Vortech or ATI Procharger?
Very enlightening....it was done by Vortech so I'm sure it has some bias. Discern the test data for yourself. it'll change your mind about the two.
I also think it's sad that both Vortech and ATI (Procharger) have painted themselves into corners about intercoolers - Vortech slams Air-to-Ait and ATI slams Air-to-Water. They both have their place in the world, and if they were smart, each company would offer a choice based on the application.
I really like my Vortech, but I wish they were better about advertising ALL their choices - I ended up with a blower that was too small from the get-go. It's not all their fault - I didn't know all the questions to ask.
Jim
TECH Resident
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 787
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ATI manufactures both air to air and air to water units. It depends on the application. Street cars get an air to air where marine and drag only systems have air to water available as well. Vortech used to pan ALL methods of intercooling and then adopted a lower capacity air to water unit for their street systems.
ATI reacts decisively to negative advertising campaigns directed at their product. Its their right and duty to defend their position.
By the way, the Vortech "test" can absolutely not be duplicated in an actual installation. Even 200 degrees of oil temperature would be extremely difficult to obtain even briefly.
ATI reacts decisively to negative advertising campaigns directed at their product. Its their right and duty to defend their position.
By the way, the Vortech "test" can absolutely not be duplicated in an actual installation. Even 200 degrees of oil temperature would be extremely difficult to obtain even briefly.
Last edited by andereck; Feb 25, 2006 at 07:25 PM.
My numbers are in my signature. I couldn't be any happier with it. Don't let having to tap your oil pan be a negative. All the turbo guys have to do it and it's pretty quick and easy to do. I think it took my cousin about 10-15 minutes from start to finish.
Teching In
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5
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ECS started using paxton units (NOVI 2000's) this past fall instead of prochargers and have had great success. After the procharger drama, A&A went with vortechs, ECS went with paxtons. Both will still sell prochargers, but most customers (at least the ones on corvetteforum) seem to be going the vortech and paxton route instead.
Here is an example of one of their customers making 617rwhp/572rwtq with stock heads/bottom end:
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show....php?t=1292544
Can't go wrong with either kit, just giving a heads up on the ECS paxton kits!
Here is an example of one of their customers making 617rwhp/572rwtq with stock heads/bottom end:
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show....php?t=1292544
Can't go wrong with either kit, just giving a heads up on the ECS paxton kits!
Last edited by steve7467; Feb 26, 2006 at 12:50 AM.
Originally Posted by Got Me SOM
ATI-if you like high dyno numbers
Vortech-if you want to win the race
Vortech-if you want to win the race
The power your engine makes is part of what determines whether you win a race (which is what a dyno tests). The other factors are weight, traction, suspension, tranny, gearing, and driver. You lose.
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Verdad Gallardo Teching In
Joined: Feb 2006
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Originally Posted by C.W.A
any #'s on the paxton
From what i've gathered you'll get 500 RWHP on a completly stock LS1. One guy even did 596 RWHP on a stock LS6 w/ headers:
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show...on&forum_id=86
ECS also offers restricter plates to help with more more low end grunt. Basically you run a larger pulley which gives more boost for the low end but the plate keeps from overboosting.
Hate to sound like spam with my n00b status, but there are several members with them in the corvetteforum's C5 forced induction and nitrous section. Chris and Doug (ECS owners) and Andy (A&A) are regular members/sponsors there. May want to drop a line over there so they can give more details.
TECH Enthusiast
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 590
Likes: 0
From: Scottsdale, AZ
Originally Posted by Bikeboy1
My numbers are in my signature.
Also, if I pop the motor, I don't have to worry about crap in my oil taking out my blower. Every other oil change I change the blower oil as well. Takes 10 minutes to do and is worth it IMO.
I also love the look of the procharger as well. The polish makes it look quality.
If you are worried about the debris, add an inline oil filter, before and after... Problem solved.
Originally Posted by Drewstein
And then look at my numbers...
