Thoughts on NA 5.3 L33 build
07-13-2016, 10:22 AM
#21
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Well said, mercier
07-13-2016, 12:40 PM
#22
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Damn, you guys just keep cranking out the awesome info. I plan on seeking out an L33 for a swap into my 89 Supra. From the looks of it, I'll be able to toss a small stack of cash into this, and be zipping through autox, and road courses.
07-13-2016, 04:39 PM
#23
I gotcha...
If you really want to rev the engine have you considered picking up a 4.8? They are usually dirt cheap. Or maybe just a 4.8 crank/rods? (I paid $140 for a 4.8 rotating assy) You could bore the alum 5.3 out to 3.9”, toss in some cheap hyper pistons ($240 last I looked) with the 4.8 crank/rods and make a rev happy destroked 331 pretty cheap. You save 80lbs going with the alum 5.3 over the iron, so the savings aren’t that huge. Could always just punch a 4.8 iron block out to 3.9” and go to town.
If you really want to rev the engine have you considered picking up a 4.8? They are usually dirt cheap. Or maybe just a 4.8 crank/rods? (I paid $140 for a 4.8 rotating assy) You could bore the alum 5.3 out to 3.9”, toss in some cheap hyper pistons ($240 last I looked) with the 4.8 crank/rods and make a rev happy destroked 331 pretty cheap. You save 80lbs going with the alum 5.3 over the iron, so the savings aren’t that huge. Could always just punch a 4.8 iron block out to 3.9” and go to town.
I still haven't completely abandoned the previously mentioned idea of a 6.0L aluminum block with the 4.8 crank and rods with the 6.0L pistons....as far as I can tell (please correct me if Im wrong), everything pretty much transfers over...
The whole idea is that I want a motor that revs quickly, and pulls through 7000 RPM...for me thats fun to drive. Obviously, winding the motor out to 7000 doesn't do you any good if the power curve takes a nose dive or flattens out at 6300 RPM. Some of those early 5.3 N/A builds were what got me interested in this kind of build as I do enjoy the way some old european cars drive...its just that my first attempt at an LS build was going in my '72 C20, which needed to be the exact opposite of what we're talking about here.
07-14-2016, 08:24 AM
#24
I still haven't completely abandoned the previously mentioned idea of a 6.0L aluminum block with the 4.8 crank and rods with the 6.0L pistons....as far as I can tell (please correct me if Im wrong), everything pretty much transfers over...
The whole idea is that I want a motor that revs quickly, and pulls through 7000 RPM...for me thats fun to drive. Obviously, winding the motor out to 7000 doesn't do you any good if the power curve takes a nose dive or flattens out at 6300 RPM. Some of those early 5.3 N/A builds were what got me interested in this kind of build as I do enjoy the way some old european cars drive...its just that my first attempt at an LS build was going in my '72 C20, which needed to be the exact opposite of what we're talking about here.
The whole idea is that I want a motor that revs quickly, and pulls through 7000 RPM...for me thats fun to drive. Obviously, winding the motor out to 7000 doesn't do you any good if the power curve takes a nose dive or flattens out at 6300 RPM. Some of those early 5.3 N/A builds were what got me interested in this kind of build as I do enjoy the way some old european cars drive...its just that my first attempt at an LS build was going in my '72 C20, which needed to be the exact opposite of what we're talking about here.
07-14-2016, 08:42 AM
#25
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There is a 6.0 with 4.8 rods/crank and LS3 top end here on the forums somewhere that made huge numbers. With 12.5:1 compression and E85 he made ~630 or so on an engine dyno, and double that with a little boost.
07-14-2016, 09:10 AM
#26
It's doable without a lot of $$. If we are really thinking outside the box here, 4" bore opens up the possibility of LS3-style heads. It might be a little soft in low RPMs but a 34X-ish short block with those large intake ports and careful camming would be a total rev monster.
LS2 block, with the 4.8 crank and rods, and stock L92 heads could make for an interesting combo....obviously with this being a street car, Im looking more in the 10.5:1 CR range...
But then again, the L33 short block with properly massaged 799 heads and the right valve train also sounds like it will get the desired results. I guess at that point, it comes down to which option is more cost effective and will have the driving characteristics Im looking for given the rest of the drivetrain set up.
07-14-2016, 09:46 AM
#27
Yea, Im going to shoot the cam motion guys an email here in a minute just to get their thoughts on the subject seeing as how the cam/valvetrain set up would be key to this whole thing working properly.
LS2 block, with the 4.8 crank and rods, and stock L92 heads could make for an interesting combo....obviously with this being a street car, Im looking more in the 10.5:1 CR range...
But then again, the L33 short block with properly massaged 799 heads and the right valve train also sounds like it will get the desired results. I guess at that point, it comes down to which option is more cost effective and will have the driving characteristics Im looking for given the rest of the drivetrain set up.
LS2 block, with the 4.8 crank and rods, and stock L92 heads could make for an interesting combo....obviously with this being a street car, Im looking more in the 10.5:1 CR range...
But then again, the L33 short block with properly massaged 799 heads and the right valve train also sounds like it will get the desired results. I guess at that point, it comes down to which option is more cost effective and will have the driving characteristics Im looking for given the rest of the drivetrain set up.
