2MCHPWR

iTrader: (10)

no problem bear. i'm glad we got that atap (windows version) working. if you save that file on a floppy disk, maybe you can email it to me (2mchpwr@ponycars.net). i'm sure joe would like to look at it too.
<img border="0" alt="[cheers]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_cheers.gif" />

JPR

Bear and Kim ran there car yesterday in off the street form with only the addition of ET Streets, when I tunned it on the dyno there was -0- KR but now there is so I will have to put some more fuel in the WOT obviously. I want a chance to get the chassis set-up in more track readiness ie sway bar dropped, cut-out installed, skinies up front and some medium chassis weight removal. This car is heavy folks, make no mistake about it. All in all the DA was horrid at E-Town yesterday, we were about +1,800 feet by noon and got a bit worse as the day went by. The track was as dicey with traction as usual, (I never hooked in the later part of Time runs under heavy launches) quite a few consistant 118 trap speed guys were down 2-3 mph yesterday, so I don't really count his runs as being too accurate, just good shake down passes.
The best MPH's I turned in my Camaro yesterday were low to mid 116's when I already turned low 118's at Atco WITH shifting problems just to give you an idea.

A TNT at ATCO with Bears car running A-Tap would be a better platform for me at this point with some weight reduction, then at that time I will decide what to do next, but not until then, the power IS there.

Kenny:

I tested the smooth bellows against the factory corrigated and netted -0- back to back testing 4 pulls, 1 off, 1 on, 1 off, 1 on.

JS:

I whole heartedly agree the peaks are NOT tunned for that chassis weight/gearing 6,000-6,100 would be more benificial with that gear and weight but I am going to try to work with what we have first, LS6 ported heads at 308 cfm @ .550 have no earthly business on a 3,800+ car, that power band is more tunned to a 3,200 lb Z06. The runner volume is running the peaks too high even with a TR224/112 cam, I may have to dip into my S1 reserve! lol! either way it's on my dime.

Bear, drop me an e-mail for a convenient ATCO TNT night.

Joe.

<small>[ March 23, 2003, 11:13 AM: Message edited by: JPR ]</small>

Liquidnutz

Joe, sent you mail and a pm.
Thanks
Mike

JS

iTrader: (4)

I agree Joe,If I knew what I know now about the LS6 heads I wouldve stuck with your S1's ;o)

Those babies made WICKED TQ and usable power to 6300.I know u will straighten out bears car.Like u said,alittle weight loss and some better hook u have the 116 to 118 MPH you guys were looking for out of his car and it'll still be a pig as far a weights concerned.

Maybe a slightly smaller cam?
I might try that myself,These heads are just too big in stock form and I found out the hard way.I think the smaller cam is the trick or a different lobe sep and or intake centerline?

I shouldve stuck with your S1/224 cam and took alittle more weight out of my car.I probably wouldve been running 11.00's or better last yr and only shifting at 6300..