Also, if I pop the motor, I don't have to worry about crap in my oil taking out my blower. Every other oil change I change the blower oil as well. Takes 10 minutes to do and is worth it IMO.
I also love the look of the procharger as well. The polish makes it look quality.
Also, if I pop the motor, I don't have to worry about crap in my oil taking out my blower. Every other oil change I change the blower oil as well. Takes 10 minutes to do and is worth it IMO.
I also love the look of the procharger as well. The polish makes it look quality.
TECH Enthusiast
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 590
Likes: 0
From: Scottsdale, AZ
Originally Posted by Lostpatrolman
If you are worried about the debris, add an inline oil filter, before and after... Problem solved.
I couldn't be more happy with my decision.
I'm not worried about debris, I have the Procharger already... It's just another problem I avoided by going this route.
I couldn't be more happy with my decision.
I couldn't be more happy with my decision.
How many lbs are you pushing to achieve those numbers? As I said before each kit has it's pro's and cons and comes down more to preference then anything else. Vortech and procharger owners can spend all day battiling back and forth on here and it wont make a difference in our own minds. Although it kinda skews the numbers a bit since drew is using the upraded head unit. That would be like me using the T-trim instead of my lil G-trim. but i'm happy with my HP with my lil 6lbs of boost on complete stock block and heads. I could eaily see 550rwhp with a cam and a smaller pulley to get the 9lbs I'm ment to see. I think thats a lil more impressive for such a small head unit.
10 Second Club
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,755
Likes: 2
From: Cincinnati, Ohio
If I was buying today it would be Procharger. Back when I got my Vortech I researched and saw that a lot of ATI guys were having belt problems. I didn't want to be changing belts all the time. Also I don't think any got over 600rwhp (due to the belt issues). Now that the issue has been solved many are over 600 rwhp with no belt problems. If Vortech wants to keep up they are going to have to offer a head unit upgrade.
Originally Posted by Louie83
That may sound "cool" but it makes no sense.
The power your engine makes is part of what determines whether you win a race (which is what a dyno tests). The other factors are weight, traction, suspension, tranny, gearing, and driver. You lose.
The power your engine makes is part of what determines whether you win a race (which is what a dyno tests). The other factors are weight, traction, suspension, tranny, gearing, and driver. You lose.
I'm sure I'd drive around you too!
I can't believe this.. Vortech Compared their S-Trim to a Non Helical Impeller P-1SC head unit.. 1st off this older P1SC Non Curved Impeller is just plain old and does not flow near the amount of air the curved Helical impeller Flows.. I have seen in real life going from a P1SC Stright Blade Design to changing out the blower to a Curved design..
Results..
P1SC Non Curved Impeller, Spun to 60,000 Impeller RPMS = 3psi of boost on a flowed 1997 LT1 Stock Motor.
Changed the Blower to the Helical Impeller "Curved". Spun to the same rpms, the blower produced 11psi of boost on the same motor and rpm level..
Now I know I don't have a machine to test compressor maps and Efficenty.. However I don't need to, as I can clearly see the Curved Helical Impeller on the newer Hear unit out flows the non curved stright blade design making it much more efficent..
Vortech should Re-Do the test.. Take the P1SC-1 VS the S-Trim or T-Trim. Or the F1R VS the VSI Vortech.. I would like to see these test results.. I believe you'll find them to be very close..
Clint
Results..
P1SC Non Curved Impeller, Spun to 60,000 Impeller RPMS = 3psi of boost on a flowed 1997 LT1 Stock Motor.
Changed the Blower to the Helical Impeller "Curved". Spun to the same rpms, the blower produced 11psi of boost on the same motor and rpm level..
Now I know I don't have a machine to test compressor maps and Efficenty.. However I don't need to, as I can clearly see the Curved Helical Impeller on the newer Hear unit out flows the non curved stright blade design making it much more efficent..
Vortech should Re-Do the test.. Take the P1SC-1 VS the S-Trim or T-Trim. Or the F1R VS the VSI Vortech.. I would like to see these test results.. I believe you'll find them to be very close..
Clint