Major engine problems with JPR 388
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From: SC
Originally Posted by RESTOMAN
Erik-
I Have Dynoed The Car For You Several Times For Joe Prince And Have Not Seen Any Problems With Smokoing On The Dyno.
I Have Never Heard You Complain Of Smoking When You Were Here For Dyno's Either---
I Recommend The 42lb Injectors For You Because The 36lb Ones You Had Were Not Enough--look At The Dyno Sheets.
Please Stop Bad Mouthing Joe--i Have Explained To You In About 20 E-mails Now What Happened--
1-cylinder Bore Wash Down
2-valvetrain Damage--overevving
3-rod Ends Enlagred--too High Rpm--overrevving
When You Are Hard On A Car Which Is A Machine---it Can And Eventually Will Break.
It Was Designed By Gm To Have Say 300rwhp And You Are Pushing It To 475rwhp---that Is Alot Of Stress,whether Aftermarket Partsor Not.
Please Understand--joe Is Not Backing Out Of Any Warranty Work
He Can't Warranty Misuse---he Would Go Broke!!!!
Thanks
Joe Dutkiewicz
Shop Owner
I Have Dynoed The Car For You Several Times For Joe Prince And Have Not Seen Any Problems With Smokoing On The Dyno.
I Have Never Heard You Complain Of Smoking When You Were Here For Dyno's Either---
I Recommend The 42lb Injectors For You Because The 36lb Ones You Had Were Not Enough--look At The Dyno Sheets.
Please Stop Bad Mouthing Joe--i Have Explained To You In About 20 E-mails Now What Happened--
1-cylinder Bore Wash Down
2-valvetrain Damage--overevving
3-rod Ends Enlagred--too High Rpm--overrevving
When You Are Hard On A Car Which Is A Machine---it Can And Eventually Will Break.
It Was Designed By Gm To Have Say 300rwhp And You Are Pushing It To 475rwhp---that Is Alot Of Stress,whether Aftermarket Partsor Not.
Please Understand--joe Is Not Backing Out Of Any Warranty Work
He Can't Warranty Misuse---he Would Go Broke!!!!
Thanks
Joe Dutkiewicz
Shop Owner
As I mentioned in my emails, I am having a hard time buying these explanations. JD, you are a good guy and I know you want to help me out. I am not trying to bash anyone, but I am frustrated beyond belief and I am getting nothing out of this and no help from you guys other than I have to pay a lot of money.
I had over 150 track passes on my h/c setup, and never had a problem, missing shifts or not. As soon as I run the new engine, it has problems. It has to be able to hold up to more than a dozen track passes in a year. I am very careful with the car, I run it at the track but do not abuse it other than when I call for it to do it, I want to go ***** to the walls with no problems. If you can pull the rpm log out of the cars computer, I challange you to find a time when it went over 7200rpm ,worst case scenario when tommy was driving the car or if I hit the gate on an attempted 1-2 powershift shift and back off immediately.
I am not taking the blame for this, this isnt my fault. I have been very patient and have done everything i can to help move the car along and get it fixed.
I want something worked out, but there seems to be no flexibility on your side.
Sorry to see a situation like this. I don't really know both sides but I can say that Joe Prince went out of his way answer a lot of my questions regarding all-bores after AAP closed up; I think that Joe is a class act because I never even bought anything from him and lived on the other side of the country and he took his time to help me out. That being said I don't think there is a fault here, these are high HP motors and some live longer than others, it's a fact of life. I'm happy that my setup made good power and never gave me problems, but it sucks to see that other people like Erik are having problems with theirs. I remember Erik emailing me regarding his setup a while ago, at that time he was going with a bigger cam and injectors, I told him that my SVO 30# were enough and that I thought is had more to do with the heads and tuning rather than his cam and fuel. I dealt with both people in this case and I don't think either one of them has bad intentions. This is an unfortunate situation and I hope both you guys work something out. Take care. ~Tony
Ford SVO 30 lb/hr injectors should be enough. I run them on my 427 with no issues and Tony had them on his 434 CID with no issues. Granted, the SVO 30 lb/hr are being pushed by a Racetronix in the thus mentioned scenario.
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From: SC
Originally Posted by samz28
did you inspect the oil often after the large injectors? You could have had gassy oil, really bad for break in, and it would most certainly "Wash" the rings. It's really important to dyno tune the air fuel (and street tune) so you're not running filthy rich, esp on a break in period.
I can imagine a car running 12:1 all the time, lol, the oil would be gassy in short time, esp if you in this kinda weather and theres significant cold enrichment time.
on my dub with super large injectors, and my laziness to tune, i deemed it necessary to swap oil bout every 300-500 miles, due to the fact i work so close to home and the air fuel was off the kilter rich esp during the open-loop cold start time frame. It doesn't take long to ruin your oil. Once its gassy, well you know the rest.
i've been hearing alot of scarey stories lately about tuners/installers not backing up there work. I might have to investigate more thoroughly the person that does the work on my mods sitting in the garage as i'd be bringing the car back to the tuner with the 9mm if i was at your point.
