I picked up a 2002 WS6 roller and T56 a few weeks ago. Essentially, it's missing the long block (intake to oilpan) and a clutch. I'd like to buy a block and work everything around that towards a stout h/c/i street car that I can take to the track a few times a year and longer cruises a few times a year.

So the big question is, why are people doing heads and cam LS1s instead of LQ4/LQ9s? Why not go with the bigger displacement if everything bolts up the exact same way. I can put the same h/c/i package on either block. And since the two blocks are relatively the same price, weight can't be the only issue.

Am I right in thinking its a "future plans" thing? What I mean is, if I blow an LQ9, then I'm one step closer to building a 4xx ci engine because I already have the iron block.

Why LS over LQ or visa versa?

 

It's 100 lbs added to the nose of your car. If you have to use an iron 6.0 block built it big (408+) the first time around and you won't regret it.

 

That is the exact answer that I WASNT looking for...the extra displacement makes up for the 100 lbs, that's why I said "weight can't be the only issue". Also, my budget isn't geared toward a 408. The question is, if I want to throw in a block that is compatible with the same heads, same cam, same intake, same everything , why an LS1 over an LQ9?

 

Weight is the answer, whether you want to hear it or not. Pound per horsepower isn't the sole focus. That extra weight effects other aspects of the car, such as handling and braking. People who have more than just acceleration to worry about may not want the extra 100lbs on the nose of the car.

 

You sound like youve got your mind made up, so I feel silly but I will give it a go anyway. Weight, or lack of, = HP, or going faster. Quite simply, the push to the iron 6.0 is for one major reason, price. Iron motors are always cheaper then aluminum which is why the average car gets swapped to iron. So lets compare apples. You buy iron to do a simple H/C/I on motor combo. After its done, you ride for a bit, maybe get dyno numbers, maybe get track numbers, then what? Are you through, forever? At the point in the game youd be, weight is the very next way to get more performance. So you start trimming weight, 100 here was easy, 100 there not too bad, each time rewarded with a performance increase. Hey this is great, a little time and effort and you are getting continued performance gains, I mean thats what modding is about right? Then all the sudden the weight gets harder to find, it starts costing more and more. Lightweight parts start adding up, your spending $1500 on brakes to save 75 pounds, stuff like that. Then you realize youve got 100 pounds of dead weight on your front end that can never go away. You're trying so hard to make your combo be the best it can be and that wasted weight haunts you. A 6.0 aluminum block would make more sense for this combo trying to make it work at its peak potential. I guess I'm the type who always looks to his next mod, trying to plan ahead, trying to make the car run better. The only way id run iron block is if I was doing a retarded high hp build and needed the block strength, otherwise its aluminum all day in my car. I dont see a reason for any NA engine to be iron. I guess it comes down to do you want your junk to run ok, or above average? That's for you to decide.

 

If you do plan to go forced induction at any point, my experience with the 4G63 engine that ran for years in the mitsu lineup was bulletproof and most would attribute is iron block as a big reason. I went with the LQ4 simply because I wanted good power (450-500hp) as it may see occasional track days but will mostly be a fair weather driver. Give I paid $800 for it complete with harness and wiring price made it an easy decision. Know where you want to go, and do it right the first time. Good luck.

 

http://shop.brutespeed.com/ERL-Iron-...64-M-HC-PA.htm
ERL Iron LQ9 10.3/1 364 Turbo Race Shortblock

http://shop.brutespeed.com/ERL-V2-40...-LS-4-Bolt.htm
ERL V2 408 LS 4 Bolt Stock Sleeve Short block 11.2:1

http://shop.brutespeed.com/ERL-V5-41...-LS-4-Bolt.htm
ERL V5 416 LS 4 Bolt Stock Sleeve Short block 11.2:1

When you price everything out (machine shop cost, etc) that goes into building a shortblock, it is hard to beat the prices on the assembled ERL shortblocks in the above links. Bob

 

Iron is heavier, cheaper, and can be built bigger and badder (unless you're talking about newer alum big bore blocks). Rebuilding is slightly cheaper because you can use the block again.

Alum is lighter, harder to come by, far more expensive, and essentially one time rebuild.

If you aren't doing a power adder the alum wins hands down. That little bit of displacement does NOT make up for added weight. You're talking a very small gain in torque between the two unless you stroke it.

Which is faster in same car, Iron 6.0 or Alum 6.0? Alum every time.
Same scenario, which car stops faster, handles better, and drives more predictable? Alum every time.

 

Smart man. Most have iron on the brain.

 

Bob, I didn't see on your site, but do you have the M2? It's the resleeved NA shortblocks... the 434 is looking like the ticket for what I want to do...

 

Another factor aside from weight that you clearly arent concerned about is compression ratio between the iron and aluminum blocks in stock form. Lq's are lower compression than Ls's which leans towards boost friendly builds. Building a n/a Lqx might yield slight bottom to midrange torque curve than overall hp. You just need to settle on what you want the car to do and build things from there.I dont circuit race my car..having the added nose weight of the Lq and turbo stuff doesnt feel heavier unless im at slow speeds.Im also not chasing a numbers at the dragstrip that every lbs I can shave has to go.I wanted a fun street beast..my version of fun wont be the same as others,there is no wrong way to enjoy an iron or alum block if setup right for your goals with the right chassis.

If 6.0/6.2 alum blocks were easy to come by at the price of an lq..it would be in my car now with my turbo ontop...just cause I can! Id drive either one just as hard with a smile..till it breaks.

 

Then don't ask long winded convoluted questions.

 

I actually made the switch from a LS1 to the LQ9. I used the same HCI and the torque from the 6.0 was definitely a little better. If it's just a street car you'll never notice the extra 100 lbs, and in terms of performance the torque from the extra cubes easily offsets the extra weight. That's just my opinion and experience

 

The big question is budget? If budget is limited then iron block 408, forged bottom end, stock head castings with porting, and custom cam. Results - 450 rwhp or better na. After market heads maybe 550 rwhp. The new Dart ls3 heads seem the hot ticket currently. The Dart heads will support a future big cube motor, na or fi.

 

http://shop.brutespeed.com/ERL-M2-42...-M-O-LC-NA.htm

Here is the M2, let me know if you have any questions. They are in stock and ready to ship. Thanks. Bob