FI Maintenence/Problems
Naa its the truth. Your gonna have to work on your car. **** breaks. You have to fix it. Like i said if you want a fast car get a new z06. Most people with FI cars dont mind doing the work because its their hobby.
If your nervous then just go heads/cam and be done with it. A combo such as a g5x3 and prc/patriot ls6 heads, fast 90/90, underdrive pulley, and a tune is good for almost 450 rwhp. Modding a car in any fashion for over 200 rwhp more than stock is going to cause things to break...
Originally Posted by SStolen
I'm still a newbie by all means when it comes to FI. I've had a turbo car for two years but have only driven my car maybe 4 months of that because I am always having problems. I blew a head gasket once. No big deal. Replaced it. I blew another one and on the way to the shop to change it, the motor decided to push all the water out of the motor under normal driving. Usual that doesn't happen unless you're under boost. I guess it built vacuum/pressure. So the motor ran a little hot and when I pulled the heads, I checked the bores and the cylinders were just a little too scarred to chance it. If it had been all-motor I wouldn't have worried about it, but you take a risk when you're building cylinder pressure with boost. So I had to pull the engine, buy new bearings, rings, gaskets, a little over a thousand after paying for assembly. Then I get the motor back. It is running strong and I'm racing a guy and after the race, oil pressure drops to 17 and won't raise with rpms. Bearing failure. It could be the bearings themselves, the oil pump, the machine work, or the engine builder. Who knows? But I don't think it would have happened without boost. Cylinder pressure is a strain on a motor. I think about it like this. I can bench press 250lbs. But on PCP I can bench probably 500lbs. My muscles can't do it by themselves but they can with a "power adder" if you want to call it that. So everything is all good while I'm on PCP, but after that **** wears off, my body is gonna be like, "man....... ****.... you" because I've stressed every muscle and tendon past what its used to.
If you keep power down to a reasonable level 500-550 rwhp, I think it can be very reliable. You can make that on 7-9 lbs depending on your set-up. But once you get up to the 700+ range, 13+lbs, its a crap shoot in my opinion. The issue is that when you have a problem, it is ten times worse with boost. I watch the air/fuel as much as the road when I'm racing now because all it takes is one time for you to lean out and "pop" That doesn't happen with all-motor set-ups. You tune for 11.5a/f and you're fine. Then all of a sudden you're at 13.5a/f and your detonating like crazy. Tuned on motor you're at 13.0 to 13.5 (lol, I don't remember). If you go up to 15.0a/f its not nearly as big of a deal. You're engine can pull enough timing to save itself from itself. It can't pull enough timing in the world to save itself from 15lbs of boost being forced into the engine at 13.5a/f. I constantly check my coolant temp because you never know when you might blow a head gasket and push all the water out. I watch the oil pressure because you never know when you might spin a bearing or chew one up because you were detonating. Take it for what you will but its a risky game IMHO. I would bet that 94.9% of the people with FI cars have a second car they use for a DD or back-up. When I get my car running next time around (yes, it is down as we speak) I will drive it everyday that it is nice (and gas isn't $4.00/gallon). But I don't drive it on long trips, in the rain, in a lot of stop and go traffic.
If you keep power down to a reasonable level 500-550 rwhp, I think it can be very reliable. You can make that on 7-9 lbs depending on your set-up. But once you get up to the 700+ range, 13+lbs, its a crap shoot in my opinion. The issue is that when you have a problem, it is ten times worse with boost. I watch the air/fuel as much as the road when I'm racing now because all it takes is one time for you to lean out and "pop" That doesn't happen with all-motor set-ups. You tune for 11.5a/f and you're fine. Then all of a sudden you're at 13.5a/f and your detonating like crazy. Tuned on motor you're at 13.0 to 13.5 (lol, I don't remember). If you go up to 15.0a/f its not nearly as big of a deal. You're engine can pull enough timing to save itself from itself. It can't pull enough timing in the world to save itself from 15lbs of boost being forced into the engine at 13.5a/f. I constantly check my coolant temp because you never know when you might blow a head gasket and push all the water out. I watch the oil pressure because you never know when you might spin a bearing or chew one up because you were detonating. Take it for what you will but its a risky game IMHO. I would bet that 94.9% of the people with FI cars have a second car they use for a DD or back-up. When I get my car running next time around (yes, it is down as we speak) I will drive it everyday that it is nice (and gas isn't $4.00/gallon). But I don't drive it on long trips, in the rain, in a lot of stop and go traffic.
Lol, dont worry, its not just you.
