Another aps build happening now..
10-18-2008, 11:06 PM
#61
More questions..should I put antisieze on the studs on the heads to hold the exhaust manifolds on the exhaust manifolds to turbo connection studs and on the turbo to downpipe studs? The studs are stainless so maybe thats why don't need any antisieze?
No mention in the instructions. Thought pretty much anything like that that goes into aluiminum head or get suject to very high heat should have antisieze on it??
Still waiting for answer on if you all are putting coolant lines into the holes closest to the oil return on the rhs turbo. ?
And did any of you have to tap out thread on the turbos?
No mention in the instructions. Thought pretty much anything like that that goes into aluiminum head or get suject to very high heat should have antisieze on it??
Still waiting for answer on if you all are putting coolant lines into the holes closest to the oil return on the rhs turbo. ?
And did any of you have to tap out thread on the turbos?
Last edited by MY99TAWS6; 10-19-2008 at 06:52 PM.
10-19-2008, 06:58 PM
#62
Ok ..today was decent for progress. With help of master mechanic worked on the 408. Triple checking stuff..head stud torque..then installed the yella terra rockers. Worked on front timing cover as it needed a bit of clearancing ,actually clearanced oil pump. It hit cover slightly .Its slp pump with slp double roller timing chain set.
Also have space up windage tray slightly due to bigger arp main studs.Used unibit as some holes were a bit too small for the bigger studs. Connecting rod bolts were hitting the windage tray.
Easy fix just some washers and should good to go.Maybe have to bend pickup bracket slightly and will triple check pickup to pan clearance .
We are being thorough not rushing just to finish the car and then have problems. Likely have some shakedown /problems anyway but well one does what one can.
Be working on the turbo assemblies tonite. So still need your opiinions of should use antiseize on the studs . With them being stainless maybe not necessary. Especially if antisieze might make them loosen up.
On car again tommorrow. Hoping to finally button up bottom end so can take engine off stand, put on new kmember ,bolt on clutch ,tranny and get that stuff into car.
Install going a bit slower than hoped but doing a new motor not just the turbo install.
On a positive note those downpipes sure look pretty!
Also have space up windage tray slightly due to bigger arp main studs.Used unibit as some holes were a bit too small for the bigger studs. Connecting rod bolts were hitting the windage tray.
Easy fix just some washers and should good to go.Maybe have to bend pickup bracket slightly and will triple check pickup to pan clearance .
We are being thorough not rushing just to finish the car and then have problems. Likely have some shakedown /problems anyway but well one does what one can.
Be working on the turbo assemblies tonite. So still need your opiinions of should use antiseize on the studs . With them being stainless maybe not necessary. Especially if antisieze might make them loosen up.
On car again tommorrow. Hoping to finally button up bottom end so can take engine off stand, put on new kmember ,bolt on clutch ,tranny and get that stuff into car.
Install going a bit slower than hoped but doing a new motor not just the turbo install.
On a positive note those downpipes sure look pretty!
10-19-2008, 10:41 PM
#63
Well talked to few knowledgeable people and they said antisieze with stainless studs still good idea. So applying it to exhaust studs, turbo to exhaust studs, turbo to downpipe studs.
And seems that both those ports front and back on the 20gs are water and they are both ok. actually you can run the 20gs without water they sell them in housings with oil only and with oil and water both. Its good idea I guess to run the extra cooling especially if they are pushed hard. Its not uncommon on dsms to run these at 25 to 30psi . As said they are usually very very reliable turbos.
Did a bit more tonite putting studs in the turbos and assembling the downpipes and gates. Almost bolted the downpipes to the turbos then remembered you need to use rtv! APS should make some gaskets for the exhaust man to turbos and for the turbos to the downpipes.RTV might work but gasket is faster and neater. I would pay a bit for the proper gaskets and actually wondering if there is standard size for the exhaust to the turbo currently on the market..course shortly will be in the car anyway so be too loate. Not taking them out to install gaskets right now but might take them out to upgrade them like Kwikkar did maybe over next winter. Hopefully they work good until then.
Here are pics of the downpipes and gates assembled and yeah have a few bolts to tighten down won't forget..
Oh and buddy with 3000 gt said there are torque specs for the oil feed on the mits turbos. I am getting some off him. And he also said that on his car the mits turbos are taken to 100psi no restrictors with no problems apparently.
I am still planning to run my non high pressure slp spring. Figure still good enough.
More updates tommorrow..
