Who is the best engine builder???
You guys are getting carried away with the "Best" terminology in this discussion. The original poster stated exactly what he was looking for, and even a target HP level. Just about all of our engine-building sponsors can hit 450 rwhp with a semi-radical camshaft and well ported heads. He wasn't asking for space-age custom $15-25K engines. lol
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From: Kansas City, MO
Originally Posted by Nine Ball
You guys are getting carried away with the "Best" terminology in this discussion. The original poster stated exactly what he was looking for, and even a target HP level. Just about all of our engine-building sponsors can hit 450 rwhp with a semi-radical camshaft and well ported heads. He wasn't asking for space-age custom $15-25K engines. lol
I just have to gripe when people pull out the "best" line.
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From: Kansas City, MO
The physicist I know used to build over 2hp/ci 430-odd cubic inch naturally aspirated Hemi engines. His piston design is still used in in a lot of race hemi.
It just depends on what you need. Most people (including myself) overbuild.
Last edited by DenzSS; Apr 13, 2004 at 12:18 PM.
Staging Lane
Joined: Mar 2004
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From: MI
I have had nothing but good expeirences with APE. I build my own engines and have had two of them dyno-tuned there. For one of the cars, they even stayed after close to finish the tune and cut me a good deal on top of it all. Everyone is pretty knowledgeable there, and there is alway at least a few F-bodies around the shop. Just my 2 cents, thank god someone besides the Modern Musclecar hacks are on the east side.
Thread Starter
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From: BFE
You guys are Funny. LOLBelieve me that if I had 25K to dish out on an engine it better make 650 rwhp easy N/A.
But from your feedbacks, I gather APE is on top of their game. I'll check them out.
Any ARE runners out there??
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From: Kansas City, MO
For what you are looking for, anyt number of people can build it. The higher the quality of the machining and parts, the higher the price is going to be. Good motors cost good money.
If you want to hit 450rwhp, you're going to need some very good heads and you're going to require a radical camshaft with a narrow power band.
I really wish people would quit focusing on peak HP numbers and start looking at the big picture. I've seen a lot of "400hp" engines destroy "450hp" engines at the track. Have the engine built for your car and for the purpose you desire. Don't build for just a peak number. Set your car up first and then build the engine to work with it.
If you want to hit 450rwhp, you're going to need some very good heads and you're going to require a radical camshaft with a narrow power band.
I really wish people would quit focusing on peak HP numbers and start looking at the big picture. I've seen a lot of "400hp" engines destroy "450hp" engines at the track. Have the engine built for your car and for the purpose you desire. Don't build for just a peak number. Set your car up first and then build the engine to work with it.
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I cast my vote for Futral Motorsports. Cammin beast is runnin one of their motors making almost the exact same stats you are looking for. There are severals running similar setups though, and they are well known for this.
Good Luck,
Josh
Good Luck,
Josh
Another vote for AP Engineering. Chris took the time to help me with my engine buildup to reach my goals and to work with my combo..... and to even make the customer service even better Chris offered to bring my new motor with them to the Spring Break Shoot Out in Texas..... free of charge..... There shop is in Michigan...... Thats customer service in my book and they have me as a customer on any other motor i plan on building in the future. Thanks again Chris and Brian and the whole gang at APE.
Kyle
Kyle
Just my .02 here, but you may not like it since I have an LT1. Obviously there's a cost/benefit tradeoff. (Learned this in economics and decision sciences the other day, hehe.) Is 40 horse out of a set of $5,000 pistons worth it? You could put $5,000 in a Rob Raymer turbo and get 500 horse! Depends on how much money you have and where you want to go. Again, just my .02.
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From: Kansas City, MO
Hell, I don't care if it's LT1 or BBC, they are all just engines.
Like we were saying, it depends on what you need. If you're racing in a class with a lot of restrictions, you have to squeeze everything out of it you can. If you're just racing on the street or having a little fun in heads up racing, then your requirements are significantly less.
