eb02z06

iTrader: (18)

Well yesterday I started pulling apart my stock short and sure enough there was lots of oil in the intake and it all leads into the runners of the heads. the car is a 02 Z06 so it has the good valley cover-no pcv, one way check valve, catch can(it had very little oil in it), and 2 breathers-one on the passenger side and one on the driver side. Here are some pics:




whats the solution to this and why is it happening?

Thanks!

kp

iTrader: (34)

No matter what you do you are going to get some oil in the intake, it can come from guides and rings, you always are going to get a little reversion and even without a PCV at all you will get some oil in there. Since these are 'dry' intakes there is no fuel to wash the oil out like an old carbed cars.

If you run a very high octane fuel that evaporates quick then you will see very little oil anywhere, except that works so well the cylinder walls and valve seats will start rusting after a few days of not running

stevieturbo

I can see a lot of joints, fittings and all sorts in the pipes you are using for breathers. All of that looks very restrictive.

Can your crankcase actually breathe at all ??? The only breather actually see, is the K&N oil filler cap.

I run the 2 RHS valve cover pipes to a baffled catch can using 1/2" ID hose
I run the larger hose from the rear of the LHS valve cover, to the same baffled catch can.

This can is then vented to atmos via a 1" K&N filter. It also returns any collected fluids, back into the oil pan.

Obviously this doesnt give any contamination into the intake, because it isnt conencted to the intake.

A similar setup using an efficient oil/air separator, that did breathe back into the intake ( free air side, not boosted ) should leave minimal oil/oil residue into the intake system.

If I was to recirculate, I would beef up the baffled oil-air separator section of my catch can.

But I dont, so I wont

I may at some point add another breather to the valley cover so I can play with my new Tig , but at the minute my setup works fine.

eb02z06

iTrader: (18)

Bro-can you post some pics of your setup please?

stevieturbo

here is a rather crude drawing.

I just made up a simple can breather pipes into one side, with a simple baffle plate inside. The opposite side is vented to atmos. The oil would ahve to travel to the bottom of the can, then back up in order to escape.
So generally they should collect at the bottom, and be returned back to the oilpan.

The return MUST be below the level of the oil, so crankcase pressure cannot blow back up this pipe.

A better oil-air separator could contain more baffles, or some form of mesh/wire wool to prevent any oil liquid making its way out via the breather.
The taller this chamber, the more effective a simple baffle will be due to the longer path any oil would have to travel to try and escape.

lmt0705

iTrader: (7)

what type of can do you use?

lmt0705

iTrader: (7)

do you run a pcv still, how is that plumed?

stevieturbo

The can is bits of crap I made myself.

I do not run a PCV, there is no need for it, as I vent only to atmosphere.

Slowhawk

iTrader: (12)

Ditch the PVC all together.

No Juice

iTrader: (11)

I believe Vortech is running a similar set up to what kp is using. kp are you getting a lot into your intake?
I have always wondered if it was better to pull the pressure out using a vacuum or just running all lines to a catch can with a breather on it?

Why not just cap off the fitting on the side of the intake and run a can with a breather on it?

No Juice

iTrader: (11)

I talked with Bob at EPP last night and he thinks that the set up that stevieturbo is running is probably the best for a forced induction application.

The only question I have is this: Is it necessary to have a vacuum on the crankcase when not in boost in order to pull the gases out?

stevieturbo can you post pics of how you capped off the fitting on the intake and throttle body?

kp

iTrader: (34)

I have no oil in my intake at all, well very little anyhow. I have the PCV and AMW can, I leave it on there since it keeps the oil a little cleaner I think but since I dont drive the car on the street anymore I really dont need it. My only complaint with breathers only is when you pop the hood after a while of street driving it smells like an oily old rag..

My old solid roller 414 had no PCV and the intake was drenched in oil lol, all the way up to throttle blades.

No matter what you do you are going to get SOME oil in there.