And seems that both those ports front and back on the 20gs are water and they are both ok. actually you can run the 20gs without water they sell them in housings with oil only and with oil and water both. Its good idea I guess to run the extra cooling especially if they are pushed hard. Its not uncommon on dsms to run these at 25 to 30psi . As said they are usually very very reliable turbos.
Did a bit more tonite putting studs in the turbos and assembling the downpipes and gates. Almost bolted the downpipes to the turbos then remembered you need to use rtv! APS should make some gaskets for the exhaust man to turbos and for the turbos to the downpipes.RTV might work but gasket is faster and neater. I would pay a bit for the proper gaskets and actually wondering if there is standard size for the exhaust to the turbo currently on the market..course shortly will be in the car anyway so be too loate. Not taking them out to install gaskets right now but might take them out to upgrade them like Kwikkar did maybe over next winter. Hopefully they work good until then.
Here are pics of the downpipes and gates assembled and yeah have a few bolts to tighten down won't forget..
Oh and buddy with 3000 gt said there are torque specs for the oil feed on the mits turbos. I am getting some off him. And he also said that on his car the mits turbos are taken to 100psi no restrictors with no problems apparently.
I am still planning to run my non high pressure slp spring. Figure still good enough.
More updates tommorrow..
10-20-2008, 06:38 PM
#64
Ok another good day I think. 408 is pretty much done now. Today modified windage tray ,just used some washers to clear the rod bolts. We elongated some holes with a unibit yesterday as the arp studs are bigger than stock. Was missing arp nuts they are 10 by 1.25 fine pitch.
So windage done we tweaked pickup just a bit. We elongated hole again with unibit ,hole that goes into windage tray stud and we bent the pickup just slightly so there was no tension on the 0 ring. We installed the oring side first and then tightened down the stud nut just to again make sure we had no problems. My pickup used the black o ring in the slp kit.
Then we put on front cover after putting in new seal. We put on asp balancer it went on easy with some antisieze and the longer arp balancer bolt. Torqued it to 200 ft pounds and called it a day. Used red loctite on that one too.
Then back cover was installed,then oil pan. Checking all those fussy gm clearances with feeler gauges and straight edge.
We took our time not a race. Had master mechanic helping me out. Very lucky to have that guy helping me.
So only have intake to bolt onto engine..like 5 minute job with engine sitting on the stand. Not so fun with engine in the car!
Could bolt on a few brackets but can do that when am putting engine on the new kmember .So plans are tommorrow to work on stripping and getting the new bmr kmember ready and then of course have to bolt tranny and clutch back on.
Also working on the turbo assemblies. Wanted to ceramic coat those aps exhaust manifolds should have sent them out months ago but now coating shop is at least 10 days behind so think will have to install kit without coating. I could maybe try 1200 degree paint for now not sure how that would hold up.
I am trying my best to finish my build in next few weeks. Otherwise its pushed to spring and I want my car together before then.
Shame no one can ceramic coat in my city.
So windage done we tweaked pickup just a bit. We elongated hole again with unibit ,hole that goes into windage tray stud and we bent the pickup just slightly so there was no tension on the 0 ring. We installed the oring side first and then tightened down the stud nut just to again make sure we had no problems. My pickup used the black o ring in the slp kit.
Then we put on front cover after putting in new seal. We put on asp balancer it went on easy with some antisieze and the longer arp balancer bolt. Torqued it to 200 ft pounds and called it a day. Used red loctite on that one too.
Then back cover was installed,then oil pan. Checking all those fussy gm clearances with feeler gauges and straight edge.
We took our time not a race. Had master mechanic helping me out. Very lucky to have that guy helping me.
So only have intake to bolt onto engine..like 5 minute job with engine sitting on the stand. Not so fun with engine in the car!
Could bolt on a few brackets but can do that when am putting engine on the new kmember .So plans are tommorrow to work on stripping and getting the new bmr kmember ready and then of course have to bolt tranny and clutch back on.
Also working on the turbo assemblies. Wanted to ceramic coat those aps exhaust manifolds should have sent them out months ago but now coating shop is at least 10 days behind so think will have to install kit without coating. I could maybe try 1200 degree paint for now not sure how that would hold up.
I am trying my best to finish my build in next few weeks. Otherwise its pushed to spring and I want my car together before then.
Shame no one can ceramic coat in my city.
