It's about time to get serious on my build. The car is a 99 Z28 with 170k miles. It's an auto and was my dd for a long time. Now that I can afford it, I've started gathering parts. I have a Performabuilt lvl 2 4L60E and Yank 3400 combo already. I already installed a MWC Fab 9 setup with their adjustable LCAs and PHB, along with a 3.5" aluminum PST driveshaft. The rear is a 4.10 geared, billet clutch posi unit.

Two things that are up in the air are the Speed Engineering 1 3/4" headers and Dorman LS6 intake I already have. I bought the headers before I had a big build planned and they also hadn't announced plans for 1 7/8", so it is what it is. The intake is simply me taking one for the team because we all want to know how well it does after being worked over.

This will be a naturally aspirated setup. I know FI is easier power, but this is just want I want for my first build. I had a new "LQ9" that ended up being an LQ4 so I sold that and still managed a profit. Now I'm thinking about going with a built short block and aftermarket heads. I'd rather spend the extra and not worry about power or rpm limitations. So ultimately the question is, with all the above info in mind, what would you build for a strictly street car. It will likely never see the track and will be full weight with a/c and all accessories. Im not hunting a dyno number, nor am I on any particular budget. I can build whatever I want here, BUT I am frugal and would like to reliably make the most horsepower for the money spent. (says everyone ever, I know)

Anyway, throw out some ideas. I know all the supporting mods and little things I'll need. Just trying to sort out my motor plans first. Again, this is a naturally aspirated build.

 

Get the biggest cubic inch aluminum short block you can afford and then get Tony Mamo involved. Let him do the heads with a cam to match them.... then let him do his magic on the FAST intake. No one else I've seem is making the power he is making out of his combos with mild daily drivable cams.

 

See that's the problem... What I can afford and where I should cut myself off are two entirely different things I keep going back and forth between spending an obscene amount for more than I'll ever need and doing a budget build of sorts that will still be tons of fun and reliable. I know the route you suggested is the proper thing to do. My only reservation in spending a lot would then be being too scared of hurting it to enjoy it. I'm trying to find the middle ground where I can beat on it consistently and confidently, but also not really care that I'm doing so.

I can't even decide between cathedral or rectangular port heads. I read the current thread on that topic and don't want to start a debate, but I really just don't know. And I don't need a super friendly cam. In fact, I'd prefer it so violent it makes children cry. But that will be my last step so it compliments the rest of the build.

 

What cubic inch motor is you thinking about?

I'm a fan of both heads cause I think both has they place.........
Race car I'll go rectangular head
Street car I'll go cathedral
Cathedral heads are easier to cam and also make more of a flatter torque curve where a rectangular torque curve is just very peaky. A friend of mine that used to be on here all the time proved that cathedral heads (tfs/afr) will be 3-4 tenths quicker in the quarter..... at least it was in his 402ci 6 speed WS6. Rectangular heads really start to shine/breath around 4000-4500 RPM. Most real street cars never go over 6500 rpm....... sure a rectangular head can make great torque too but the cam is very very CRITICAL due to the rectangular head having a poor intake/exhaust ratio.... that's why you see large splits on cams meant for a rectangular headed motor. And the guys that runs the fastest with those heads is very secretive about their cam specs and more that like they spin the hell out of they motors .... like north of 7200 rpm all the time. No need in for you going with a iron block either. Most guys that have a iron block don't even really need a iron block especially if you staying naturally aspirated. Weight on naturally aspirated cars is critical ... so why add a 100 pounds to the nose? I wouldn't do a iron block unless you plan on going with boost or a lot of juice down the road....

 

Are you wanting to start with a LQ9 again?

 

Since you already have the Dorman LS6, have you seen how Peak Speed ports them ?

 

IIWM I'd look into a Texas Speed 402 (LS2 based) or 416 (LS3 based) short block...even the Scoggin Dickey El' Toro Grande 413 short block seems like a really nice combo. Then as Tusky mentioned, Tony Mamo has some great new cathedral heads coming out that when paired with a Tick (Martin) or EPS custom cam would really run hard. Your car seems set up properly with trans/rearend but the only reason I'd say to stay away from the "go F**K yourself sounding" camshaft is that your stall is only 3400 and not 4400. In for your build thread for sure......

