why water/alcohol injection?
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From: Jersey boy
why water/alcohol injection? is it because it cools down the motor? and do you use water AND alcohol or just one or the other? also, where do you inject it? im assuming the alcohol would go into the engine but isnt it bad to get water in there?
Re: why water/alcohol injection? the very basic concept of it is it helps prevent detonation so you can run more boost and get more power. just water injection wont give you any more power without adding boost. i think it helps cool the intake charge but someone has said when it turns to steam during the combustion process it has the greatest cooling effect.
Re: why water/alcohol injection? ok let me help you out as much as i can you inject the alky and water into the throttle body to cool the intake charge and to add octane by doing this you also use less fuel you use a mixture of denatured alcohol (xylene at home depot) and distilled water not tap water because it has mineral which will clog up the lines by cooling the charge you can run more boost along with it cools any potential hotspots in the engine and it also will clean any carbon build up in the engine which will also make it perform better all in all it is a great thing i have pics of my smc enterprises kit here
marc
marc
Re: why water/alcohol injection? Re: why water/alcohol injection? If you are intersted in a SMC kit. I have a brand new in box fully optioned kit (dual nozzle, gallon tank, tank mount, extra nozzles) that I am looking to sell. Email me if intrested. Teresayharris@yahoo.com
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From: Jersey boy
Re: why water/alcohol injection? "just water injection wont give you any more power without adding boost"
does that mean just alcohol injection will, or you have to use them both? also, is this the same alcohol they use on cars specially set up to run on alcohol? and one more quiestion: if you inject more into the engine will it cool it even more and add even more power or is there a certain place where the benifits start dropping off?
does that mean just alcohol injection will, or you have to use them both? also, is this the same alcohol they use on cars specially set up to run on alcohol? and one more quiestion: if you inject more into the engine will it cool it even more and add even more power or is there a certain place where the benifits start dropping off?
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Launching!
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From: miami
Re: why water/alcohol injection? </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by parish8:
<strong> the very basic concept of it is it helps prevent detonation so you can run more boost and get more power. just water injection wont give you any more power without adding boost. i think it helps cool the intake charge but someone has said when it turns to steam during the combustion process it has the greatest cooling effect. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Iam not to sure about that. Arent these kits supposed to cool the intake air coming into the engine. If it does this it will raise HP level without adding boost because cooler air ignites better than hot air. Have you ever noticed that your car runs allot quicker when the temp outside is cold, lets say bellow 50.
What Iam thinking of doing is using this product for tack purposes. In miami it going to get really hot especially on the track, 95-105 degrees at the track. Using this to cool my intake charge without adding boost should dramatically decrease my intake charge and I will be able to run harder. I plan an using a combination of ice cold water and some alcohol. I might even throw a couple of bags of ice ontop of my intercooler. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
<strong> the very basic concept of it is it helps prevent detonation so you can run more boost and get more power. just water injection wont give you any more power without adding boost. i think it helps cool the intake charge but someone has said when it turns to steam during the combustion process it has the greatest cooling effect. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Iam not to sure about that. Arent these kits supposed to cool the intake air coming into the engine. If it does this it will raise HP level without adding boost because cooler air ignites better than hot air. Have you ever noticed that your car runs allot quicker when the temp outside is cold, lets say bellow 50.
What Iam thinking of doing is using this product for tack purposes. In miami it going to get really hot especially on the track, 95-105 degrees at the track. Using this to cool my intake charge without adding boost should dramatically decrease my intake charge and I will be able to run harder. I plan an using a combination of ice cold water and some alcohol. I might even throw a couple of bags of ice ontop of my intercooler. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
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Brett Foote
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Re: why water/alcohol injection? While you'll get a performance increase from the temp drop the real benefit is from the 8 degrees or so WOT timing you can add as a result <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
Cheers,
Chris
Cheers,
Chris
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Re: why water/alcohol injection? </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by redaddiction:
<strong> ok let me help you out as much as i can you inject the alky and water into the throttle body to cool the intake charge and to add octane by doing this you also use less fuel you use a mixture of denatured alcohol (xylene at home depot) and distilled water not tap here
marc </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Xylene is not the same thing as denatured alchohol. Xylene (and Toulene) are used as an octane booster.
Denatured alchohol (as well as other alchohol types) boost octane also, but again Xylene and denatured alchohol are not the same. Denatured alchohol is I THINK basically drinking alchohol, with a little methanol or some other poison in it, to make it poisonous and non drinkable.
Also I have seen on the buick site that they don't recomend putting xylene in the SMC kit.
<strong> ok let me help you out as much as i can you inject the alky and water into the throttle body to cool the intake charge and to add octane by doing this you also use less fuel you use a mixture of denatured alcohol (xylene at home depot) and distilled water not tap here
marc </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Xylene is not the same thing as denatured alchohol. Xylene (and Toulene) are used as an octane booster.
Denatured alchohol (as well as other alchohol types) boost octane also, but again Xylene and denatured alchohol are not the same. Denatured alchohol is I THINK basically drinking alchohol, with a little methanol or some other poison in it, to make it poisonous and non drinkable.
Also I have seen on the buick site that they don't recomend putting xylene in the SMC kit.
Re: why water/alcohol injection? my mistake i got the two mixed up but you can use xylene in your fuel tank to up octane i believe xylene is rated at 118 octane but i'm going to do some research and see what it will eat up
marc
marc
Launching!
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From: miami
Re: why water/alcohol injection? Would it be best to install the nozle before or after the intercooler.
