Switchgrass ethanol
TECH Regular
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 411
Likes: 1
From: Louisville KY
He's right about the btu.
gas is around 110,000 and e85 is around 75,000 but dont forget the stoich afr is 6 or 7 so even though is has less btu per gallon you burn more of it per unit of air. This causes 25% worse MPG, a little more overall hp, and a big reduction in intake air temp, plus the ability to use very high compression, higher boost, more timing because of the 105 octane.
And why is this in the 2010 camaro section?
gas is around 110,000 and e85 is around 75,000 but dont forget the stoich afr is 6 or 7 so even though is has less btu per gallon you burn more of it per unit of air. This causes 25% worse MPG, a little more overall hp, and a big reduction in intake air temp, plus the ability to use very high compression, higher boost, more timing because of the 105 octane.
And why is this in the 2010 camaro section?
He's right about the btu.
gas is around 110,000 and e85 is around 75,000 but dont forget the stoich afr is 6 or 7 so even though is has less btu per gallon you burn more of it per unit of air. This causes 25% worse MPG, a little more overall hp, and a big reduction in intake air temp, plus the ability to use very high compression, higher boost, more timing because of the 105 octane.
And why is this in the 2010 camaro section?
gas is around 110,000 and e85 is around 75,000 but dont forget the stoich afr is 6 or 7 so even though is has less btu per gallon you burn more of it per unit of air. This causes 25% worse MPG, a little more overall hp, and a big reduction in intake air temp, plus the ability to use very high compression, higher boost, more timing because of the 105 octane.
And why is this in the 2010 camaro section?
Idk, lol.
TECH Enthusiast
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 596
Likes: 0
From: Toledo, Ohio
Ethanol has less BTU/unit compared to Gasoline, but really that shouldn't stop us from using it. The high octane-equivalent of ethanol helps to offset the loss in BTU content by allowing higher compression, more efficient engines, and for FI engines higher boost levels. This also helps with fuel economy. An engine built specifically for ethanol will rival a gasoline engine in the MPG department.
The faster that this Switchgrass ethanol comes out, the better off the US will be after oil production declines. I really hope this process can be perfected. It takes the strain off the Corn industry and should bring prices back down.
The faster that this Switchgrass ethanol comes out, the better off the US will be after oil production declines. I really hope this process can be perfected. It takes the strain off the Corn industry and should bring prices back down.
my dad just sold some corn for $5.00 a bushel
I don't think no-ag people can quite grasp what that means. My father is a modest penny pinching guy and says he is making more money than he can spend right now. Land prices have also skyrocketed over the past few years due to corn/crop prices. 10 years ago land was around 2000/acre, now its closer to 5 or 6k. This in turn means land rent is up around $250/acre, double what it was a few years ago. just me babbling, but some intereting info related to how ethonal is effecting farming.
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Corvette Racing is switching exclusively to E85 for the 2008 season.
http://www.corvetteracing.com/histor.../racing1.shtml
More food for thought! (and less food for us since most of this stuff comes from corn for now...)
http://www.corvetteracing.com/histor.../racing1.shtml
More food for thought! (and less food for us since most of this stuff comes from corn for now...)
It all comes down to production and availability. I'm all in favor of running E85 exclusively and keeping the $ stateside. We have the land, manpower, resources, and demand for it. It's not only good for business and gearheads, but it's good for the environment as well.
I know it's not a capitalistic thing to say but I hope that when E85 becomes more used than gasoline (just a matter of time) that price gouging, etc. will be a thing of the past.
Yes, MPG will suffer with E85 but if it's priced in a way that $ per Mile is similar or lower than with 93 octane, I will be happy.
I know it's not a capitalistic thing to say but I hope that when E85 becomes more used than gasoline (just a matter of time) that price gouging, etc. will be a thing of the past.
Yes, MPG will suffer with E85 but if it's priced in a way that $ per Mile is similar or lower than with 93 octane, I will be happy.
TECH Apprentice
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 338
Likes: 0
The MPG decrese doesn't matter. Once our production system was fully operational, E85 would be a good deal cheaper than gasoline. Brazil is ethanol dependant and their production is so advanced that they can compete with galine prices even if the crude oil price is $40 a barrell. That is no joke. The fact is it may make land more expensive, but it will plummit the price of oil, which is used for everything.
It all comes down to production and availability. I'm all in favor of running E85 exclusively and keeping the $ stateside. We have the land, manpower, resources, and demand for it. It's not only good for business and gearheads, but it's good for the environment as well.
