LS Engines
03-06-2019, 09:08 AM
#21
The more control amazon takes of the online market, the higher their prices will go. They put smaller online shopping stores out of business constantly by either buying them out or setting their prices so low to take them out. Once competition dwindles their prices go on quite the rise. I've noticed this often lately, many things that use to be cheap, their prices are on the rise.
We are lucky to have so many places to look, so look and try to shop elsewhere other then the massive online giant amazon to keep it that way. Keep other online stores in business. It's the same logic that applies to our local stores and businesses.
We are lucky to have so many places to look, so look and try to shop elsewhere other then the massive online giant amazon to keep it that way. Keep other online stores in business. It's the same logic that applies to our local stores and businesses.
03-06-2019, 09:43 AM
#23
TECH Resident
there is truth to this as well as not 100% truthful. amazon actually has a lot of "small businesses" inside of its market, and walmart.com has started this as well. basically if you made little camaro keychains, you could sell them on the amazon store. so if you were to say be forced to close the doors of your craft business, you could essentially open an amazon store and sell all your crafts there for people to buy online without the massive overhead of running an actual business......**** i know a business that operates basically out of a storage unit, they have like 4 or 5 employees and basically buy massive amounts of little memory cards for your camera and other types of usb storage devices. then just sells them on amazon. they buy a ton of these, then they make 60 pound boxes and ships them to amazon fulfillment where they then ship them out individually. so you are correct that amazon messes up mom and pop shops, but mom and pop could then just sell nationwide on amazon. just the way things are. i do believe in avoiding amazon and if i dont need it in 2 days i try my best to order it elsewhere. however shipping on a manifold/catalytic converter did force me to order from them recently, but then i just returned it anyway.
03-06-2019, 10:13 AM
#25
there is truth to this as well as not 100% truthful. amazon actually has a lot of "small businesses" inside of its market, and walmart.com has started this as well. basically if you made little camaro keychains, you could sell them on the amazon store. so if you were to say be forced to close the doors of your craft business, you could essentially open an amazon store and sell all your crafts there for people to buy online without the massive overhead of running an actual business......**** i know a business that operates basically out of a storage unit, they have like 4 or 5 employees and basically buy massive amounts of little memory cards for your camera and other types of usb storage devices. then just sells them on amazon. they buy a ton of these, then they make 60 pound boxes and ships them to amazon fulfillment where they then ship them out individually. so you are correct that amazon messes up mom and pop shops, but mom and pop could then just sell nationwide on amazon. just the way things are. i do believe in avoiding amazon and if i dont need it in 2 days i try my best to order it elsewhere. however shipping on a manifold/catalytic converter did force me to order from them recently, but then i just returned it anyway.
I do occasionally use amazon to purchase as well. But its definitely not my automatic go-to every time I make online purchases (like my wife
). I mostly use amazon to compare prices but usually purchase elsewhere, and try to "shockingly" physically huff my *** to the store to purchase anything I can locally.
03-06-2019, 10:30 AM
#26
They've been caught recently tracking the top selling products from their marketplace and then selling it directly at a lower price to undercut the outside seller. As soon as they see a trendy product making money they try to steal the market on it. Even when you sell on Amazon you're directly competing with Amazon.
03-06-2019, 10:57 AM
#29
we will hit amazon where it hurts.....shipping....i think ups recently began charging them a little more. i know they used to allow them 3 pickup attempts on amazon returns, now its once and done and they leave the label and say deal with it yourself. thats started after amazon said they were goona begin delivering themselves.
03-06-2019, 11:31 AM
#30
Is there any other name for the LS engine? Out of the 4 national auto parts stores none seem to know what an LS is. I walk in asking for, e.g. a set of head gaskets for an 04 & up LS6. I get this blank stare and the next question is "What's it in?" Knowing it will do no good I toy with them and tell them it's in a 57 Chevy Bel Air. About half will start to look it up while the other half will immediately tell me their book doesn't go back that far! I then tell them it didn't come in the 57 chevy and that it is an 04 & later GM Engine (again). They then ask me "What did it come out of"? I tell them it came out of a Crate from GM! At this point they are lost and I'm frustrated. About 4 out of 5 auto parts clerks don't even know what an LS Engine is! OCCASIONALLY if the manager is around he will admit that he has heard of them but can't look anything up because there are no listings for any LS Engines.
I thought these were one of the most popular GM engines to date. They come in Family cars, Luxury cars, Sports cars, Lite Trucks, Motorhomes, Planes, Boats and I'm sure there are more out there that I'm unaware of. They're being snatched up for conversions quicker than GM can make 'em & we can wreck 'em! SO, why is the internet the only place you can find listings for an LS engine?
