rjw

iTrader: (3)

I've been all over this forum and others as well. I am stuck with a Mag SC on an 01 vette 6 speed w/ 3.42 gears.

While many have made it to or just over the 500 rwhp mark on a stock cube engine, I will be trying for a bit more.

I had to pull the stock engine (435 rwhp w/ Mag at 6.5 PSI) due to ring land issues on my 01 C5 vette and am in the process of rebuilding.

Here is where I am at so far. Looking for a 6500 to 6700 rpm redline.

3.905 bore w/ Diamond pistons (CR 9.3 to 10 depending on what I do with chambers)
Callies rods (LS1 specific)
Balanced rotating assembly.
ARP main and head studs, etc.
Clevite main and rod bearings.
Dart 225 heads (with some clean up)
224/230 .570" 114 cam (with some advance built in)
New OEM style lifters, .080 pushrods
OEM MLS head gaskets
Kooks 1 3/4 LT's w/ cats
New ported oil pump
Mag MP112 vette kit w/ IC
AI kit (if needed)

As far as the Mag kit goes...

Spinning it at around 17k should produce well over 1000CFM , but restriction and heat are the issues. The bigger heads should help.

I believe that FLOW = POWER not boost.

I can cut the 78mm SC inlet and open it up to 85 or maybe 90mm with a new flange.

I guess my questions are...which TB and MAF to use.

I have HPTuners, but am waiting on a reply as to whether a 2 bar SD option is available for an 01 vette.

I can open the TB to 85mm or get a 90mm LS2 unit.

I am looking for TB and MAF options as well as anything else you can think of, please advise.

If I fall short, then a small shot will be added.

I already know that I can just change the power adder and get there easily, but I am determined to give this one a shot.

Please help me get there if you can...

TIA

IT P.S.I.

contact 99z51r

rjw

iTrader: (3)

I've had email contact with him. He is or was around 530rwhp w/o juice.

CMC blower cam, 80mm TB and Z06 MAF. Also 10.7 CR and around 8 PSI with AI.

I should contact him anyhow to see if he did anything else afterwards.

Thanks

Inspector12

iTrader: (29)

600 is a big goal with that small of a SC. I have a friends that does over 500 stock with a cam 8lbs Kooks 13/4" with cats. I would say you are going to need to run a little methanol/water mix to keep the air temp down and increase you octane a little. You need it for sure to get consistent numbers. Getting rid of the cats (Cutouts) will give you another 10, but I am still not seeing 600rwhp JMO. Porting the blower will probably need to be done and A larger TB can help reduce the intake restriction so I would mark it down also and also see about opening up that side of the blower to match the TB. A Vararam would also keep you drawiing in the coolest possible air. Just a few things to consider before you attempt your goal I am sure you already knew most though.You could consider selling yours and buying a Kenny Bell they are close to being released from what I hear. Good luck!
Jeff

rjw

iTrader: (3)

The KB has been a pie in the sky for so long, that I went to the Mag.

It looks like I will be going with an LS2 TB and modding the SC inlet and flange to match.

Maybe also going SD 2 Bar HPT, and eliminate the MAF. Cost is probably similar.

Porting the Vette Mag is on the fence. The FOrd blower is not as optimised from Magnuson.

Can the Vararam flow 100 cfm or better?

Anyone else?

Inspector12

iTrader: (29)

I am sure it can it has enough surface area that is for sure. I have one on my friends Mag vette works good.

Mike 01WS6

The money you're going to spend to get that blower to put out 600rwhp is going to be outrageous, and even then you may not even hit it.

I'd just wait for the KB. All you have to do is slap it on and pulley it up. You won't need exotic intake parts and all the tricks in the book to get it to hit that power number.

mdhmi

iTrader: (1)

I don't think you're going to see 600 rwhp with that Maggie setup.

You could try a small RR pulley and an ECS meth kit. That will help, but, I still don't see you hitting 600 rwhp.

Mark

LSs1Power

iTrader: (5)

I think u will need more cubes to hit 600rwhp. Since u are doing a forged setup just go with a 9.1-9.6 C/R 402 LS2 or 408 LQ9 bottom end and ET 225-245cc heads. You will also need a little bigger than normal cam with 1-4 overlap or so to make the most power out of the motor without bleeding too much boost. Spin the SC to the max and run Water/Alky injection to help cool the charge and allow you to run more timing. 90mm TB and LS2 Manifold would help. Do SD tuning to eliminate the MAF which is going to be a restriction if you go 90mm TB and Manifold.
Good luck.

tlaselva

Call ECS, get their 8-rib pulley system, and get them to make you a 2.6" front pulley.
Put that on a LS2 402 w/ a 10.8 CR, 300ish flowing heads, a 230ish cam.
Contact Maggie for a 90mm throttlebody adaptor. They should be ready in two weeks.
You need the CR to make as much power as possible on the motor, and you need the high CR to make boost. Your not going to get much more than 10lbs of boost anyway, combined with the alky will keep the high CR safe w/ the Maggie. Friend of mine has the exact same setup as listed above, and is running 26 degrees of timing at 6000rpm, w/no detination (running alky though). You couldn't run that much timing if CR was a problem.

If that doesn't get you there, free up your exhaust, and I'd wager you'll be in that range.

