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I have a set of Trick Flow 215 CNC Heads that are showing a problem between the valves.
Please see the picture,
Do I send it, scrap it, or weld it before it scraps itself?
This is a 2004 5.7 LS6 block, all forged bottom end, medium cam. T&D shaft rockers.
3 of the four on both heads. The last cyl is ok, 3rd one is starting to go bad.
I showed these to what I believe was an apprentice machine shop/engine builder. He was going to show it to his lead guy for his opinion. They build race motors, so I suspect he's seen it before. The apprentice thought the valve seats could come loose. I wonder if that's where my valve noise is coming from.
I have a set of 215's also, that have had bigger, 2.055 intake valves put in them by someone who the previous owner had do it.
This is off topic a bit, but I have had 2 sets of rockers fail on me. Both Harland Sharp, one had a bunch of broken fulcrums, replaced 15/16, and the 2nd set, which had just over a thousand miles, had the rollers start eating into the bodies of the rockers! Now, after the 1st set, I put new lifters, trays, springs, seals, head gaskets..it had some crap running through the motor, as it dropped the oil p/u bolt, and broke it...motor is out now, and having it all checked. Was planning on doing powder metal guides in the heads and run bronze bushed stock bodies, at least until I get another set of heads, but I'm wondering if it isn't an issue with the heads myself! Have you had any other issues? I see you have shaft rockers...I was going to pull the trigger, but hate to drop a grand, then destroy them! Sorry, I knowwe it's not helping what you're looking for, but kind of wondering myself wtf is up! Are yours actually loosing seat material between the valves? How many miles, or passes, and what kind of compression? Almost looks like it melted down the weak point. Should be able to get the seats refinished. I'd check with the guys at Frankenstein. They were great to me, even after I ended up not being able to get a set of their heads... that's who I'll be calling when I do though!
I bought this car as a wreck. it was running but very noisy. I do know some of the history of the engine. It did have rocker problems with rocker studs pulling out. They heili coiled them to fix them. After a few times doing this they decided that the .595/605 lift cam was too big and went with a smaller cam. But they also went to the T&D Shaft rockers with 1.8 ratio. (BTW, if I do have to change heads, I might be selling my shaft rockers to recoup some money. ) The T&Ds are a thing of beauty.
After I fixed the wrecked body, I set about to figure out the noisy engine. I tried to adjust the valves with no real solution after several tries, I thought the answer was bad lifters. So I ordered some replacements and started the tear down. So far I found a jam nut that came loose and fell into the lifter retainer. No damage, Also a lifter that lost it's retaining spring. Again, no damage. I was cleaning it up to put it back together when I saw the missing material between the valves. With the mention of valve seats becoming loose, I'm wondering what the symptoms of that would be.
I plan on calling Trick Flow Monday. Also T&D to see if I can make these rockers work with different heads.
This used to be a common thing with older aftermarket heads, specifically the AFR 205's from years ago. Most back then just ran them, but personally I'd have it welded.
I sent them an email /pict describing my situation. I'll follow up with a call on Monday
Originally Posted by Tang2
This used to be a common thing with older aftermarket heads, specifically the AFR 205's from years ago. Most back then just ran them, but personally I'd have it welded.
These are older, 10 years or so.
It probably won't get much worse for the two bad ones. The other two could end up like the bad ones at some point.
I'm leaning towards welding myself unless everyone says no way. Then, just send them. I may get a spring compressor and see how the seats look. That may be today's task ...
Thanks for the rely, Do you have any experience with having this done?
In my years I have had a few sets of heads crack between the seats, just took them to the machine shop and had them welded and repaired. Always worked out well.
I wouldn't just weld them, I think the seats need to come out and go back in after the repair. If it's just a chunk of metal missing and not an actual crack maybe just run them. But if you weld them you could distort a seat etc. I would consult a machine shop at least before just welding them just in case they can offer some helpful info or "watch out for this" type stuff
Those heads are pretty old and well used. Probably seen some nitrous
It’s not really a crack it’s more cosmetic than anything else
If the valve job isn’t leaking it’s certainly runnable. It won’t leak water it all solid behind there
Fix is put interlocking seats in
I would definately look into taking them to a machine shop to have fixed. I have a stock set of heads off of a 6.0 that I picked up that actually dropped a valve seat, retained all valves but beat them pretty badly, as well as ate up a couple pistons! Doubt TF will do anything, but definitely worth a shot to call them!
And, if you do decide to sell the rockers, let me know! Also, thanks for the info on the threads, I may just helical all of them now! I wish there was a way to run a 10mm rather than 8mm bolt, aside from the 10mm rockers from Yella Terra.
I tried to get the springs/valves off. No luck. I'll take it to the machine shop and let them do their thing.
Depending what they find is where we go from there.
I will call Trick Flow first to see what they say.
So I called Trick Flow and they had a couple guys look at it and basically said "send it".
I also spoke to a couple local race engine builders. They have seen it before and said they just run them.
So good bad or otherwise,,, that's what I'm going to do. I appreciate everyone's comments.
If they've seen it before and sent it and it was fine, then I'd go for it too. You still have a ton of area holding the seats in so they should stay put.
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Trick Flow head problem between valves, Pic 