I thought these were one of the most popular GM engines to date. They come in Family cars, Luxury cars, Sports cars, Lite Trucks, Motorhomes, Planes, Boats and I'm sure there are more out there that I'm unaware of. They're being snatched up for conversions quicker than GM can make 'em & we can wreck 'em! SO, why is the internet the only place you can find listings for an LS engine?
You also have to understand that the term "LS" or "LSx" is a somewhat inaccurate terminology that's used primarily in online forums or by DIY'ers and general automotive enthusiasts. The term "LS" or "LSx" is a general term used to describe any GM engine that's derived from the LS1's design. However, the term is inaccurate and way too broad in its usage. The name "LS1" is an RPO code (regular production option) used when placing orders for GM vehicles by dealerships. The 2003 5.3L truck engine is often referred to as an LS engine even though their actual RPO code is LM7. The LM7 for example is basically an iron block version of the LS1 and they have quite a bit of parts compatibility. You can put LM7 (5.3L) truck engine heads on an LS1 (5.7L) engine if you wanted to and some people do in fact, do just that. An LQ4 is a iron block 6.0L engine that's a variant of the LS2, which is itself derived from the LS1. Saying "LS" or "LSx" is easier when talking to other car guys than diving into specifics about what engine it really is. In essence, its short hand for any given LS1 or its descendants similar to how the term "Chevy Small Block" was applied to any GM corporate V8 engine from around 262C.I.D. (4.3L) to around a 400C.I.D. (6.6L).
LSx or LS variants are one of the most ubiquitous engines in the world today used in many vehicles. However, the term LS is somewhat broad as I indicated earlier. Again, the term LS1, LS2, LSA, LQ4, etc. are all RPO codes and that's not how an auto-parts store lists the information. RPO codes are useless to the clerks behind the counter. If you go into the store and ask for parts for a 2002 Pontiac Firebird, they are going to ask if you have the V6 or the V8. Alternatively, they may ask if you have the 3.8L engine or the 5.7L engine. They may not make a distinction between trim levels like Formula, Firehawk, Trans Am, SS, or Z28. You could even ask for a part like an O2 sensor or head gasket and they'll ask you what transmission the car has even though its irrelevant. Why? Because the search function in their parts system asks for that information.
03-06-2019, 02:12 PM
#31
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It would be a mistake to assume that someone working in an Autozone or O'Reilly autoparts store is knowledgeable about cars. The people that work there generally aren't looking to make a career out of anything in the automotive industry.
You also have to understand that the term "LS" or "LSx" is a somewhat inaccurate terminology that's used primarily in online forums or by DIY'ers and general automotive enthusiasts. The term "LS" or "LSx" is a general term used to describe any GM engine that's derived from the LS1's design. However, the term is inaccurate and way too broad in its usage. The name "LS1" is an RPO code (regular production option) used when placing orders for GM vehicles by dealerships. The 2003 5.3L truck engine is often referred to as an LS engine even though their actual RPO code is LM7. The LM7 for example is basically an iron block version of the LS1 and they have quite a bit of parts compatibility. You can put LM7 (5.3L) truck engine heads on an LS1 (5.7L) engine if you wanted to and some people do in fact, do just that. An LQ4 is a iron block 6.0L engine that's a variant of the LS2, which is itself derived from the LS1. Saying "LS" or "LSx" is easier when talking to other car guys than diving into specifics about what engine it really is. In essence, its short hand for any given LS1 or its descendants similar to how the term "Chevy Small Block" was applied to any GM corporate V8 engine from around 262C.I.D. (4.3L) to around a 400C.I.D. (6.6L).
LSx or LS variants are one of the most ubiquitous engines in the world today used in many vehicles. However, the term LS is somewhat broad as I indicated earlier. Again, the term LS1, LS2, LSA, LQ4, etc. are all RPO codes and that's not how an auto-parts store lists the information. RPO codes are useless to the clerks behind the counter. If you go into the store and ask for parts for a 2002 Pontiac Firebird, they are going to ask if you have the V6 or the V8. Alternatively, they may ask if you have the 3.8L engine or the 5.7L engine. They may not make a distinction between trim levels like Formula, Firehawk, Trans Am, SS, or Z28. You could even ask for a part like an O2 sensor or head gasket and they'll ask you what transmission the car has even though its irrelevant. Why? Because the search function in their parts system asks for that information.