I can imagine a car running 12:1 all the time, lol, the oil would be gassy in short time, esp if you in this kinda weather and theres significant cold enrichment time.
on my dub with super large injectors, and my laziness to tune, i deemed it necessary to swap oil bout every 300-500 miles, due to the fact i work so close to home and the air fuel was off the kilter rich esp during the open-loop cold start time frame. It doesn't take long to ruin your oil. Once its gassy, well you know the rest.
i've been hearing alot of scarey stories lately about tuners/installers not backing up there work. I might have to investigate more thoroughly the person that does the work on my mods sitting in the garage as i'd be bringing the car back to the tuner with the 9mm if i was at your point.
Just an FYI for the future, EZSS, you can send an oil sample to blackstone-labs.com and they'll analyze your oil for you. That'll let you know if there is tons of fuel, etc in your oil.
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From: SC
Originally Posted by CANNIBAL
Are the lifters really Comp-Rs? I think this is the first I have read of them collapsing.
Neither have I. I am told they are comp r lifters, I never saw that, they were put in by JPR.
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From: SC
Originally Posted by Pro Stock John
8000 miles on this motor...
-how many passes?
-best pass?
-how many passes?
-best pass?
several passes at numidia (4-5), best of 11.91 @ 117
1 pass at atco (a month maybe), shortly after that, drove 2 hrs to get there, and only got one run in. Good clean run, 11.89 @ 116, my best time yet with the new motor. Someone from one of the boards was there and commented on how low the trap speed seemed.
2 (and 1 other where I never got out of the box because I smoked the clutch) passes at slp day after new heads, starting to have some clutch problems but still had a run that h/c would have been a high 11 or low 12, and it was a 12.4 @ 113.5
Several passes at cecil 3 weekends ago (I dont remember how many now, maybe 4-6), best run 12.0 @ 115-116, got warned that I needed to stop the car from smoking down the track before I ran again.
around 20 passes, with problems from the first pass.
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From: Hartsdale, NY
Has anyone else had issues after an LS6 valley cover swap?
I did mine without cutting the aluminum block; this was accomplished by splicing in a piece of copper tubing where I cut out a 4" section of black plastic from the new cover....
If any alumium shavings were allowed to contaminate the motor, I assume this would cause bad problems and could result in an oil burning condition....
I did mine without cutting the aluminum block; this was accomplished by splicing in a piece of copper tubing where I cut out a 4" section of black plastic from the new cover....
If any alumium shavings were allowed to contaminate the motor, I assume this would cause bad problems and could result in an oil burning condition....
Originally Posted by robertbartsch
Has anyone else had issues after an LS6 valley cover swap?
I did mine without cutting the aluminum block; this was accomplished by splicing in a piece of copper tubing where I cut out a 4" section of black plastic from the new cover....
If any alumium shavings were allowed to contaminate the motor, I assume this would cause bad problems and could result in an oil burning condition....
I did mine without cutting the aluminum block; this was accomplished by splicing in a piece of copper tubing where I cut out a 4" section of black plastic from the new cover....
If any alumium shavings were allowed to contaminate the motor, I assume this would cause bad problems and could result in an oil burning condition....
I'd say most of the shavings that got away from someone when doing this would get picked up in the filter, hopefully.
Last edited by CANNIBAL; Dec 5, 2003 at 04:14 PM.
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From: SC
Originally Posted by CANNIBAL
Just an FYI for the future, EZSS, you can send an oil sample to blackstone-labs.com and they'll analyze your oil for you. That'll let you know if there is tons of fuel, etc in your oil.
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From: SC
Originally Posted by CANNIBAL
I'd say most of the shavings that got away from someone when doing this would get picked up in the filter, hopefully.
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From: SC
Originally Posted by CANNIBAL
Ford SVO 30 lb/hr injectors should be enough. I run them on my 427 with no issues and Tony had them on his 434 CID with no issues. Granted, the SVO 30 lb/hr are being pushed by a Racetronix in the thus mentioned scenario.
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From: SC
Originally Posted by Pro Stock John
What were your Ltrims after using the MAFT, how much correction did you have?
Those ARE heads have the bad Mojo, man... Im not a superstitious guy, but jmX and I might have to do a ARE Mojo Removal howto.
That injector swapping business sounds aweful. Its just toooooo easy to wash out cylinders.
My old LS6 ARE heads would smoke at random times from a few cracks between the intake ports and the spring seats, fwiw.
What would I do? If Joe and yourself cant work this out (you both have good points...which may be a problem), you are still without a bottom end. Personally, I'd ship what I have to MTI and be done with costly engine issues once and for all. I dont mean to sound like one of those "Try it, it feels sooooo good" body snatchers, but seriously, MTI was like a paramedic after my ARE heart attack.
Good luck to the both of you... these are both costly and stressful issues for both sides.
chris
That injector swapping business sounds aweful. Its just toooooo easy to wash out cylinders.
My old LS6 ARE heads would smoke at random times from a few cracks between the intake ports and the spring seats, fwiw.
What would I do? If Joe and yourself cant work this out (you both have good points...which may be a problem), you are still without a bottom end. Personally, I'd ship what I have to MTI and be done with costly engine issues once and for all. I dont mean to sound like one of those "Try it, it feels sooooo good" body snatchers, but seriously, MTI was like a paramedic after my ARE heart attack.
Good luck to the both of you... these are both costly and stressful issues for both sides.
chris
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From: SC
If any other sponsor is willing to help me, or thinks they have a solution for me, please email ezerner@yahoo.com