10-21-2008, 12:16 PM
#65
Ok couple things..I was having some problems I thought with threading in the fittings on the rhs turbo.I figured out that was for some dumb reason trying to thread the wrong end of the straight coolant fitting into their. Didn't hurt anything but turned fitting proper way and it went in fine. Also figured out that both ports are coolant ports and either is fine. In fact the mits 20gs come with just oil housings if you want so the water cooling is not really necessary but still nice to run if you have the housing with the option like these aps turbos do.
So just tightening up the last things on the turbo assemblies. Most of today will likely be spent on kmember prep. Tearing off the stuff on the old one and moving things to the new one.
Will take some pics later on today.
So just tightening up the last things on the turbo assemblies. Most of today will likely be spent on kmember prep. Tearing off the stuff on the old one and moving things to the new one.
Will take some pics later on today.
10-21-2008, 06:46 PM
#66
Ok another good day of progress with help again today.
We doublenutted exhaust studs so they don't work themselves out of the heads. We put on water pump,intake, valve covers, coil packs.air compressor bracket.All torqued to spec.. Still deciding if going to drill and tap third bolt alternator hole. Its pretty solid with two bolts but three would be better and factory has 4 but 4 is not really doable unless maybe weld a nut to the block for that one. I think three would be lots.
We are now tearing apart the kmember and should have that done by maybe tonite or tommorrow sometime. That new bmr is right one and it is pretty darn light compared to the stock ones. I should buy the matching a arms sometime save a bit more weight.
Also have pretty much finished the turbo assemblies . Can final mount them on the engine shortly and hook up all the oil and water lines.
So shortly should be moving engine to the ground on the k member and putting trans and clutch back on. Don't want to say a certain day for the engine to be back in the car but its pretty close now. Within a week is a reasonable guess.
Its is slightly tempting to just throw the 408 in Na and go dyno it but those turbo exhausts are not going to flow that good off boost I don't think and its 9.5 to 1 compression and a fairly mild cam . Would think it would still make 525 to maybe 550 engine hp? the way it is now.. The engine was of course set up for boost. So take a bit longer and get engine in with the turbos.No more fracking around...
Still a few weeks maybe left before serious winter.
Going to take a couple more pics later and then will post them .Some good progress now in these pics.
And decided to paint the exhaust manifolds for now with 1200 degree and see how they stand up. They are wrapped in heat shielding anyway.
Can always do the ceramic thing over next winter when likely would send away my lsx intake and get some stuff powdercoated.
We doublenutted exhaust studs so they don't work themselves out of the heads. We put on water pump,intake, valve covers, coil packs.air compressor bracket.All torqued to spec.. Still deciding if going to drill and tap third bolt alternator hole. Its pretty solid with two bolts but three would be better and factory has 4 but 4 is not really doable unless maybe weld a nut to the block for that one. I think three would be lots.
We are now tearing apart the kmember and should have that done by maybe tonite or tommorrow sometime. That new bmr is right one and it is pretty darn light compared to the stock ones. I should buy the matching a arms sometime save a bit more weight.
Also have pretty much finished the turbo assemblies . Can final mount them on the engine shortly and hook up all the oil and water lines.
So shortly should be moving engine to the ground on the k member and putting trans and clutch back on. Don't want to say a certain day for the engine to be back in the car but its pretty close now. Within a week is a reasonable guess.
Its is slightly tempting to just throw the 408 in Na and go dyno it but those turbo exhausts are not going to flow that good off boost I don't think and its 9.5 to 1 compression and a fairly mild cam . Would think it would still make 525 to maybe 550 engine hp? the way it is now.. The engine was of course set up for boost. So take a bit longer and get engine in with the turbos.No more fracking around...
Still a few weeks maybe left before serious winter.
Going to take a couple more pics later and then will post them .Some good progress now in these pics.
And decided to paint the exhaust manifolds for now with 1200 degree and see how they stand up. They are wrapped in heat shielding anyway.
Can always do the ceramic thing over next winter when likely would send away my lsx intake and get some stuff powdercoated.
10-21-2008, 09:28 PM
#67
The yella terras..
Drivers side turbo hanging out..
408 done ready for install...
install still a bit away have to put trans and clutch on and bolt both turbos, hook up lines then drop car on the trans and engine just like how took it out.
Tearing the old kmember apart
New k member waiting for stuff off old kmember..wish I could afford some a arms right now...those stock parts are big and heavy!
Drivers side turbo hanging out..
408 done ready for install...
install still a bit away have to put trans and clutch on and bolt both turbos, hook up lines then drop car on the trans and engine just like how took it out.