You also have to understand that the term "LS" or "LSx" is a somewhat inaccurate terminology that's used primarily in online forums or by DIY'ers and general automotive enthusiasts. The term "LS" or "LSx" is a general term used to describe any GM engine that's derived from the LS1's design. However, the term is inaccurate and way too broad in its usage. The name "LS1" is an RPO code (regular production option) used when placing orders for GM vehicles by dealerships. The 2003 5.3L truck engine is often referred to as an LS engine even though their actual RPO code is LM7. The LM7 for example is basically an iron block version of the LS1 and they have quite a bit of parts compatibility. You can put LM7 (5.3L) truck engine heads on an LS1 (5.7L) engine if you wanted to and some people do in fact, do just that. An LQ4 is a iron block 6.0L engine that's a variant of the LS2, which is itself derived from the LS1. Saying "LS" or "LSx" is easier when talking to other car guys than diving into specifics about what engine it really is. In essence, its short hand for any given LS1 or its descendants similar to how the term "Chevy Small Block" was applied to any GM corporate V8 engine from around 262C.I.D. (4.3L) to around a 400C.I.D. (6.6L).
LSx or LS variants are one of the most ubiquitous engines in the world today used in many vehicles. However, the term LS is somewhat broad as I indicated earlier. Again, the term LS1, LS2, LSA, LQ4, etc. are all RPO codes and that's not how an auto-parts store lists the information. RPO codes are useless to the clerks behind the counter. If you go into the store and ask for parts for a 2002 Pontiac Firebird, they are going to ask if you have the V6 or the V8. Alternatively, they may ask if you have the 3.8L engine or the 5.7L engine. They may not make a distinction between trim levels like Formula, Firehawk, Trans Am, SS, or Z28. You could even ask for a part like an O2 sensor or head gasket and they'll ask you what transmission the car has even though its irrelevant. Why? Because the search function in their parts system asks for that information.
- The Gen III LQ4 & LQ9 6.0L actually pre-dated the LS2 (Gen IV). In fact, the camshaft update that the LS1 engines received across the board in 2001 was borrowed from the LQ4/9 engines well before LS2 was even on the market.
- You're absolutely correct that "Small Block Chevy" (SBC) was (and still is) used to describe any Gen 1 "small" Chevrolet V8 within that displacement range. However, this is still specific to only Chevrolet engines and not the "corporate" engine program, beginning in the late '70s, which mixed engines from different brands into various models. For example, the Oldsmobile 307ci V8 found its way into many GM products of several different brands between the ~mid-'80s and 1990 (including Chevrolet [specifically Caprice Wagon] in the latter years) - but, even though this engine falls within that displacement range during the "corporate engine" years, it would not be included in the "SBC" group as its architecture is completely different from the Chevrolet 307ci V8 of the late '60s/early '70s.
03-06-2019, 03:55 PM
#32
This is an excellent post, just a couple small things to clear up though (bolded items above).
- The Gen III LQ4 & LQ9 6.0L actually pre-dated the LS2 (Gen IV). In fact, the camshaft update that the LS1 engines received across the board in 2001 was borrowed from the LQ4/9 engines well before LS2 was even on the market.
- You're absolutely correct that "Small Block Chevy" (SBC) was (and still is) used to describe any Gen 1 "small" Chevrolet V8 within that displacement range. However, this is still specific to only Chevrolet engines and not the "corporate" engine program, beginning in the late '70s, which mixed engines from different brands into various models. For example, the Oldsmobile 307ci V8 found its way into many GM products of several different brands between the ~mid-'80s and 1990 (including Chevrolet [specifically Caprice Wagon] in the latter years) - but, even though this engine falls within that displacement range during the "corporate engine" years, it would not be included in the "SBC" group as its architecture is completely different from the Chevrolet 307ci V8 of the late '60s/early '70s.
- The Gen III LQ4 & LQ9 6.0L actually pre-dated the LS2 (Gen IV). In fact, the camshaft update that the LS1 engines received across the board in 2001 was borrowed from the LQ4/9 engines well before LS2 was even on the market.
- You're absolutely correct that "Small Block Chevy" (SBC) was (and still is) used to describe any Gen 1 "small" Chevrolet V8 within that displacement range. However, this is still specific to only Chevrolet engines and not the "corporate" engine program, beginning in the late '70s, which mixed engines from different brands into various models. For example, the Oldsmobile 307ci V8 found its way into many GM products of several different brands between the ~mid-'80s and 1990 (including Chevrolet [specifically Caprice Wagon] in the latter years) - but, even though this engine falls within that displacement range during the "corporate engine" years, it would not be included in the "SBC" group as its architecture is completely different from the Chevrolet 307ci V8 of the late '60s/early '70s.
