Lookin for some engine build help
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Joined: Feb 2012
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From: Lima,OH
Lookin for some engine build help I am looking basically completely redo my engine in my 98 camaro.
I just had it dyno tuned today and put out an unimpressive 351 hp.... Looking to go atleast another 100 or so horse ... I want something that will still be able to be street driven but nasty in the same aspect. Im Looking to replace the exhaust thats on... It currently has headers but don't think they are great ones.. Whats some good ones to go with?
I'm going to have a magnaflow exhaust put on... Might even go 3 inch exhaust pipe all the way back gotta take it to the exhaust guy and make sure he can do it first.
Now I know there is a very mild cam in it. Looking to change that probably different intake and different heads but looking at different ways to go to reach this... Right now looking in the neighborhood of maybe spending 2500 or 3000 with flexibility for more or less. Thats just for the engine build i'm not including the exhaust in that setup that i will have a seperate budget for.
Current mods are slp lid/K&N Air filter/egr block off/headders not sure which ones, lowered 2.5 inches/ subframe connectors/ its also an automatic trans.... Not sure of any of the other mods. I was told there is some free mods i could do yet but i know that won't get me close to the numbers i'd like to see so i'm looking for some major mods that will make a big difference.
I just had it dyno tuned today and put out an unimpressive 351 hp.... Looking to go atleast another 100 or so horse ... I want something that will still be able to be street driven but nasty in the same aspect. Im Looking to replace the exhaust thats on... It currently has headers but don't think they are great ones.. Whats some good ones to go with?
I'm going to have a magnaflow exhaust put on... Might even go 3 inch exhaust pipe all the way back gotta take it to the exhaust guy and make sure he can do it first.
Now I know there is a very mild cam in it. Looking to change that probably different intake and different heads but looking at different ways to go to reach this... Right now looking in the neighborhood of maybe spending 2500 or 3000 with flexibility for more or less. Thats just for the engine build i'm not including the exhaust in that setup that i will have a seperate budget for.
Current mods are slp lid/K&N Air filter/egr block off/headders not sure which ones, lowered 2.5 inches/ subframe connectors/ its also an automatic trans.... Not sure of any of the other mods. I was told there is some free mods i could do yet but i know that won't get me close to the numbers i'd like to see so i'm looking for some major mods that will make a big difference.
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Joined: Feb 2012
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From: Lima,OH
So far what i'm thinking would be
FAST 102mm LSXr Intake Manifold
Not sure on cam yet or heads looking for some pointers... Would it be better to get different heads or would porting the stock ones be better? Which would give the best results for the buck?
Also any reccomendations on what to do on the bottom end if much at all?
FAST 102mm LSXr Intake Manifold
Not sure on cam yet or heads looking for some pointers... Would it be better to get different heads or would porting the stock ones be better? Which would give the best results for the buck?
Also any reccomendations on what to do on the bottom end if much at all?
If you're only shooting for 100hp or so above what you have, an LS6 Intake should do just fine, and will cost about 1/4 the FAST. A 228r cam or something similar with a 3800 stall or so with ported 243 heads (by TEA or AI) and a good dyno tune should get you close to 450hp with plenty of street manners.
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From: Lima,OH
Honestly the latest build has around 15k miles on it.. Just i didn't do it or have it done bought it that way I mean if i can get better numbers honestly i'd shoot for even better numbers... I had a car that was 423 at the wheels in an LT1 and it was radical but would have loved if it had even more. If i can get more hp for that amount of money shoot me some numbers if i could reach over 500 that would be even better yet. This is my first ls1 so i'm not familar with actual hp numbers yet that can be achieved on a good build... I wasn't impressed with what i put at the dyno today and that was 351.