Tearing the old kmember apart
New k member waiting for stuff off old kmember..wish I could afford some a arms right now...those stock parts are big and heavy!
10-22-2008, 12:55 PM
#70
Thanks....
Miniupdate.
New Bmr kmember is all ready to drop engine onto. Actually pretty easy really
stripping it down today wasn't hard at all but pb blaster is your friend..! And just finished up some little things on motor ,installed the 60 pound injectors.
Buddy painted up my exhaust manifolds with 1200 degree ceramic paint so see how that holds up can still get them properly done and actual ceramic coated next year.
More pics later..
Miniupdate.
New Bmr kmember is all ready to drop engine onto. Actually pretty easy really
stripping it down today wasn't hard at all but pb blaster is your friend..! And just finished up some little things on motor ,installed the 60 pound injectors.
Buddy painted up my exhaust manifolds with 1200 degree ceramic paint so see how that holds up can still get them properly done and actual ceramic coated next year.
More pics later..
Last edited by MY99TAWS6; 10-22-2008 at 07:47 PM.
10-22-2008, 05:47 PM
#71
Ok good morning of work..
60 pound injectors and fuel rail are in.Stock rail temporarily.
New k member is ready for the engine to go on it. Also since had it out put on my new stainless earls front brake lines at same time.
Also think will install my slp line lock as have to bleed the front brakes anyway now.
We test fit the turbo oil and water lines and one water line is being modified as the 408 block has coolant feed in different place from the 346. No big deal.Get that done at like aeroquip place . Also drilling out third hole for alternator feel better with three bolts instead of just two. Just have to drill and tap it the boss is already there.
Buddy painted up the exhaust manifolds with 1200 degree for now.They look really good and if they don't hold up just do them in ceramic next season or whatever.
Tommorrows plans are to put the engine on the kmember and put the clutch and tranny on. After that its reinstall engine in car time. Maybe tommorrow maybe friday.Would think Friday latest.
But still be a few days after that to finish it up. Have to rehook stuff in the car which should go really quick but have to still do that whole front end intercooler install and put in all those intercooler and inlet pipes. Could be pretty tight in there for clearance.
But seeing the end of the tunnel here guys!
So would say am now about 60% to 70% done.
Go out and take some pics of the kmember installed and the twin turbos on the engine. DAMN I AM GETTING REALLY EXCITED NOW!
60 pound injectors and fuel rail are in.Stock rail temporarily.
New k member is ready for the engine to go on it. Also since had it out put on my new stainless earls front brake lines at same time.
Also think will install my slp line lock as have to bleed the front brakes anyway now.
We test fit the turbo oil and water lines and one water line is being modified as the 408 block has coolant feed in different place from the 346. No big deal.Get that done at like aeroquip place . Also drilling out third hole for alternator feel better with three bolts instead of just two. Just have to drill and tap it the boss is already there.
Buddy painted up the exhaust manifolds with 1200 degree for now.They look really good and if they don't hold up just do them in ceramic next season or whatever.
Tommorrows plans are to put the engine on the kmember and put the clutch and tranny on. After that its reinstall engine in car time. Maybe tommorrow maybe friday.Would think Friday latest.
But still be a few days after that to finish it up. Have to rehook stuff in the car which should go really quick but have to still do that whole front end intercooler install and put in all those intercooler and inlet pipes. Could be pretty tight in there for clearance.
But seeing the end of the tunnel here guys!
So would say am now about 60% to 70% done.
Go out and take some pics of the kmember installed and the twin turbos on the engine. DAMN I AM GETTING REALLY EXCITED NOW!
10-23-2008, 09:34 AM
#75
Supposed to be working on car with buddy this morning. Hoping to get the engine clutch and trans together on the a frame and hopefully install them in car tommorrow.
Will pull front end off car pretty quickly once engine and trans are back in so can also start doing the needed mods for the intercooler.
Should come together pretty quickly now. Not afraid to pull some late nighters hell maybe an all nighter to get this thing finished up.
Will pull front end off car pretty quickly once engine and trans are back in so can also start doing the needed mods for the intercooler.
Should come together pretty quickly now. Not afraid to pull some late nighters hell maybe an all nighter to get this thing finished up.
10-23-2008, 04:20 PM
#76
Update..Worked on it this morning .Mostly doing a few little things. We drilled and tapped for third alternator bolt as it wasn't drilled on the 408 but at least was there .
The fourth bolt could only work if maybe a person welded a nut on the block but think three will be sufficient.