03-06-2019, 05:38 PM
#33
Teching In
The local Advance had an intelligent, attractive redhead woman that was very familiar with the trucks I own two of, loved dealing with her, she moved on. They also have the brain dead stoner that takes forever just to speak. The manager is smart and a couple of youngsters that do OK. I usually check everything online, if I need it now and they have it I go get it, if it can wait, ship it. I've bought two of the NBS bare truck intakes for my truck mods from wallyworld online.
03-06-2019, 10:14 PM
#36
Autozone and the aren't staffed by people who like cars generally. They staffed by folks working to pay bills and go school.
You've lucky, one of my recent visits I asked where are the car battery chargers located. The clueless kid asked for what type of phone. I said a charger for the battery in the car, it's not for a phone. Bewildered he said cars have batteries? He goes to phone charger rack. His manager tried not to laugh in the kids face and point to the far corner of the store. I couldn't help it and laughed at the kid. He followed me to the battery charges and had the look on his face of seeing an alien spacecraft or live UFO.
Too much smart phone & Facebook is bad for kids. It deprives them of life experience.
You've lucky, one of my recent visits I asked where are the car battery chargers located. The clueless kid asked for what type of phone. I said a charger for the battery in the car, it's not for a phone. Bewildered he said cars have batteries? He goes to phone charger rack. His manager tried not to laugh in the kids face and point to the far corner of the store. I couldn't help it and laughed at the kid. He followed me to the battery charges and had the look on his face of seeing an alien spacecraft or live UFO.
Too much smart phone & Facebook is bad for kids. It deprives them of life experience.
03-07-2019, 08:52 AM
#37
Wait, you actually had an Autozone store with someone competent enough to have time to speak to you? That's a first. Every time I go in my local Autozone their are 5+ people waiting in line and the workers are clueless taking 15 minutes just to get someone some brakes. I stopped going and I just go to O'Reilly across the street and I'm in and out in minutes.
03-07-2019, 08:55 AM
#38
TECH Resident
That's good information. You know, now that I think about it, I saw vehicles for sale with the LQ4 and LQ9 before the LS2, so that makes sense. As for the information about the other GM engines used in Chevy vehicles, I appreciate it. I thought they had quit doing that earlier on than it would seem they did.
03-07-2019, 02:03 PM
#39
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Cadillac Brougham (previously, and subsequently, the "Fleetwood" model - a nameplate which had been moved to the downsized platform during this era) also received the Olds 307ci as late as 1990 (final year for this engine).
My experience with the Olds 307ci was different; mine wasn't nearly as reliable or durable as the Chevrolet 305 (carb'ed) which I also had from that same era (one in a B-body, one in a G-body). But I didn't buy either one brand new, so it's not a completely fair comparison.
03-07-2019, 02:15 PM
#40
TECH Resident
This is correct, but only for the wagon. B-body sedan was mostly defunct by 1990, though several Wagons still remained and all received the Olds 307-4bbl (including Caprice Wagon) as their only engine option. However, this engine was not available in basic Caprice sedan versions.
Cadillac Brougham (previously, and subsequently, the "Fleetwood" model - a nameplate which had been moved to the downsized platform during this era) also received the Olds 307ci as late as 1990 (final year for this engine).
I also recall it being the last carb'ed GM engine, though I can't say for certain if any other OEM was still selling a carb'ed engine later than this (1990).
My experience with the Olds 307ci was different; mine wasn't nearly as reliable or durable as the Chevrolet 305 (carb'ed) which I also had from that same era (one in a B-body, one in a G-body). But I didn't buy either one brand new, so it's not a completely fair comparison.
Cadillac Brougham (previously, and subsequently, the "Fleetwood" model - a nameplate which had been moved to the downsized platform during this era) also received the Olds 307ci as late as 1990 (final year for this engine).
I also recall it being the last carb'ed GM engine, though I can't say for certain if any other OEM was still selling a carb'ed engine later than this (1990).
My experience with the Olds 307ci was different; mine wasn't nearly as reliable or durable as the Chevrolet 305 (carb'ed) which I also had from that same era (one in a B-body, one in a G-body). But I didn't buy either one brand new, so it's not a completely fair comparison.
The biggest problem with the 307 was the ccc system. It was run by a computer and a couple sensors that just weren't very good at adjusting to anything but stock. Luckily you could swap in a non ccc quadrajet and a nice hei distributor and the engine would come alive. The chevy tbi system was better, but that didn't like to venture far from stock either. Even all these years later I wouldn't hesitate to get a 307/2004r combo as a daily driver.