Slowhawk

iTrader: (12)

It sounds like the problem sleeves are ones that were improperly installed.A cracked sleeve is either installed too tight or sleeve defect..Dropped sleeve is one that is installed too loose..I'm surprised that dry sleeves don't have a ridge so that when you bolt the head on it help's holding it down to the ridge,on top of the press fit..

99 Black Bird T/A

iTrader: (4)

Please keep voting and adding comments.

Thanks to all for their input so far!

When Nineball got that first All Bore/Big Bore/Re-sleeve (well actually the second one) set up, I wanted copy the idea with a slightly larger cam. All of the sleeve issues over the years pretty much keep me on the side lines as I didn't want to buy a problem.

The polls are intended to help get an idea of what I might be getting into with a sleeved block for my daily driver. My guess going into this was that maybe 10 percent of the dry sleeves blocks had issues. I think I'll stick with a 346 for the RS for the time being. I'll post another poll in a few months for Darton Wet's and see what the take on them are.

FSTR-THANU

iTrader: (9)

How about bore concentricity? I have an ARE 4.100 bore re-sleeved ls6 block. I am not worried about cracking or dropping a sleeve but I am worried about the inconsistant bore diameter. The bores are all pretty consistant cross car but fore aft the top of the bores are all about 2 thou small, center of the bore is right on and bottom of the bore is 2.5 - 3 thou big. I have talked to Wade and he feels the the 9/16 head studs will straighten out the sleeves but I am concerned about the top of the bore being small considering that is where all the heat is at, especially in a N2O motor. I guess we will see soon enough!

Here are a few pics:







Tom

99 Black Bird T/A

iTrader: (4)

Can't bore concentricity be checked when the torque plates are attached? The block would be under load ie clamping and a true reading of actual concentricity can be made both top and bottom?

Someone else will probably know the answer...I know someone has checked for exactly this issue, I can't remember exactly how it's checked under load but there should be a way to check it.

99 Black Bird T/A

iTrader: (4)

FSTR,

That's really a good quesiton...might be worth posting it in the forum where it will get direct attention too.

FSTR-THANU

iTrader: (9)

If I had a set of torque plates drilled for 9/16 studs I could check but that is not exactly a very standard size head stud. Tommorrow I might torque down my heads and see if I can measure from the bottom though.

Tom

Visceral

iTrader: (1)

Right now, I havent had the time or effort to drive the car....

But that worries me. If its common enough for recent (last 12 months) MTI resleeved motors to have issues, I need to find out if it is immediately, or after some number of miles. Ive probably put 500 or so miles on the car. I have not had any issues that I can sense from the bottom end. What Im worried about is that I have a warrantee on the motor, and I have no doubt that MTI will stand behind that warrantee. But at my current rate, I wont have driven the car much before the 12 months expires. (maybe its 24...I have to go back and look). In either case, the weather here is crap and I COULD drive it if need be and put some miles on it, but I really dont want to. Maybe it's time to do it anyways.



chris

99 Black Bird T/A

iTrader: (4)

TTT in search of more votes....

C_Williams

7,000 miles on my ARE 422 (4.100 bore) no water leaks and makes big power....but, I consume a quart of oil every 500 miles...I think the sleeves are too thin and the walls have moved out of round. Going with the Darton setup in February.

InvisibleSun

MMS 427 w/ the new Darton Wet sleeves... Has been in for about 2 weeks and maybe has a couple dozen miles on it. So far so good! I'll check back after a couple thousand...

MTI

In most occurances, people on message forums hear about problems experienced with a resleeved engine. What you don't always hear about are the countless engines running around on the street without any issues. The vast majority of those owners do not visit message boards. In an effort to build a stronger and more reliable engine, MTI has recently purchased a Rottler F65A CNC block boring center. This machine allows us to perform the resleeving process with far more precision over the method we were using prior. Our goal is to produce a resleeved block that cannot and will not have any issues whatsoever. We feel we are virtually there as we have been performing extensive testing with the new machine & Darton sleeves and have had nothing but positive results!

KHShapiro

iTrader: (10)

IMO the MID is the way to go.. to be completely honest havent heard of a single MID droping a sleeve..anyone??? it has always been the costom in house sleeves that had droped or become out of round. i haven't heard ofany of the LPE MID blocks droping and now MTI is using the F65 with MID.. MTI is closer to me than LPE so my Block will be headed to MTI for an MID Darton sleeve

99 Black Bird T/A

iTrader: (4)

Excellent info from MTI about the new Rottler F65A CNC block boring center as these are super precise machines!

Could MTI or any other sponsors share a rough estimate of about how many Big Bores they have done over the last few years? I've always had the impression Big Bore's were very rare. Thanks

I agree the MID is the way to go if going with resleeves even if drys are a little less expensive to set up.

99 Black Bird T/A

iTrader: (4)

I also am starting to get the feeling problems with drys sleeves tend to occur very early in the motors like either at the start or before 2,000 miles.

FSTR-THANU

iTrader: (9)

So I have seen one post about excessive oil consumption possibly due to bore size inconsistancy. I would expect the same opportunity may exist for blow by, maybe not. What are your guys experiences? I assume everybody elses bores are all well within tolerance, whatever that actually is for a sleeved aluminum engine. It sounds like my bore diameters are perfectly acceptable for a re-sleeved block.

I would like to hear some positive feedback then. How many higher mileage re-sleeved blocks out there with normal oil consumption and never any milk shake under the valve covers. Did any of you guys measure your bore's prior to assembly?

Tom

C_Williams

I posted above about using a quart per each 500 miles....maybe that's normal for a stroker , maybe not.However, if I get into the load pedal often enough I can chew up a quart in a hurry, like on a track day.

I eliminated the PCV system in favor of a catch can and will be experimenting soon with a vacuum pump. Time will tell if there is any reduction in usage after the vaccum pump. I doubt it, though.


To answer some specific question -

1) I have close to 7k miles and no milk shake present.
2) I measured the bores carefully before assembly and recorded all the data. In general (and without a plate attached) I had less than .001 out of round and even less taper. Wish I had a torque plate at the time because a freshly honed block should be "dead nuts"
3)I did a leeakdowm test recently and all bores were <2% except #5 which was 5%.

FSTR-THANU

iTrader: (9)

Great info! Was this measured with a torque plate? Have you assembled it yet? Any issues?

Tom

99 Black Bird T/A

iTrader: (4)

Is that a great set of numbers, good set, fair set, average set for measuring the bore?

99 Black Bird T/A

iTrader: (4)

Good thing MTI got the new high precision boring machine so that won't be an issue going forward.

BigD

iTrader: (31)

Out of curiosity, Get a refund yet? Intestested to find out why after 4 months you don't have your money or block back yet. Please keep me posted!