors being equal.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">If you go back and re read my post you will see no where did I say a 346 is going to be better or more reliable. (Although there are some arguments that can be made for either side)
Just that ultimate power will be about the same with the same blower or turbo mass flow into the engines, assuming equal tuning.
I jumped into this as I was getting the impression that some of you think the extra cubes mean more HP automatically. This is normally the case N.A., but with a blower your engines airflow is restricted to what the blowers capacity is.
Put a 800HP capacity blower on a monster 1000HP N.A. motor and you'll probably sap 200+hp out of it.
It's all relative.
If the bigger cubes make it easier for you to attain a goal and you like running less boost to do so then great, I have nothing bad to say about that.
I like a lot of boost personally. I like feeling the power come on at 1/2 throttle with 7psi.
I don't find the engine has what I call a "supercharged powerband" until it is at around 10+psi since a belt driven centrifugal builds boost at a non linear rate.
If you shoot for only 5psi at 6000rpm you have just about nothing at 3000rpm.
Anyhow it's cool there are some really nice combos coming together.
Steve

<small>[ June 12, 2002, 07:53 PM: Message edited by: SJH ]</small>

 

Both of you guys are out to lunch!

When you want a REAL mechanic to teach you a thing or two about motors and FI, come make an appointment with me! <img border="0" alt="[jester]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_jest.gif" />

SJH, where'd you get this Jason character anyway? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

 

How about 406ci and a PT88??

<---------

But its a SBC. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />