RAGEman

iTrader: (4)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by RAMBIRD2002:
<strong>Just like John B posted earlier in this discussion I also have dynatech stepped headers with merge collectors and an ory pipe with a trick y collector thru stock ws6 exhaust. Completely stock car with a lid and I gained 51hp & 50tq. So for all you guys who think stepped headers are a waste, your all missing out. Think what you want these things work like a SOB.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"><strong>383ss No I didn't lose any low end what so ever, in fact on the dyno graph torque was at 3500/375-4000/380- and it peaked out 4400/394. So to answer your question it is a lot snappier in my opinion. DYNATECH'S ROCK.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">So you made 394 ft./lbs. of torque on a completely stock car with a lid and exhaust? That one's a little hard to believe.

RAMBIRD2002

Rageman-- To bad if you can't realize a good exhaust. I guess both John b and I are posting lies. I don't remember asking you if you believe me or my gains, all I have to say is you obviously have the wrong set up. (so sorry)

RAGEman

iTrader: (4)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by RAMBIRD2002:
<strong>Rageman-- To bad if you can't realize a good exhaust. I guess both John b and I are posting lies. I don't remember asking you if you believe me or my gains, all I have to say is you obviously have the wrong set up. (so sorry)</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Riiiiiiiight. First of all, how does the fact that I call BS on your "lid and exhaust" torque values mean I don't "realize" a good exhaust? After all, maybe it's just a really good lid that you got? Don't drag John B into this, he didn't make claims nearly as outrageous as yours. I don't remember caring, nor do I now, whether or not you asked me, I'm telling you anyway. And, as for me having the wrong setup, peak dyno numbers aren't what matters in racing, pal. Show me your track times with your "lid and exhaust" car. Mine are as follows:

All times with completely stock drivetrain down to the 3.42 rear:

-11.56 @ 121.1 (1.709) (w/ ET streets, 3200-lb. raceweight, very good air at Temple Academy Dragway in Little River Academy, TX)
-12.04 @ 115.8 (1.82) (w/Nittos, 3500-lb. raceweight, not-so-good air at the Texas Motorplex in Ennis, TX)
-12.30 @ 114.9 (1.95) (w/Eagle GA's, 3500-lb. raceweight, decent air at TAD)

All that with a measly (but 100% honest) 360 RWHP and 376 RWTQ.

Oh, wait, you know what? Don't even bother posting your times because I'm sure either A) you're a dyno queen and don't have any track times, or B) they aren't as good as mine (so sorry).

<small>[ November 13, 2002, 01:54 AM: Message edited by: RAGEman ]</small>

JS

iTrader: (4)

RAGE dont get all worked up for a BOOB <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />
Thats what we call these kind of guys up here in Philly.
Guys gotta be some ASSPIPE who reads Carcraft...

Rage your a drag racer like me we both know different when it comes to BS and facts.Bottem line a STEPPED isnt worth *** on a mild 346 or even a stout H/C car other than a blown setup or big N20 setup...

Terry 125
GTSS 125
Raugh 124
Coach 122

ALL of the these guys have 1 3/4in L/T's and I think there MPH speaks for itself and this is FACT!!!!

JS

RAGEman

iTrader: (4)

Thanks, Joel. I'm not really worked up, I'm just on a campaign to stamp out ignorance across the globe! That said, I decided on 1-3/4" SLP's with true dual. Results soon! After the 4.56's/28" ET Drags come in, I should be good to go! Oh, and a clutch. And a cage. And some susp...nevermind.

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

Colonel

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by RAMBIRD2002:
<strong>383ss No I didn't lose any low end what so ever, in fact on the dyno graph torque was at 3500/375-4000/380- and it peaked out 4400/394. So to answer your question it is a lot snappier in my opinion. DYNATECH'S ROCK.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">394 TQ at 4400? What was the HP at that RPM? What was the peak HP?

"Rage your a drag racer like me we both know different when it comes to BS and facts.Bottem line a STEPPED isnt worth *** on a mild 346"

I agree.

Linear Velocity

iTrader: (1)

I had Grot true 1 7/8" headers on my old h/c set up. I had the same concerns as all you and talked to Nick Agostino and Barry about them (I got them thru the GP with ARE), they said that they tested them on a 2000 Corvette and they picked up 12 rwhp N/A over the 1 3/4; but they really only recommended them aggressive h/c packages with a 224/224 and over cam. I dynoed 420 rwhp and 400 rwtq with no custom tuning thru my heads and 227/227 cam. I'd say the torque was there; I never got to get the setup tuning before the motor went but I think I could have seen another 10 rwtq from tuning.

RAMBIRD2002

Hey "RAGEMAN" by your 1980 birthdate in your profile your obviously an immature kid. "GROW UP" drag racer. You, among others for sure- by some previous posts DON'T KNOW EVERYTHING.