I dont know if you followed any of my threads but I had constant problems as well. Between overheating, blowing up a mcleod twin disk, two fuel pump failures, and now I think my piston is fucked (has been down for a few months now...)
Im getting it rebuilt, but i dunno honestly how long Id wanna hold on to the car, as much as I love it, because when you talk about high horsepower applications, nothing is ever for certain.
Originally Posted by ss53mech
I have been around a bunch of FI cars for a while. Here is what I have seen. Even the most well thought out and expensive builds have some "bugs" to get worked out. However the guys who are trying to make as much as possible with as little as possible are the ones who have "problems" all the time and thereafter. So I say if you want a DD boosted car. 1, Keep it simple and street reasonable. 2, Pay for the good parts now so it won't slow you down later. Just my .02
I agree with the Overbuild & Understress theory, but I'll also add in another couple things:
- With all the current computer controls, the ability to collect good data (what's going on in your motor) and do something with the data (like shut the motor down, or retard the timing) is king on an FI setup. For example, I know that detonation kills a lot of FI setups, so I added into my ignition setup the J&S Safeguard Knock Controller, which is better at detecting true knock and will retard only the cylinder that knocked, next time around. I also have the dashboard gauge so I can see when and how much knock it is detecting and correcting for. Another must-have is a wideband O2 controller, preferably with feedback to your ECU and maybe a gauge.
- You must be willing to hang up your pride and shut down the motor anytime you hear, see or smell something odd, even if you are in the middle of the race of your life. You can not treat your FI setup like an Old School carb, like "just keep your foot in it and blow out the problem", or you'll kill you motor in a heartbeat. I know more people that didn't listen to their motor or gauges and caused a problem to be a bad problem.
- Learn how your systems work, because there are plenty of people out there that will say they know your exact setup but don't. Maybe they worked on one EFI Honda 2 years ago, or even a different EFI car, but they don't know your car or setup. And without the knowledge you won't know when they are bullshitting you.
Jim
My Site: http://home.mindspring.com/~jim_fisk/id1.html
- With all the current computer controls, the ability to collect good data (what's going on in your motor) and do something with the data (like shut the motor down, or retard the timing) is king on an FI setup. For example, I know that detonation kills a lot of FI setups, so I added into my ignition setup the J&S Safeguard Knock Controller, which is better at detecting true knock and will retard only the cylinder that knocked, next time around. I also have the dashboard gauge so I can see when and how much knock it is detecting and correcting for. Another must-have is a wideband O2 controller, preferably with feedback to your ECU and maybe a gauge.
- You must be willing to hang up your pride and shut down the motor anytime you hear, see or smell something odd, even if you are in the middle of the race of your life. You can not treat your FI setup like an Old School carb, like "just keep your foot in it and blow out the problem", or you'll kill you motor in a heartbeat. I know more people that didn't listen to their motor or gauges and caused a problem to be a bad problem.
- Learn how your systems work, because there are plenty of people out there that will say they know your exact setup but don't. Maybe they worked on one EFI Honda 2 years ago, or even a different EFI car, but they don't know your car or setup. And without the knowledge you won't know when they are bullshitting you.
Jim
My Site: http://home.mindspring.com/~jim_fisk/id1.html
Originally Posted by 2000 Tran Zam
Not true at all. I had spent all the money on the most expensive parts and they still fail. Maybe its just bad luck, maybe Im an idiot when it comes to maintenence and keeping an eye on things, but I just have had bad luck with my car...
Originally Posted by Dragframe
It just kinda goes this way with some people and some cars. **** happens... but what kinda power were you making?
**** sucks, lol.
This is the dyno graph when i was running 13.5 lbs of boost with my exhuast on. I ran 15.5 or so lbs on 91 with open downpipe...
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Originally Posted by 2000 Tran Zam
893 rwhp and 903 rwtq.
**** sucks, lol.
This is the dyno graph when i was running 13.5 lbs of boost with my exhuast on. I ran 15.5 or so lbs on 91 with open downpipe...
**** sucks, lol.
This is the dyno graph when i was running 13.5 lbs of boost with my exhuast on. I ran 15.5 or so lbs on 91 with open downpipe...
Yeah... i can kinda understand the problems then. That is a lot of power.
BOSS APPROVED!
Originally Posted by my01ws6
I would be happy with 550rwhp!
I do the same thing when I watch Deal or No Deal. "I'd settle if I had over $100k." NO I WOULDN'T! I could have a $600k offer with 1 million and .01 on the board and I would say no deal.