I know it's not a capitalistic thing to say but I hope that when E85 becomes more used than gasoline (just a matter of time) that price gouging, etc. will be a thing of the past.
Yes, MPG will suffer with E85 but if it's priced in a way that $ per Mile is similar or lower than with 93 octane, I will be happy.
I know it's not a capitalistic thing to say but I hope that when E85 becomes more used than gasoline (just a matter of time) that price gouging, etc. will be a thing of the past.
Yes, MPG will suffer with E85 but if it's priced in a way that $ per Mile is similar or lower than with 93 octane, I will be happy.
Switchgrass is a great alternative to corn, but it still won't be enough to provide all cars with e85.
TECH Fanatic
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,207
Likes: 0
From: New Braunfels, TX
are you kidding? we don't have the land or rescources for E85. WE don't have the land to supply all E10. If every single acre of land in the US was used for corn production, it still wouldn't be enough.
Switchgrass is a great alternative to corn, but it still won't be enough to provide all cars with e85.
Switchgrass is a great alternative to corn, but it still won't be enough to provide all cars with e85.
It all comes down to production and availability. I'm all in favor of running E85 exclusively and keeping the $ stateside. We have the land, manpower, resources, and demand for it. It's not only good for business and gearheads, but it's good for the environment as well.
I know it's not a capitalistic thing to say but I hope that when E85 becomes more used than gasoline (just a matter of time) that price gouging, etc. will be a thing of the past.
Yes, MPG will suffer with E85 but if it's priced in a way that $ per Mile is similar or lower than with 93 octane, I will be happy.
I know it's not a capitalistic thing to say but I hope that when E85 becomes more used than gasoline (just a matter of time) that price gouging, etc. will be a thing of the past.
Yes, MPG will suffer with E85 but if it's priced in a way that $ per Mile is similar or lower than with 93 octane, I will be happy.
The MPG decrese doesn't matter. Once our production system was fully operational, E85 would be a good deal cheaper than gasoline. Brazil is ethanol dependant and their production is so advanced that they can compete with galine prices even if the crude oil price is $40 a barrell. That is no joke. The fact is it may make land more expensive, but it will plummit the price of oil, which is used for everything.
this is kinda exciting... they recently dug up a sunoco near me, switched out the tanks, did all the stuff... i was thinkign maybe we would see some E85... as they have it here but not for the public, only for like state vehicles or something... they got it back up... and they had put in Diesel... 
stupid diesel all not high octane and such...
but back on topic it would be great if they got this going, especially with the new s/c corvette and any possiblities of forced induction applications on the new camaro coming up... could be alot of fun!
stupid diesel all not high octane and such... but back on topic it would be great if they got this going, especially with the new s/c corvette and any possiblities of forced induction applications on the new camaro coming up... could be alot of fun!
It could be accomplished with subterranean farms with additional decks built above each piece of land. Light would come from metal halide or similar fixtures. Since grass requires only shallow dirt, this would be easily doable. Think of it like giant parking garages, but with soil instead of concrete and cars.
10-20 story parking garage type facilities, with sprinkler type irrigation and
optimal grass growing conditions ,using artificial uv lighting,
if the pet shop uv lamps can grow "grass" in a closet
i dont see y they cant work for switchass grass in a manufactured optimal enviroment. who needs farms??
when there is technology and bright minds
thats not a bad idea at all,
10-20 story parking garage type facilities, with sprinkler type irrigation and
optimal grass growing conditions ,using artificial uv lighting,
if the pet shop uv lamps can grow "grass" in a closet
i dont see y they cant work for switchass grass in a manufactured optimal enviroment. who needs farms??
when there is technology and bright minds
10-20 story parking garage type facilities, with sprinkler type irrigation and
optimal grass growing conditions ,using artificial uv lighting,
if the pet shop uv lamps can grow "grass" in a closet
i dont see y they cant work for switchass grass in a manufactured optimal enviroment. who needs farms??
when there is technology and bright minds
It could be accomplished with subterranean farms with additional decks built above each piece of land. Light would come from metal halide or similar fixtures. Since grass requires only shallow dirt, this would be easily doable. Think of it like giant parking garages, but with soil instead of concrete and cars.
you have to be kidding. your going to build thousands of square miles of 'parking garages'??
interesting idea, but not at ALL feasilbe.