There are guys around here buying $300 used camshafts and used valvesprings. People do all kinds of silly things.
Like we were saying, it depends on what you need. If you're racing in a class with a lot of restrictions, you have to squeeze everything out of it you can. If you're just racing on the street or having a little fun in heads up racing, then your requirements are significantly less.
There are guys around here buying $300 used camshafts and used valvesprings.
People do all kinds of silly things. Thread Starter
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Joined: Mar 2004
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From: BFE
What I need is what I stated in the begining of the thread./
347 forged, with (450rwhp+) capabilities N/A ready to accept 200 shot wet single stage N2O. Yet still driveable with an A4.
Bullet proof is what I want. I want to be able to shoot 200 if I want to, 300 if I want to, 400 if I want to. The only parameter I will allow to limit me will be tuning. If I don't tune it right, then BOOM! But the motor has to take it in the physical parameters.
347 forged, with (450rwhp+) capabilities N/A ready to accept 200 shot wet single stage N2O. Yet still driveable with an A4.
Bullet proof is what I want. I want to be able to shoot 200 if I want to, 300 if I want to, 400 if I want to. The only parameter I will allow to limit me will be tuning. If I don't tune it right, then BOOM! But the motor has to take it in the physical parameters.
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From: Toronto, Canada
ARE has already shipped a couple of motors to the middle east and had good results. I think you should take a look at thier website www.agostino-racing.com They list a killer street eliminator motor, stock displacement, that can be built to spec to handle a big shot and the price is good. Check out the site and or call the shop and speak to Nick or Paul Cowan
Thread Starter
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From: BFE
Took a look at the 346. Too weak IMO. 346/347/348 to handle minimum 200 shot and possible 300+ direct port, over and over again. Still driveable with A4 , 4000+ stall and 373 gearing.
I called Futral Motorsports with the EXACT same requirements you are mentioning. I also added I wanted a 10 second car on motor and 9 second car on a small 200 shot. Allan built my motor holding nothing back. I have a SMALL solid cam, LS6 heads, and a BULLIT proof bottom end. This motor hasnt blinked an eye since install. I will be jetting up to 350 as soon as my car returns from a lil "modification" 
#s on motor were 466/422 THROUGH 12 bolt/spool/4:56s, 28" ET Drags
TNT 200 shot were 658/790 with same setup and tuned for the gas.
See sig for ETs
FMS customer service/power/reliability is barnone some of the best I have seen in the industry(I have seen ALOT )
BTW, if you would like spec on my engine shoot me a PM, not that I have anything to hide, its just too much to type if you arent interested
#s on motor were 466/422 THROUGH 12 bolt/spool/4:56s, 28" ET Drags
TNT 200 shot were 658/790 with same setup and tuned for the gas.
See sig for ETs
FMS customer service/power/reliability is barnone some of the best I have seen in the industry(I have seen ALOT
) BTW, if you would like spec on my engine shoot me a PM, not that I have anything to hide, its just too much to type if you arent interested
Staging Lane
Joined: Aug 2003
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Your goals are achievable from just about all the engine builders out there, including the ones you mention. I would pick a shop that is convenient to where you live, so that any follow-up work and tuning will be convenient. Ask about a shop that is close-by and I am sure you will get opinions. I have had a motor built by Garry Grimes - very pricey but very stout, and one by Lamar Walden, less expensive and they are great guys to work with. Frutal also does good work - that covers the Southeast. Northeast I would go with Carteck, Texas - LGM, etc. etc.
Good luck with your choice.
Les
Good luck with your choice.
Les
Originally Posted by PREDATOR-Z
ARE, Cartech, Absolut Speed, etc............
Need forged 347 450+rwhp N/A + 200 shot N20 wet. Target 650->700rwhp on Nitrous.
All feedback will be appreciated.
Need forged 347 450+rwhp N/A + 200 shot N20 wet. Target 650->700rwhp on Nitrous.
All feedback will be appreciated.