JS

JPR

Thanks for that vote of confidence about the S1's, I believe we still hold that market securely <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> . Your old S1's were flow tested upon removal, documented and flow matched to there ET, cam size and your cars old weight. They grew up into S2's and were installed on Dennis's car 411/397, then credit/traded for S1's and a 216. Re-sold to Black Majic that turned 432/408 and ran over 120 MPH in street trim and drag radials, now there retired with bent valves, broken guides and tweaked seats from a top of 2nd gear to first gear down shift <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="gr_eek2.gif" /> . Your old S1's were decent but not as good as our newest stock valved program still at 10.3 - 10.4 compression. Almost everything that I suspected 2 years ago to make the LS1 heads run the quarter in moderate race trim is finnaly playing out now especially with my car as a good example, There is nothing "special" about the S1 heads on my car, there our normal production S1's but I tunned them to the hilt on the dyno. LS6's are a different story on weighty (3450+) cars, there not designed for them thats why there called Z06 heads Agreed unless you stall and gear the heck out of them, they are larger runners right out of the box and peak higher even in stock form regaurdless of after market cam size, some may say "well there not that much larger" but every cc matters to me, high cfm's and low air speed for X amount of cubic inches are not conducive to a quality low end tq or low HP peaks. I admitt, I got caught up in the BiG cam BiG intake runner dyno game and threw all common sence of making quality power out the window, I know that now. I have still been using low compression W/matched cam lobes to intake runner flow/volume now that I have the formula, contrary to belief.. feet per second (air speed) is more benificial than a single digit peak cfm number to make lots of low end torque and HP. Look at Jantzers car, Stable peaks laying down great power and running the MPH to boot! He's not flowing 300 cfm to give a clue, not even 290 for that matter, there just a good stratigically ported set of heads. Now to bring peaks down a little more or keep them under control with large runners high flow with a med cam size is 2 fold with no penalty to peak power output, just lower rpm peaks but didn't try it on Bears car yet because I had no idea what it would dyno and where and he also mentioned to me to diet the car when I have time. I really don't want to go back to small cams at this point, I'm making more under the curve torque and HP than ever with the Thunder Racing 224 cams, if anything I am going bigger with my car in duration for my Big LSX heads with 12.0 comperession, but I'm light <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> .
Joe.

<small>[ March 24, 2003, 09:31 AM: Message edited by: JPR ]</small>

JPR

I re-thought my above post and I wanted to clarify a statement, I'm not bashing LS6 heads, they make great power and will out power Max effort LS1's by roughly 10 RWH, but they have there application, thats all I was trying to get across.

Joe.

JS

iTrader: (4)

I totally agree Joe...

JS

<small>[ March 24, 2003, 10:43 AM: Message edited by: JS ]</small>

Bear

iTrader: (1)

Ahhhhhhh, I feel the love. The car will see some sort of diet. At this point I don't know what, but some things will change. I think that our "street" cars are different than some of these Z's stripped already from the getgo. I don't want to loose creature comforts like AC or PS. So aside from that where should I start?

JayLS1-327

iTrader: (2)

Very informative post Joe. Thanks for the info.

Greatd numbers Bear.

Kenny H

Bear,

As I've said, if you need skinnies, just let me know, not a problem. I'd try to do the basic weight reduction and run the car in better air. I think you could knock off .4 easily. Yank the front sway bar, take the back seat out along with seatbelt hardware, and run skinnies up front. Thats 2 tenths right there in weight reduction. Then, just look for a cooler day. I wouldn't wait for the coldest night possible. I did that with my car and hooking was impossible, that was when Joe managed an 11.83 w/1.68 short time. The best I could do that night was a spinning 2.0 and then just getting out of it. Head to the track on a 45-50 degree day with some sun if possible. If your feeling ambitious, take the passenger seat out also, it takes 4 minutes to do and is worth probably 25 pounds. Every bit counts.

I do agree that perhaps LS6 heads are better suited for a lighter car, but I wonder if you are getting the most out of the convertor? On your shifts, what do the RPMs drop on the 1-2 and 2-3 shift? Maybe with the right convertor the shift extensions will stay at 5500 or so and you'll be alright?

Kenny H

Bear,

As I've said, if you need skinnies, just let me know, not a problem. I'd try to do the basic weight reduction and run the car in better air. I think you could knock off .4 easily. Yank the front sway bar, take the back seat out along with seatbelt hardware, and run skinnies up front. Thats 2 tenths right there in weight reduction. Then, just look for a cooler day. I wouldn't wait for the coldest night possible. I did that with my car and hooking was impossible, that was when Joe managed an 11.83 w/1.68 short time. The best I could do that night was a spinning 2.0 and then just getting out of it. Head to the track on a 45-50 degree day with some sun if possible. If your feeling ambitious, take the passenger seat out also, it takes 4 minutes to do and is worth probably 25 pounds. Every bit counts.

I do agree that perhaps LS6 heads are better suited for a lighter car, but I wonder if you are getting the most out of the convertor? On your shifts, what do the RPMs drop on the 1-2 and 2-3 shift? Maybe with the right convertor the shift extensions will stay at 5500 or so and you'll be alright?