Need some SERIOUS help!!!!!

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Mar 20, 2004 | 11:59 PM

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From: Delray Beach, Fl.

Need some SERIOUS help!!!!!

If I have a cam thats on a 113LSA and I install it in straight up 113ICL,Then I advanced that SAME cam 2 degree's to 111ICL what would happen to my peak HP/TQ numbers from 111ICL to 113ICL?

How much do u guys think I'd gain or lose?

Also what is opening a transverse single exhaust worth in your option on a very good breathing motor. (8 to 10RW or even alittle more?)

What is the !PS mod worth in terms of RW?

And lastly what will u lose going from a 10 bolt 3.73 to a 4.10 12 bolt in terms of RW?

Please help,I need some SOLID KNOWLEDGABLE INFO..
I'm crossing Tee's and dotting eyes and might be going in another direction with my car for personal reasons...

JS
NOT HAPPY

Mar 21, 2004 | 01:01 AM

Scott Turvey

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From: Oceanside CA

Quote:

Originally Posted by JS

Your peak is going to move down the RPM scale, though the specific numbers are impossible to know as this is dependent on the engine breathing (intake and exhaust systems). Sorry if this is obvious.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JS

Also what is opening a transverse single exhaust worth in your option on a very good breathing motor. (8 to 10RW or even alittle more?)

Again, the same as above, but additionally, the valvetrain's ability to go high enough can affect it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JS

What is the !PS mod worth in terms of RW?

No clue here (probably what you may think of the first two answers)

Quote:

Originally Posted by JS

And lastly what will u lose going from a 10 bolt 3.73 to a 4.10 12 bolt in terms of RW?

Given you can equal the weight of a 10 bolt with the right parts in a 12 bolt, none. Unless you count the $$ you spend on the 12 bolt conversion.

Not trying to be a wise-*** here, just trying to point out you would need to understand the flow characteristics of the engine, plus the valvetrain's (particularily the springs) ability to handle the RPM change to answer these questions with a knowledgeable answer. Not know this, plus the other specs of the cam makes this impossible to answer accurately. In my best estimation, it will definitely kill some upper-end.

Mar 21, 2004 | 01:49 AM

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From: Delray Beach, Fl.

Scott there has to be some kind of loss..
U figure going from a CUTOUT to a CLOSED EXHAUST (I figure 10RW on a better breathing motor)

Also comparing a STOCK GM 3.73 10 bolt to a MOSER 33 Spline 800lb Eaton 12 Bolt I would figure it to be at least 10RW loss here too.

PS okay maybe 3RW tops...

And as far as the cam being adv and dropping power I agree but how much do u think it would drop?I thought an AUTO drag race car would like alittle more under the curve?

Mar 21, 2004 | 03:15 AM

gomer

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From: The Confederacy

Quote:

Originally Posted by JS

I'll help where I can, On my car the cutout is worth 15rwhp over running thru the muffler ( B&B Tri-flow ), pulling the PS belt isn't worth anything noticeable on the dyno... BUT, running an electric wp and pulling the entire belt is worth 10 to 12rwhp. I've seen two cars dyno after adding a 12 bolt, one was a bolt on car.. stock H/C.. it lost about 7rwhp. The other car was a mild 224 cam'd stage 1.5 headed car and it lost about 10 to 12 rwhp.

Mar 21, 2004 | 08:43 AM

99 Black Bird T/A

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Cut out was worth 10rwhp and ~10rwtq for my car.

Does you cam have any advance ground in?

Advancing the cam will tend to bring the power on quicker and help area under the curve. You should gain area under the curve. It will also pulled the power band down a little and probably lose some peak. The only real way to know would be to advance the cam, dyno and compare to a dyno with cam when it was straight up.

Mar 21, 2004 | 12:43 PM

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From: Delray Beach, Fl.

Thanks guys so I can realistically be loosing 15RW from the exhaust,maybe 2 or 3 RW from the PS and 7 to 10 from the 12-bolt.

Thats encouraging....
I might have a dead cyl according to Cartek but I'm gonna check it myself too
I'm **** that way,Julio also thinks my engine builder put the cam in 2 degrees adv and I agree with him too.The car only peaked at 6100 and it should be more like 6400.I might be loosing 5 to 7 RW peak there too?

I could be loosing 30RW and thats exactly what I thought..
Looks like I'll check the motor out this week and if Daves right then I'm screwed but if its good I'll redyno with the cutout open and possible check where my cam was installed and then redyno

Thanks....

Mar 21, 2004 | 12:51 PM

Damian

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From: Atlanta

Advancing a cam is not going to "drop" your power level, it's going to move it.....down.

Are you saying that your cam was a 113+2, and then you advanced it again? That would put it below 110 ICL...

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Mar 21, 2004 | 01:50 PM

Beast96Z

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From: Shreveport, LA

Quote:

Originally Posted by JS

In terms of advancing or retarding a cam, you are not going to gain or loose any power. Your just moving the power band. If your cam is +2 right now and peaks at 6100, installing it straight up will move the same peak power up about 1.5-200 rpms. This will also take some away from your area under the curve. So in theory, by installing the cam straight up, you will have the same peak power, just closer to 6300 rpm's. Your power could also be falling from a weak valve train. It's always good to check the pressures on a couple of springs to make sure there still in check. And like Gomer said, removing the PS is not going to show you much of anything on the dyno. No gain, no loss. The 12-bolt however can kill various ranges of power, 10-20 rw in some cases, depending on how it is set-up.

Mar 21, 2004 | 01:56 PM

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From: Delray Beach, Fl.

I still believe by taking the area under the curve back up I might see a few hp up top.
Julio told me the valvetrain is working flawleslly and I looked at the graph it was nice a smooth with no dips or squiggles.

I guess after I leak it down I'll need to check the cam and see if its too far adv.
I might eve go to a different cam or sell the car...

Thanks....