07-14-2016, 09:49 AM
#28
Restricted User
But then again, the L33 short block with properly massaged 799 heads and the right valve train also sounds like it will get the desired results. I guess at that point, it comes down to which option is more cost effective and will have the driving characteristics Im looking for given the rest of the drivetrain set up.
Car only weighs 3100 lbs and makes low-mid range torque. Very fun car for sure.
07-14-2016, 04:49 PM
#30
Slight tangent, but the factory L33 with flat top pistons is advertised at 10.0:1 compression and I believe those 799 cylinder heads have 64cc chambers. How much/what size chamber would you have to mill the heads to in order to bump compression to 11:1?
Im mostly interested in what size cam would be possible without running into PTV issues.
Im mostly interested in what size cam would be possible without running into PTV issues.
07-14-2016, 05:42 PM
#31
There is a nice calculator you can run on a PC here:
http://www.cammotion.com/engine-calculators.php
I roughly think you would have to get to around 57cc all else unchanged. I am NOT the expert on this but I think that puts you at .040" or more milling which is high. Seems like most use .030" as the reasonable ceiling which might put you in the 10.7:1 range?
It's really more cam timing than raw lift that determines your PTV. As long as the piston gets out of the way and everything is timed right, you can theoretically have all the lift you want.
http://www.cammotion.com/engine-calculators.php
I roughly think you would have to get to around 57cc all else unchanged. I am NOT the expert on this but I think that puts you at .040" or more milling which is high. Seems like most use .030" as the reasonable ceiling which might put you in the 10.7:1 range?
It's really more cam timing than raw lift that determines your PTV. As long as the piston gets out of the way and everything is timed right, you can theoretically have all the lift you want.
07-14-2016, 06:51 PM
#32
Nice, thanks.
Yea, my 2003 Z06 was running 61cc 243 heads and an old 230/232 592/595 112 with no issue. I'd have to dig up the paperwork, but I think that was .020" taken off when I sent them to Advanced Induction. That set up on an LS6 ran really, really well.
Yea, my 2003 Z06 was running 61cc 243 heads and an old 230/232 592/595 112 with no issue. I'd have to dig up the paperwork, but I think that was .020" taken off when I sent them to Advanced Induction. That set up on an LS6 ran really, really well.
07-25-2016, 05:37 PM
#33
Anybody seen this article before on Jalopnik?? It also talks about the 4.8L crank in the 6.0L block....http://oppositelock.kinja.com/high-r...327-1505698190
Id really love to see some results from a build like this
Id really love to see some results from a build like this
07-25-2016, 06:07 PM
#34
Guy over on turbo forums did a budget destroke on a 6.0. He really likes it. I don't think he is revving it high enough to take advantage of all the effort personally. But it's twin turbo and darn cool!
http://www.theturboforums.com/thread...highlight=twin
http://www.theturboforums.com/thread...highlight=twin
07-25-2016, 07:26 PM
#35
just read through all 15 pages....sounds like a cool set up....makes me wonder what it would do N/A at just under 11:1 with a 6 spd and 4.10s in the rear.
Anyone know what year 6.0L pistons just bolt up to the 4.8L rods? They were talking about the floating pins vs the non floaters being slightly different sizes
Reread....looks like its the 2004 LS2 pistons bolt up to the 4.8L rods
Anyone know what year 6.0L pistons just bolt up to the 4.8L rods? They were talking about the floating pins vs the non floaters being slightly different sizes
Reread....looks like its the 2004 LS2 pistons bolt up to the 4.8L rods
07-25-2016, 08:16 PM
#36
Def. not limited to LS2. Stick to the same generation and they are almost all compatible. Any gen3 4.8 rod is compatible with a gen3 6.0 piston. Same goes for gen4 stuff. 2004 and under are usually gen3 press pin small rods and 05 and up are floating. Few acceptions to the rule in there.
Last edited by Forcefed86; 07-26-2016 at 08:22 AM.
07-25-2016, 08:21 PM
#37
just read through all 15 pages....sounds like a cool set up....makes me wonder what it would do N/A at just under 11:1 with a 6 spd and 4.10s in the rear.
Anyone know what year 6.0L pistons just bolt up to the 4.8L rods? They were talking about the floating pins vs the non floaters being slightly different sizes
Reread....looks like its the 2004 LS2 pistons bolt up to the 4.8L rods
Anyone know what year 6.0L pistons just bolt up to the 4.8L rods? They were talking about the floating pins vs the non floaters being slightly different sizes
Reread....looks like its the 2004 LS2 pistons bolt up to the 4.8L rods
07-26-2016, 10:17 AM
#39
LS2 is a 2006 engine (Gen4). It will be a floating pin design. I believe any gen4 floating rod would be interchangeable with that piston. I know you can use a GEN4 6.0 Piston on a Gen4 4.8 rod.
Gen4 VS Gen3 Rod.
Gen4 pistons (right side) have the snap ring for floating pin.
Gen4 VS Gen3 Rod.
Gen4 pistons (right side) have the snap ring for floating pin.
07-26-2016, 10:26 AM
#40
Almost. I have a 2005 Vette engine and it is surely a LS2 with 243 heads, front (1x)cam gear and a 24X reluctor wheel. So a bit of a hybrid but I do think that it is largely gen IV other than the crank/cam reluctors. 2006-up I think are solidly 58x/4x reluctors.