Here is what my intake ports looked like the last time I had the heads off last week:

stevieturbo

When I had the stock intake...a bit of rubber pipe, with a bolt stuffed up it, and clips to secure..

Im not using the stock intake/TB anymore though, so its of no relevance.

You do not need a vacuum in the crankcase, although it would be nice.

In any case, I dont believe factory PCV installs, pull a vacuum in the crankcase anyway. They arent big enough to allow that to happen.

kp

iTrader: (34)

A pcv will pull quite a bit of vacuum at idle or any other high vacuum condition. My car sitting and idling will pull the smoke in from a cigarette 3" away from the valve cover breather. If they werent effective every car built (US anyhow) since 1965 wouldnt have one on it

But at WOT they do nothing naturally, if your car is wide open 95% of the time a PCV is pretty useless. Otherwise it certainly cant hurt and with a good oil seperator it will keep the intake fairly dry.

stevieturbo

Im surprised at that. Doesnt the PCV draw into the intake via a single 10mm OD tube ??

And there is also a free air vent on the RHS valve cover of the same diameter ?

I know a lot do draw in fumes from the crankcase, but I didnt think they actually evacuated it...


Is pulling vacuum in there, really worth doing ?? ( at WOT I mean etc )

kp

iTrader: (34)

I have a breather in each valve cover and an LS6 valley cover is what goes to the PCV/check valve/catchcan to the intake. Its worth doing on a street driven car IMO, keeps the oil cleaner and doesnt smell like poo under the hood after a while. But on a drag race car it doesnt matter really, PCV is pretty useless. My setup is just leftover from when I was driving the car a lot and it doesnt really hurt anything so I just leave it..

Just about every 'real' race car has a belt driven or electric vacuum pump to keep vacuum in the crankcase at WOT. It helps with ring seal quite a bit and you can run lower tension rings as well which = more power.

Thats one of the side benefits of a dry sump oil system, negative crankcase pressure at all times. But you can pull too much vacuum and starve the wrist pins of oil but the new EDM oil hole rods kind of help that out.

No Juice

iTrader: (11)

kp,
a few questions
1) isn't your check valve in between your intake and catch can? so you don't boost your can?
2) Why does the pcv system need a fresh air source? (you use the breathers on the valve covers for the fresh air sources correct?) Do you run any lines to the inlet side of the blower?
3) So when crusing (not under boost) isn't your set up just pulling fresh air into the intake from the valve cover breathers through the can rather than pulling out the crankcase gases?

I understand that under boost the check valve will close and the breathers will vent any crankcase pressures.

maybe I'm completely confused here.

kp

iTrader: (34)

The check valve is right at the intake so nothing gets by it, i just didnt put them in order.

If it doesnt have a fresh air source it will suck the gaskets in eventually among other things. When cruising and at idle it is pulling fresh air through the valve covers, through the valley/vrankcase and into the intake. There is always more vacuum then pressure, assuming your rings are in decent shape, thats how PCV works. Stock it pulls air through the TB (since that air can be measured through the MAF) and the baffle in the valve cover to the intake.

I dont like putting the breather to the blower/turbo intake. If you have a decent filter it will never do anything except get oil into the comperssor, it canr pull enough vacuum there to do anything really unless the air filter is plugged.. No matter what you do some oil vapor is going to get sucked in.

Either way it all does the same thing, except the PCV will help things stay a little cleaner driving around town. But of course some say the valve cver breathers let too much dirt get in the crankcase too. The idea of using a remote breather can is a little safer since if something happens oil wont drip on the headers and catch fire. I will eventually do it that way and eliminate the pcv/catchcan. Figured I'd pick up some fancy valve covers and do it one day

No Juice

iTrader: (11)

So in your opinion what would be the ideal set up for FI without the LS6 valley in order to produce a vacuum at idle and vent during boost?

kp

iTrader: (34)

I would still use a PCV with the stock vent line going to a remote mounted catch can with a breather or just the breather on the RH valve cover and a good oil seperator on the PCV. Really its not that big of a deal, there is a dozen ways to do it and work