Nine Ball

iTrader: (38)

You won't hit 600 rwhp with the Magna on boost alone, its simply too small to push that volume of air. It maxes out around 525-530 rwhp, then it becomes the restriction. Its an excellent street kit, not intended for all-out performance and boost.

Tony

tlaselva

Yes it will make 600rwhp.

Just needs to be accessorized properly and on a 400+ ci motor.

Lingenfelter's done a custom install of a Maggie on a 427ci and did get 630rwhp. (Not something they've advertised).

The biggest restriction is the 80mm throttlebody.
Maggie's addressing that with an adaptor for the 90mm which should be ready in about two weeks.

rjw

iTrader: (3)

I agree with the Naysayers, that 600 out of a MAg and small cuvbe engine will be tough if not impossible, but I obviously need a little more convincing.

Here are some facts (Correct me if I am wrong)

1) There are a few stock cube guys making 520 to 530 rwhp.

2) None are making any power up top (above 6k) and none are running BIG TB's, mafs or SD tuning. Also none are running more than ported stock castings, and most are running a slightly smaller cam than mine.

3) Most are also running well over 10 to 1 CR, which in itself is going to limit boost.

4) Most who drop CR go to a better power adder.

Here are a few questions...

1) How much CFM is required for 600 rwhp, and please show me that the Mag can't provide it?

2) If the Mag can't provide it, then I wonder how much boost drop people are seeing at higher rpm's?

3) The Cobras are making more rwhp on a smaller cube motor, with same size blower and higher boost. Is it all in their heads?

I am not ball busting, and I hope that people will not assume that I have an attitiude. I am just an old guy who likes to tinker with stuff, maybe a bit more than some.

I wish that I had knowledge of a stock cube setup, with BIG heads and reasonable cam, BIG enough TB and MAF (or Mafless), with s sliught drop in CR that didn't make close mto 600, so I could satisfy my curiosity and know that I am chasing my tail.

The engine is already being built with 9.3 to 9.8 CR, stock cube, etc. If I can't get there then the MAG will go, but I don't see the conculsive proof just yet.

Iwill not be investing a LOT more money by trying it. I have a machine shop, so boring out a TB and inlet or going to an LS2 TB and modding the inlset is not a big expense.

I have another car (03 Z w/ Mag in boxes) waiting to see where I get with this one, so it is also probably worth while to upgrade my HPT to a 2 bar SD, in that both cars will need it for what ever power adder ends up on them.

eviltwins

It's not "all in their heads" for the cobra guys because there has been ONE Eaton powered cobra that has made more than 600 RWHP without nitrous. That was the JDM car that did 608 RWHP STD with fully ported heads, big cams, fully ported eaton blower (they don't just open up the inlet, you have to port the case and outlet to get it to anywhere even close to 600 RWHP), and every other bolt on mod imaginable. It's possible, but that's pushing the blower to it's absolute max, and I can't say anything about how reliable it's going to be after that.

Inspector12

iTrader: (29)

Well I didn't say it was impossible just that it is going to be tough. I am not discouraging you just trying to help/ give you all the info I can. On stock cubes I think it is going to take everything you can do to get anymore than say 550 or so. Tony (Nine Ball) has done this already built 347 with ported heads and cam and even had custom pulleys made to spin the blower to the max etc... I don't think he ported the blower or did a bigger TB, @530rwhp so that tells you how much further you have to go etc... Good luck I want to see the results weather you make your goal or not so keep us posted.

Nine Ball

iTrader: (38)

From what I was told by Magnacharger, the "porting" of the underside that Cobra guys are doing with their factory Eatons does not apply to Magnachargers since they are already designed to flow better. So, they come with a different underside than the Cobra blowers, no porting required.

I also had the smallest pulley on my Magna that would fit, it was a custom piece.

I'd like to hear more about the Lingenfelter 427 with a Magna. Are you sure it was a Magna, or just some custom Eaton housing (larger?) on a custom intake.

Inspector12

iTrader: (29)

Yeah I thought you would come and explain a little better what I was talking about with your car although I didn't know every thing. Let us know on the 427 thing that you are talking about.

rjw

iTrader: (3)

Not sure about the Lingenfelter, but...

I spoke directly to some people at Magnuson, and they say that they did over 600 rwhp on a 427 with an MP112 @ 4 PSI. They fabbed some pullies for the back side (8 rib), so as to NOT have to go too small with the 6 rib pulley

How much flow in CFM's would it take to get to 600 rwhp. 17k gets around 1100 CFM.

The Mag does have an exhaust port that runs the length of the rotors (unlike the Fords), so while some cleaning up may help, it won't be as drastic as the Fords. The inlet, bypass and manny could also use some work.

Anyone know the bearing sizes on a Mag. I wonder if ceramics would help keep the heat down a little?

Nineball...What is the size of your blower pulley?

I am listening to everyone, just determined (somewhat)

Nine Ball

iTrader: (38)

Just off of memory, I'm pretty sure it was a 2.80" pulley.

LSs1Power

iTrader: (5)

You can always go with a larger crank pulley for more boost if u reached 3.00 or 2.80 blower pulley. Im running a 8.5" crank pulley now and i might go back to 7.65" because i can max the D-1SC with 3.4 and 7.65 crank pulley so no need for a 8.5" in my case. The 8.5 crank pulley will bolt to the ATI Super Damper in case u were wondering.