 

If it is never going to see the track I don't see any point in most of what has been recommended.

Make sure the engine you have is in good shape, if that means pistons and rods fine.
You have the 1 3/4" headers and LS6 intake let's work with those and get a good CNC 243/799, or even consider your 241s through someone like Advanced Induction, let a reputable vendor like AI, Cam Motion, Tick, Tooley etc. spec a cam.

Without doing anything real expensive and without aftermarket heads or intake, or added displacement this should momentarily break true street tires loose at 45mph before it takes off like a rocket, should easily run fast enough at the track to mandate a rollbar if you ever did decide to go and saves you $5000+ vs. if you went huge cubic inches with aftermarket heads and FAST. Would a 400+ci motor with Mast and FAST etc. involved make more power, sure, but not power you will be able to use in a true street car on the street with any regularity.

If you truly have no budget in mind and don't mind spending $10,000+ then by all means give it hell and do the big inch aftermarket everything, but in my experience most folks who say they don't really have a budget still choke when they see how much an engine built from scratch costs.

 

That intake even ported will choke down a Stroker. I would suggest
Either a LS2, LS3, or LS2 W/ 4.00 stroke, MMS220s out of the box
Untouched, no need for light valves! Medium cam 231*/235*-
239*/243* (depending on CI) .620"/.600" LSA determined by
Gears, Stall, and how much Lope! You want determined by Tony
Or Kip. Ported FAST 102 on a Stroker probably worth 20+ HP VS
Ported LS6/Dorman.
Good Luck!

 

Everyone on here knows Tony heads will blow a ported 243 head out the water Caprice.... LOL

I completely understand what you saying about it'll never see the track but still... The heads is what makes a motor inhale and exhale. (Example) If the OP has a rwhp goal of 460 rwhp .... I rather have mamo heads with a 224-227 cam that drives like a dream without surge or bucky as hell instead of having ported 243 heads with a 240 cam that drives like **** but that's just me!!

 

Wow! A lot of stuff to consider in here. The yank 3400 came with my trans, both used, otherwise I would have went with at least a 4000. So yeah, that will limit cam selection of course. I was joking about the crying children part lol And like I said, I just want to see what the Dorman LS6 will do. I can always upgrade to a FAST if I were ever to desire that extra little bump.

If I knew my current motor was fine, I'd use it and we wouldn't even be having this discussion. However, with the miles on it and the weak rod bolts, I'd rather sell it and move to something new that's built how I want. I'm not really hung up on aluminum over iron, but I do see the obvious benefit. That won't make the decision for me though. As for choking when I see what motors cost, nahhh... I've been looking at them for over a year now. I'm fairly numb to the sticker shock lol

I'll throw out what I had been considering and we can expand the discussion from there. TMS 370 with PRC 225 as cast and a custom grind. Aaaaaaand go!

Edit: I wonder how the Mamo heads will compare price wise? If I knew they would be in the same ballpark I'd just wait on those and call it a day. Basically build the bottom end around the heads I want to use. *** backwards....but with no apologies in that case lol

 

I run a TMS 370 myself, and am extremely happy with it. Overall it was my best bang for the buck option, considering all I really needed to do was transfer over my HCI.

 

This may just be the single best line ever posted on ls1tech lol.

With that said I realie you may not have a budget for that. I also havent read throught he entire thread so I apologize if my questions or comments are repeated. What is your overall budget for the engine?

Aluminum block cost more money, dont worry about strength as thats not an issue till you approach 2000ish hp. Aluminum will be 100lbs lighter though, and it will be over the nose. Not only do you usually not want to add weight but yu really dont want it in th front of the car for many reasons. TMS as HCI said are good people. They have an ls3 short block (376 ci) starting at 3299 which is a screaming deal imo. I'd start with that and then if you can afford it go to tony mamo and have him build you a combo. He is famous for doing exactly what you want, great driveability with a ton of power.