i dont agree with the above statement fully. To reach 450 hp you need to get rid of that ls6 intake for a fast and you need to go with a tad bit bigger of a cam then a 228. I would look in the mid 230's duration and lower .600's for lift. For heads you can go with some nicely ported ls6 heads from tea or ai and you will be fine. For headers either kooks or american racing headers is the way to go. For a stall i would do around a 3600-4000 stall with some 3.73's in the rear. With what i said above you should be right around that 450 maybe a tad bit less like 440ish mark remember though dyno are tuning tools not for numbers. on top of that its harder for an auto car to hit the big numbers like 6 speed cars. good luck with the build
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From: Lima,OH
Texas Speed Magic Stick 4 239/242 .649"/.609" Camshaft
I was looking at this cam is why i ask if any particular brand is better than others...Let me know what you think,
I also don't want you to think im asking questions to second guess just becuase i want to learn why one is better than other and benefits and what not thats how i learn the quickest.
I was looking at this cam is why i ask if any particular brand is better than others...Let me know what you think,
I also don't want you to think im asking questions to second guess just becuase i want to learn why one is better than other and benefits and what not thats how i learn the quickest.
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Texas Speed Magic Stick 4 239/242 .649"/.609" Camshaft
I was looking at this cam is why i ask if any particular brand is better than others...Let me know what you think,
I also don't want you to think im asking questions to second guess just becuase i want to learn why one is better than other and benefits and what not thats how i learn the quickest.
I was looking at this cam is why i ask if any particular brand is better than others...Let me know what you think,
I also don't want you to think im asking questions to second guess just becuase i want to learn why one is better than other and benefits and what not thats how i learn the quickest.
I live in Lima as well...if your looking to learn a few things or want some help with the car, PM me n we will meet up sometime.
Trying to get 450 RWHP is going to be a challenge with a LS1 and a small budget while retaining driveability. I agree with Z28Steve, you will need cam, heads, and FAST intake.
If your existing headers are long tube, they're propably ok. Look at some of the heads and cam kits that Texas Speed has, the stage 2.5 LS6 heads are good performers, but for a little less cash the ported 5.3 heads are a good bang for the buck.
For cam, I would shy away from the MS4, that's really high lift and can sometimes have PTV clearance issues. The Torquer V2 would be a nice compromise, but you might fall short of your dyno goal.
But, add a higher stall converter and beat manual shift cars with more hp. Also, don't forget to budget a tune in addition to everything else. I suspect you will significantly go over your $2500 to $3000 goal.
If your existing headers are long tube, they're propably ok. Look at some of the heads and cam kits that Texas Speed has, the stage 2.5 LS6 heads are good performers, but for a little less cash the ported 5.3 heads are a good bang for the buck.
For cam, I would shy away from the MS4, that's really high lift and can sometimes have PTV clearance issues. The Torquer V2 would be a nice compromise, but you might fall short of your dyno goal.
But, add a higher stall converter and beat manual shift cars with more hp. Also, don't forget to budget a tune in addition to everything else. I suspect you will significantly go over your $2500 to $3000 goal.
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Joined: Feb 2012
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From: Lima,OH
Well I wasn't looking at 2500 to 3000 as my total goal just as a starting point. I already have a seperate budget for my tune...I am trying to figure out how big of a budget i need just for the main part which is engine..
Honestly i know by taking the engine out myself i can probably save a lot most of it i can do except for a few things which i can take it to a machine shop to have done. and then i can drop it back in myself. I have done this in the past with lt1's ... Last lt1 i spent 12k on and never dynod it but i had an lt1 i spent around 10k on i had at 423 at the wheels.. With the ls1 being a better engine i would think i could probably get to a good point with this as well in the same vicinity. I forgot to mention those lt1s also had a lot more work beyond engines to get that much spent on them.
Exhaust and tune budget are completely seperate.
Honestly i know by taking the engine out myself i can probably save a lot most of it i can do except for a few things which i can take it to a machine shop to have done. and then i can drop it back in myself. I have done this in the past with lt1's ... Last lt1 i spent 12k on and never dynod it but i had an lt1 i spent around 10k on i had at 423 at the wheels.. With the ls1 being a better engine i would think i could probably get to a good point with this as well in the same vicinity. I forgot to mention those lt1s also had a lot more work beyond engines to get that much spent on them.