Also had to modify that one drivers side coolant line as the 408 coolant block plug was behind the motor mount not in front of it so the aps supplied fitting wasn't too great and wanted it perfect so just put new adjustable end on the one line and shortened it down a bit.
Then spent an hour or so wrapping the exhaust manifold heat shields and fixing them down and then putting the exhaust manifold on to the turbo and the turbo onto the downpipe/wastegate assembly. APS should make and supply gaskets for these assemblies so you don't have to mess with messy rtv. Rtv might work but its not as quick and clean as a gasket. Maybe the gasket from turbo to exhaust is standard ?
Plan on working for several hours after supper and hope to get enigne on k and trans and clutch attached. Then unless that stuff goes super quick will install it in car most likel tommorrow.
Few days from completion.
The fourth bolt could only work if maybe a person welded a nut on the block but think three will be sufficient.
Also had to modify that one drivers side coolant line as the 408 coolant block plug was behind the motor mount not in front of it so the aps supplied fitting wasn't too great and wanted it perfect so just put new adjustable end on the one line and shortened it down a bit.
Then spent an hour or so wrapping the exhaust manifold heat shields and fixing them down and then putting the exhaust manifold on to the turbo and the turbo onto the downpipe/wastegate assembly. APS should make and supply gaskets for these assemblies so you don't have to mess with messy rtv. Rtv might work but its not as quick and clean as a gasket. Maybe the gasket from turbo to exhaust is standard ?
Plan on working for several hours after supper and hope to get enigne on k and trans and clutch attached. Then unless that stuff goes super quick will install it in car most likel tommorrow.
Few days from completion.
10-23-2008, 04:51 PM
#78
No was going to do that shortly likely after supper.
We clocked it like they showed in the manual the 2mm thing. Not sure why that was necessary maybe for the inlet tube?? or maybe just so we could get the oil fitting and the last bolt on the turbo to exhaust manifold on there.. Wonder if we can get to the vband to loosen it if necessary once its in the car??
Oh also with your sway bar fix do you have stock sway bar or aftermarket bigger one?
Also asked a few people if they notice much vibration from the poly motor mounts? I am not a big fan of vibration and harshess so hoping it won't be very noticeable?
I also have spohn body mount torque arm which people say can be bad to put on in terms of noise and stuff. I did get the street type front bushing..?? .If don't like it then guess get a tranny crossmember type as can't connect torque arm to planned 4l80 tranny directly anyway nor would I want to.
Taking off the bumper cover sounds a bit annoying..lots of hidden bolts on it?
We at least have access to cutting tools maybe even a plasma cutter which might be handy for the bumper support modding?
This install just seems to go on and on and on..
We clocked it like they showed in the manual the 2mm thing. Not sure why that was necessary maybe for the inlet tube?? or maybe just so we could get the oil fitting and the last bolt on the turbo to exhaust manifold on there.. Wonder if we can get to the vband to loosen it if necessary once its in the car??
Oh also with your sway bar fix do you have stock sway bar or aftermarket bigger one?
Also asked a few people if they notice much vibration from the poly motor mounts? I am not a big fan of vibration and harshess so hoping it won't be very noticeable?
I also have spohn body mount torque arm which people say can be bad to put on in terms of noise and stuff. I did get the street type front bushing..?? .If don't like it then guess get a tranny crossmember type as can't connect torque arm to planned 4l80 tranny directly anyway nor would I want to.
Taking off the bumper cover sounds a bit annoying..lots of hidden bolts on it?
We at least have access to cutting tools maybe even a plasma cutter which might be handy for the bumper support modding?
This install just seems to go on and on and on..
10-23-2008, 08:03 PM
#79
Launching!
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Yeah, make sure you check the passenger side turbo for hose clearance through the k-member. I had to clock mine the the side alittle more to alow for the silicon hose not to lay against the k-member.
10-24-2008, 02:34 AM
#80
Ok another bunch of hours into this car. So flywheel on.. Tex twin back on.
Tranny on. turbos fully on with lines hooked up ,dowpipes,etc.
Whole assembly ,engine,trans and turbos on kmember ready for install. And yeah did have to clock that turbo a bit to get it between the kmember.
So pretty much tommorrow should be install in the car day. Then be working 24/7 to finish it.
Tranny on. turbos fully on with lines hooked up ,dowpipes,etc.
Whole assembly ,engine,trans and turbos on kmember ready for install. And yeah did have to clock that turbo a bit to get it between the kmember.
So pretty much tommorrow should be install in the car day. Then be working 24/7 to finish it.