Curious why/how this damage occurred?
01-28-2013, 10:55 AM
#21
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I will definitely pass the info along, I've heard several oil retailers preach about the ZDDP content since the EPA's intervention, but I hadn't seen any first hand damage as a result. Without seeing damage I'd become skeptical.
I'd still like to know if this was friction induced (which it appears to be), why only the front cylinders?
I'd still like to know if this was friction induced (which it appears to be), why only the front cylinders?
01-28-2013, 10:59 AM
#22
Welcome to the world of Comp Camshafts. I've got an entire scrap bin slap full of failed Comp camshafts that I've pulled over the last 2 years. Hence why I went to Cam Motion and never looked back. A lot of other vendors who sell Comp stuff know this is going on too, they just won't talk about it because it's a product they sell.
However Martin @ Tick brings up a very good point. All of you reading this post who have aftermarket cams, do yourself a favor and get a zinc additive to add to your oil changes. This is the one I use and IMO is the best on the market and can be bought at your local parts store for around $10:
However Martin @ Tick brings up a very good point. All of you reading this post who have aftermarket cams, do yourself a favor and get a zinc additive to add to your oil changes. This is the one I use and IMO is the best on the market and can be bought at your local parts store for around $10:
01-28-2013, 11:09 AM
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Updated info:
Factory rockers
Factory lifters (had wear and pitting on the lifters for the damaged lobes)
Shimmed comp single springs (he can't remember which springs)
If the oil suggestion is the culprit, he said since the change in oil regulations he has not been running the formula with the ZDDP added back in. He mentioned you have to run the race only oil to get that.
Thanks for the info Damian, I appreciate it.
Factory rockers
Factory lifters (had wear and pitting on the lifters for the damaged lobes)
Shimmed comp single springs (he can't remember which springs)
If the oil suggestion is the culprit, he said since the change in oil regulations he has not been running the formula with the ZDDP added back in. He mentioned you have to run the race only oil to get that.
Thanks for the info Damian, I appreciate it.
01-28-2013, 05:34 PM
#24
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01-28-2013, 11:14 PM
#27
Get this man a prize.
BTW, the stuff Damian posted is fine to use also and could possibly raise your ZDDP levels higher than any oil could. There are some oils out there though that have 2000ppm ZDDP and higher. Start to get a little spendy when VR1 or the additives will do the trick for a hydraulic roller street motor and do it cheaper. Hell, we even use the VR1 in our race cars with solid rollers.
BTW, the stuff Damian posted is fine to use also and could possibly raise your ZDDP levels higher than any oil could. There are some oils out there though that have 2000ppm ZDDP and higher. Start to get a little spendy when VR1 or the additives will do the trick for a hydraulic roller street motor and do it cheaper. Hell, we even use the VR1 in our race cars with solid rollers.
Last edited by Sales@Tick; 01-28-2013 at 11:23 PM.
01-29-2013, 12:10 AM
#28
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Then I would say that is an issue in itself. The problem with todays synthetics and normal oils is they do not have enough anti-wear agents present in the oils composition, namely ZDDP which contains zinc and phosphorous(sp.) to name a few. Without these anti-wear agents, things like this begin to happen along with increased rocker arm pad wear and valve tip wear.
Any of you guys that are running aftermarket cams, springs and/or lifters need to be running an oil that carries higher quantities of ZDDP. The cheapest oil that comes to mind that has the minimum amount of ZDDP that I like to see is Shell Rotella Diesel oil. You can get it at Wal-mart in a gallon for like 10-12 maybe 15 bucks at the most. Any other diesel oil will have a minimum of 1100-1200ppm of ZDDP which is good, but there are better oils. Here at our shop, any car that comes through our doors that gets an aftermarket cam has their oil changed and replaced with Valvoline VR1 CONVENTIONAL racing oil. It has over 1400-1500ppm of ZDDP which is more along the lines of what I like to see. It's only 5.50-6.0 bucks a quart so it's cheaper than most other oils available. You can get it at O'reilys, Advanced or Auto-Zone 9/10 and if they don't have it they can order it for you.
Today's oil's that I will refer to as "shelf" oils have to meet EPA requirements for ZDDP which puts it at no more than 800ppm and some of the fancy "greener" oils and "fuel economy" oils have even less! This can spell disaster for a performance engine namely the valve-train that is being put through forces and pressures that these oils just can't protect against. There are also some of the European formulas like "German Castrol" that carry 1000ppm, but we can do better than that with oils like diesel oil and VR1.
Do yourselves, your wallet and your engine a favor and use one of the oils that contain these higher amounts of ZDDP. Now, all that said, I'm not pointing the finger at the oil or that if he had used a different oil this wouldn't of happened, but it damn sure couldn't of hurt anything and it might of been able to avert this from happening.
Any of you guys that are running aftermarket cams, springs and/or lifters need to be running an oil that carries higher quantities of ZDDP. The cheapest oil that comes to mind that has the minimum amount of ZDDP that I like to see is Shell Rotella Diesel oil. You can get it at Wal-mart in a gallon for like 10-12 maybe 15 bucks at the most. Any other diesel oil will have a minimum of 1100-1200ppm of ZDDP which is good, but there are better oils. Here at our shop, any car that comes through our doors that gets an aftermarket cam has their oil changed and replaced with Valvoline VR1 CONVENTIONAL racing oil. It has over 1400-1500ppm of ZDDP which is more along the lines of what I like to see. It's only 5.50-6.0 bucks a quart so it's cheaper than most other oils available. You can get it at O'reilys, Advanced or Auto-Zone 9/10 and if they don't have it they can order it for you.
Today's oil's that I will refer to as "shelf" oils have to meet EPA requirements for ZDDP which puts it at no more than 800ppm and some of the fancy "greener" oils and "fuel economy" oils have even less! This can spell disaster for a performance engine namely the valve-train that is being put through forces and pressures that these oils just can't protect against. There are also some of the European formulas like "German Castrol" that carry 1000ppm, but we can do better than that with oils like diesel oil and VR1.
Do yourselves, your wallet and your engine a favor and use one of the oils that contain these higher amounts of ZDDP. Now, all that said, I'm not pointing the finger at the oil or that if he had used a different oil this wouldn't of happened, but it damn sure couldn't of hurt anything and it might of been able to avert this from happening.
01-29-2013, 07:26 AM
#29
That is one of the ones IIRC that has over 2000ppm ZDDP. You're in good hands there with the Brad Penn oil. You don't need a 20w-50 though as a 10w-30 or if you really feel the need to run a thicker oil a 10w-40 would be fine and free up some ponies.
01-29-2013, 08:10 AM
#30
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Anybody happen to know the approximate zddp concentration in Amsoil stuff? I've been running it in my bolt on car but when it comes time for cam swap I'm wondering if that's a bad idea. Sorry for the threadjack.
01-29-2013, 04:03 PM
#35
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