Exhaust and tune budget are completely seperate.
Well with a MS4 cam you'll have to really rev your rpm's up there to get into that cams powerband.. But a nice custom cam in the 226-228 area will pull great from a dead stop, and street light to street light.. If your going to daily drive your car like I do, then a max effort cam is pointless for daily driving because you can't take advantage of what it was built for..
And don't get to hung up on numbers, A properly setup 420 hp would win in a race against an inproperly setup 450 hp.. it happens all the time, match your gears and stall to the head/cam you pick for your goal..
I highly recomend a custom cam, its only like $20 bucks and they take everything you have into consideration..
And don't get to hung up on numbers, A properly setup 420 hp would win in a race against an inproperly setup 450 hp.. it happens all the time, match your gears and stall to the head/cam you pick for your goal..
I highly recomend a custom cam, its only like $20 bucks and they take everything you have into consideration..
TECH Enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 557
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From: Bowling Green KY
I would recommend a head and cam package from the same vendor, so they are well matched. Alternatively get some cam recomendations from your head vendor of choice. There are matched packages from TSP, Trick flow, Advanced Induction etc. With an A4, 450 rwhp is a reasonable goal, 500 is possible, but very very few cars will ever hit that without a power adder, on the stock short block through an auto. You will need a well matched combo to do an honest 450 at the wheels. The A4 numbers will come in at least 20-30 hp below a stick car, as a result of converter, and pumping losses.
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im looking to go with heads and cams also i have a 98 trans am ls1 a friend told me that
an ls6 cam and port my 241 heads and leave my ls6 intake on and it should get me around 80 hp looking to get some info on doing and looking for a good strong cam no to aggressive
something with a good lope and a good lift but street able thanks
an ls6 cam and port my 241 heads and leave my ls6 intake on and it should get me around 80 hp looking to get some info on doing and looking for a good strong cam no to aggressive
something with a good lope and a good lift but street able thanks
TECH Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 14,620
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From: BFE
There are a few choices mainly either ported 243/799 castings or aftermarket like AFR/TFS to name a couple.
For stock castings there are 2 suppliers that I've dealt with and that IMO stood above the rest in quality and performance gained:
Cartek 4X
AI 226cc
Of course there are disappointments as well but my main lesson in all this is to avoid marketing ploys. All in all, a budget head is just that, budget, hence budget performance.
In after market, TFS as cast is a good bang for bucks, I had mine worked on by TEA with only guides replaced so I could use stock rockers safely.
Best street combo I've done (throttle response) was with AFR 205 milled to 62cc and a variation of T. Mamo 224/228 cam.
For stock castings there are 2 suppliers that I've dealt with and that IMO stood above the rest in quality and performance gained:
Cartek 4X
AI 226cc
Of course there are disappointments as well but my main lesson in all this is to avoid marketing ploys. All in all, a budget head is just that, budget, hence budget performance.
In after market, TFS as cast is a good bang for bucks, I had mine worked on by TEA with only guides replaced so I could use stock rockers safely.
Best street combo I've done (throttle response) was with AFR 205 milled to 62cc and a variation of T. Mamo 224/228 cam.
Last edited by PREDATOR-Z; Apr 19, 2012 at 03:00 AM.
Thread Starter
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Joined: Feb 2012
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From: Lima,OH
Honestly I don't mind putting the money into the car I just want to see the results if you know what I mean... Since i'm unfamilar with the LS1 engine i don't know what to go with for the best performance. Money isn't a huge factor i can break the budget and not worry too much about it.. But i still want a streetable car if you know what i'm saying... I know all in all I will probably spend atleast 12k or more on this car with new paint job new hood and engine and maybe rear end.