Unfortunately that happens with really good heads and a small cam and really good heads cost money lol. I would stay with cathedral heads for reasons posted by tusky on a street car. The ls3 shrotblock is basically the same size as a 383 stroked ls1 just with a larger bore but smaller stroke which is good for head options among other things. That with a set of mamofied cathedrals and you would be in business. If you wanted to save a good penny you could find some used AFR heads and have tony work his magic on those as opposed to buying new castings from him.

 

HCI- Can you actually feel the extra weight when you're driving the car? Like I said, I'm not gonna be bracket racing or anything. But if the extra weight on the front end would be noticeable in a street car, I'll probably stick with aluminum.

Although I don't really have a budget in mind, it seems that would help everyone make cost-friendly, bang for buck suggestions. I think a stock used LQ9 short block plus new cathedral heads and cam of my choosing should come in around $5,000, all said and done. Therefore I expect to spend no less than that regardless of what I do. Between the Performabuilt/Yank combo and MWC rear and suspension I already have, I only have $1200 invested. With that said, I think it's fair to go ahead and spend a little bit more on this. Let's open up the budget for a motor to $8,000. Less is obviously better, but I'd rather do it right this time than have to redo it later.

 

Seems my last post was completely overlooked. A rebuilt 5.7l with ported OEM heads and LS6 intake with 3400 stall and 4.10s should be a handful WOT at legal speeds on true street tires.

There are plenty of ways to make more power, that wont be useable, and will cost 2-3 times as much.

Give that a little more stall and a fancy intake and it can be even more of a handful without the expense of aftermarket heads, roller rockers, stroker.

 

Sorry I'm on my phone and can't see all the posts while I'm typing. Easy to forget a few when trying to address so many different opinions in one post.

Yeah I considered that, but once I estimated the cost of buying all the parts, machine work, and assembly, it just seemed like it wouldn't be a cost effective option. Even if I broke even on the cost of a new motor vs rebuilding what've have, I'd rather have the one with more cubes and that I bought from a sponsor here that specializes in LS stuff. Not to mention the local "speed shop" has a bad reputation for putting things together incorrectly then not standing behind it. I have stock 853 heads so I'd be upgrading to a ported 243 at the very least. At that point I may as well go with the PRC 225 for the small price difference. I know I could sell the stock motor for $1,000 locally because everyone wants them to put in 90s model short beds. So if I opted not to take it apart, I could apply that $1,000 toward a new stronger bottom end. That's where my head is at right now. If I'm incorrect on any of that, please tell me. Like I said, this is my first build so I'll be the first to tell you I don't know everything.

 

I'm not go say what I want to say...... I might get banned LOL. Just watch out for people/companies saying they head is better than the competitor head and in the real world they really not.

 

I honestly think your plan sounds pretty good for a street car, although I'd use a TSM stock replacement LS2 short block. I just don't see the need for a forged bottom end in a street motor so why spend the money, and I'd rather save the weight over an iron block. If you do get a motor with forged pistons I'd use 4032 alloy pistons and not 2618's, a motor with 2618's probably wont last a third as long as a motor built with 4032 alloy pistons.

 

Good info. That's a question I meant to ask already. It seems TMS short blocks that lack forged internals are rated by them at 450 hp. I intend to make more than that. While I realize that's a safe rating on their end for liability reasons, I'm still more comfortable going overkill than not. So I was and still am really curious what sort of internals I actually will need. Stock crank will be fine and I'll obviously have rod bolts thrown in whatever I do. But rods and pistons, forged or not.... That's where I'm kind of lost as to where to spend the extra, given my fairly mild goals.

 

Get Mamofied!! I got some Ford buddies with cobras and they even fear his name LOL!! REAL TALK. They know if Tony help out with the combo that you not playing games on the street and you a BEAST to say the least. Reliability is in the valve train.... get morel link bar lifters and you'll be ahead of the game.