I also have a gallon of my little brothers model airplane fuel. is this considrerd denatured alcohol?
I also have a gallon of my little brothers model airplane fuel. is this considrerd denatured alcohol?
Re: why water/alcohol injection? </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by BigPlanTransAm:
<strong> "just water injection wont give you any more power without adding boost"
does that mean just alcohol injection will, or you have to use them both? also, is this the same alcohol they use on cars specially set up to run on alcohol? and one more quiestion: if you inject more into the engine will it cool it even more and add even more power or is there a certain place where the benifits start dropping off? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">i am certainly no expert but i have read everything i could find on the subject, most people that seem to know something about water/alkey injection tell you there is no benifit from just adding the kit. if you do see an increase in hp it is because you were detonating or too lean before the kit. the benifits come in when you add boost or add timing or use less expensive fuel.
also, everyone recomends diferent combos of water/alkey and there are lots of diferent types of alkey. i never really figured out what i was going to use if i ever did try the kit. i went with a small shot of nitrous instead and so far am VERY happy with it.
<strong> "just water injection wont give you any more power without adding boost"
does that mean just alcohol injection will, or you have to use them both? also, is this the same alcohol they use on cars specially set up to run on alcohol? and one more quiestion: if you inject more into the engine will it cool it even more and add even more power or is there a certain place where the benifits start dropping off? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">i am certainly no expert but i have read everything i could find on the subject, most people that seem to know something about water/alkey injection tell you there is no benifit from just adding the kit. if you do see an increase in hp it is because you were detonating or too lean before the kit. the benifits come in when you add boost or add timing or use less expensive fuel.
also, everyone recomends diferent combos of water/alkey and there are lots of diferent types of alkey. i never really figured out what i was going to use if i ever did try the kit. i went with a small shot of nitrous instead and so far am VERY happy with it.
On The Tree
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Re: why water/alcohol injection? </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by redaddiction:
<strong> ok let me help you out as much as i can you inject the alky and water into the throttle body to cool the intake charge and to add octane by doing this you also use less fuel you use a mixture of denatured alcohol (xylene at home depot) and distilled water not tap water because it has mineral which will clog up the lines by cooling the charge you can run more boost along with it cools any potential hotspots in the engine and it also will clean any carbon build up in the engine which will also make it perform better all in all it is a great thing i have pics of my smc enterprises kit here
marc </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I also have the SMC kit and Steve from smc told me to run straight denatured alcohol and not to mix it with water. He said I would get the best result from running just straight alcohol. Do you know otherwise?
<strong> ok let me help you out as much as i can you inject the alky and water into the throttle body to cool the intake charge and to add octane by doing this you also use less fuel you use a mixture of denatured alcohol (xylene at home depot) and distilled water not tap water because it has mineral which will clog up the lines by cooling the charge you can run more boost along with it cools any potential hotspots in the engine and it also will clean any carbon build up in the engine which will also make it perform better all in all it is a great thing i have pics of my smc enterprises kit here
marc </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I also have the SMC kit and Steve from smc told me to run straight denatured alcohol and not to mix it with water. He said I would get the best result from running just straight alcohol. Do you know otherwise?
Re: why water/alcohol injection? I wa also told the same thing to use str8 denatured alky and not to mix it. i also no some people just using regular windshield washing fluid as this has alky in it as well. Earl H..i want your kit. I sent you an email.
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Re: why water/alcohol injection? </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by redaddiction:
<strong> my mistake i got the two mixed up but you can use xylene in your fuel tank to up octane i believe xylene is rated at 118 octane but i'm going to do some research and see what it will eat up
marc </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Toluene and Xylene seem to work well, for alot of people. I would try Toulene first if it does the job. Toulene has a lower octane rating (114 I think) BUT like one of the post above says, I think xylene is harder on internal tank, and fuel pump parts. It may "eat up" more stuff than Toluene. Both seem to work well though. But I think toulene is more "gentle".
I'm thinking about trying it (toulene). Whatever you use though.... add some lube. Some use mineral oil, WD40, etc.... usually between a cap full to about 1 ounce per gallon, and have no problems as long as the mix stays below about 30%, and you use some type of lube to keep away corrosion , and keep it from like you say eating stuff.
<small>[ March 07, 2003, 11:56 PM: Message edited by: Rpm2800 ]</small>
<strong> my mistake i got the two mixed up but you can use xylene in your fuel tank to up octane i believe xylene is rated at 118 octane but i'm going to do some research and see what it will eat up
marc </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Toluene and Xylene seem to work well, for alot of people. I would try Toulene first if it does the job. Toulene has a lower octane rating (114 I think) BUT like one of the post above says, I think xylene is harder on internal tank, and fuel pump parts. It may "eat up" more stuff than Toluene. Both seem to work well though. But I think toulene is more "gentle".
I'm thinking about trying it (toulene). Whatever you use though.... add some lube. Some use mineral oil, WD40, etc.... usually between a cap full to about 1 ounce per gallon, and have no problems as long as the mix stays below about 30%, and you use some type of lube to keep away corrosion , and keep it from like you say eating stuff.
<small>[ March 07, 2003, 11:56 PM: Message edited by: Rpm2800 ]</small>
Launching!
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From: miami
Re: why water/alcohol injection? There was a website that I used to calculate the amount of octane you need to run. Personally I like using Xylene. After you pour in the xylene just follow it down with regular gas and it wont harm any rubber tubing in the pouring of the tank. I use ATF fluid to lube my xylene.