RAGEman

iTrader: (4)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by RAMBIRD2002:
<strong>Hey "RAGEMAN" by your 1980 birthdate in your profile your obviously an immature kid. "GROW UP" drag racer. You, among others for sure- by some previous posts DON'T KNOW EVERYTHING.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I was unaware that you could determine a person's maturity level merely by looking at their age. That's pretty cool how you can do that. You must have special powers or something. Yes, I am 22 years old, I'm not ashamed of it, nor do I care who knows it. Now why doesn't your birth date show up, old man? Got something to hide, have you? If you have some other facts/evidence to back up your claim that I am not grown up yet, please, by all means, share it with the rest of us. And, as for your statement that I, among others, don't know everything, well, I never claimed I did, but on the other hand, I wasn't born yesterday, and I know BS when I see it. I believe it is you that is proving how little you know with each post you make. You should quit now while I'm ahead, or you'll only make it worse for yourself. Thanks.

Terry Burger

iTrader: (4)

I'd like to try a set of full 1 7/8s on my with my new motor. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

RAGEman

iTrader: (4)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by RAMBIRD2002:
<strong>BLAH,BLAH,BLAH, Rage your a waste of time and energy, shame on me for lowering myself to your level. Hopefully as you grow up you will get wiser with age.(for your own benefit). See ya little man.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">What's a shame is that you think we're dumb enough not to see the fact that you're avoiding every point I'm making, just to get back to your point that I am lower and/or more immature than you, which, I might add, you have absolutely no basis for. See ya, little brain.

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

Wow guys.

Why get all pissy like that?

I for one want to see some #'s on a test car, step'd vs 1.75" headers... Any data out there?

RAGEman

iTrader: (4)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Pro Stock John:
<strong>Wow guys.

Why get all pissy like that?

I for one want to see some #'s on a test car, step'd vs 1.75" headers... Any data out there?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I said his 394 RWTQ was a little hard to believe for a completely stock car with a lid and exhaust, and he chose to take the flaming route. From that point on, I was merely fighting fire with fire. Go back and see for yourself. Per your request, I'm through with this "boob," although I would like to see some proof that this car really is a stock LS1 with just a lid and exhaust, and that it made 394 RWTQ.

Back to the issue at hand, as I said before, I can see how maybe the stepped headers wouldn't offer much gain over straight 1.75" on a 346, but I can't understand why switching to the stepped would cause a DECREASE in peak HP. It just doesn't make sense. Not that I don't believe it happened, I just don't understand it.

Fenris Ulf

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by RAMBIRD2002:
<strong>BLAH,BLAH,BLAH, Rage your a waste of time and energy, shame on me for lowering myself to your level. Hopefully as you grow up you will get wiser with age.(for your own benefit). See ya little man.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">If you were so wise with age, you would know that "your" is the possessive form of you and not the contraction for you are. Why don't you get off RAGEman's *******, old man?

<small>[ November 13, 2002, 07:53 PM: Message edited by: Fenris Ulf ]</small>

Sears

Joel, GTS SS runs a stepped header made by FMS.

http://www.futralmotorsports.com/gtsheaderpic.htm

Justin

JS

iTrader: (4)

Okay JSEARS u got me <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />
Does Futral run his stepped too?

Still u gotta admit alot of guys are going REAL fast with a 1 3/4in header...I just dont see how its worth much.

FWIW,Futral also spins his motors above 7000
I can see where a steped might work better on these applications and one like Fireballs but most guys wont shift at 7000+

For a guy who wants a 6700 MAX shift point on a 346 IMO a stepped is worthless.

JS

slvrbird2000

LOL, let's cut the BS here...

I still want to know if RAMBIRD2002 made those numbers at the flywheel or at the rear wheels.

Scott

Sears

I believe Alan just runs the regular 1 3/4 Grots on his car.

Justin

1CAMWNDR

iTrader: (21)

Maturity aside, I think that the reason a 1 7/8" stepped or a full 1 7/8" header will loose a little power and torque down low on a 346" motor is exhaust gas velocity. The larger tubes alow the smaller motor's exhaust pulse to slow down. If you had a 427" or larger motor, it is moving a lot more air at all rpms and may benefit from the bigger tubes.

John B

iTrader: (10)

One thing that never ceases to amaze me about this site (and every other one out there for that fact) is that an intelligent topic like this one gets started and we are 40+ posts into it with next to nothing for facts and data and a whole bunch of opinions expressed that cause people to tweak.

I don't have a problem with people expressing "opinions" on this topic but the reality is that JS is the only one that provided us with a partial data point on this subject for comparison purposes. And even JS's data wasn't an apples to apples comparison since it wasn't done on the same day/same dyno and we don't know if any PCM tweaking was done to optimize the set-up so I really don't consider the data point very valid unless we have more info here. And finally, no one has a back to back track MPH comparison for us which would tell the real story.

If anyone out there has a B1 cam in their stage II heads/cam 346 with 1-3/4" LT's, please post a dyno sheet showing it running through full exhaust so that we can compare it to mine because I would be willing to bet that you're not making more torque down low over my stepped headers and this should prove that stepped headers don't cost you bottom end power when they are mated to merge collectors <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />