Cam ? - I'm afraid to ask -
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 71
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Cam ? - I'm afraid to ask - after yesterday and the T/R - OMC question, I almost afraid to ask.
The car is in my signature, it's not a daily driver and I don't want a full out
race machine. The last cam I bought and changed was in 1976.
I've done research and have come up with 2 possibilities.
1) TR - 220/220 - 112 LSA - .553/.553
2) Comp Cams - 216/220 - 114 LSA - .525/.532
Thunder seems to keep the intake and exhaust even, while Comp seems to
like more exhaust. I know there is a wealth of knowledge and experience
on this site and would appreciate "real" world input. Charts and graphs
are great, but I'd like to hear from experience, and please be honest. Both installs will use Comp 918 springs, and I will be keeping the stock heads
but may change the stock pulley to an ASP one. I have to pass emissions
every 2 years, and want a fairly smooth idle. My goal is just to give it some
more punch and make better use of the headers and intake.
Thanks.
The car is in my signature, it's not a daily driver and I don't want a full out
race machine. The last cam I bought and changed was in 1976.
I've done research and have come up with 2 possibilities.
1) TR - 220/220 - 112 LSA - .553/.553
2) Comp Cams - 216/220 - 114 LSA - .525/.532
Thunder seems to keep the intake and exhaust even, while Comp seems to
like more exhaust. I know there is a wealth of knowledge and experience
on this site and would appreciate "real" world input. Charts and graphs
are great, but I'd like to hear from experience, and please be honest. Both installs will use Comp 918 springs, and I will be keeping the stock heads
but may change the stock pulley to an ASP one. I have to pass emissions
every 2 years, and want a fairly smooth idle. My goal is just to give it some
more punch and make better use of the headers and intake.
Thanks.
Both cams will pass emissions. The comp cam will idle a little better (114LSA). But... TR's 224 cam also seems to pass emissions, and will give you a few more ponies on your stock heads. If your primary reason for changing your cam is power (given the emissions restriction) don't you want to get the most bang for your buck? Good Luck.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 71
Likes: 0
Thanks, I think the 224 may be pushing it a bit for me. Although I
thought about a 224 with a 114. I've read lots of good info here, and
I think I was have mental breakdown! I would like a stealthy type. My
goal is to run mid 12's and be able to drive it anywhere.
thought about a 224 with a 114. I've read lots of good info here, and
I think I was have mental breakdown! I would like a stealthy type. My
goal is to run mid 12's and be able to drive it anywhere.
TECH Enthusiast
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 553
Likes: 0
From: Long Island, NY
Originally Posted by Hawkeye2
Thanks, I think the 224 may be pushing it a bit for me. Although I
thought about a 224 with a 114. I've read lots of good info here, and
I think I was have mental breakdown! I would like a stealthy type. My
goal is to run mid 12's and be able to drive it anywhere.
thought about a 224 with a 114. I've read lots of good info here, and
I think I was have mental breakdown! I would like a stealthy type. My
goal is to run mid 12's and be able to drive it anywhere.
Trending Topics
TR224 / 114
Smooth idle at 900 rpms. Makes around 380-390 at the wheels. You can tune it with a MAFT only. I've heard that it'll pass emissions, but I don't have personal experience there. Should be good for low 12's / high 11's with stock heads.
Smooth idle at 900 rpms. Makes around 380-390 at the wheels. You can tune it with a MAFT only. I've heard that it'll pass emissions, but I don't have personal experience there. Should be good for low 12's / high 11's with stock heads.
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Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 71
Likes: 0
Thunder racing also suggested that one, or with a 112. I was getting concerned that
it might be too much cam, and then I tried to study the relationship between the
224 / 114 or the 220 / 112 and how they would differ. I have met someone with
the 220 who has told me he wished he went with the 224! Ahhh!! The possibilities
seem to be endless. That's why I was wondering if anyone is using either one
of these right now, with a set up similar to mine.
BTW - current dyno - on a Mustang - 336 RW and 339 TQ.
it might be too much cam, and then I tried to study the relationship between the
224 / 114 or the 220 / 112 and how they would differ. I have met someone with
the 220 who has told me he wished he went with the 224! Ahhh!! The possibilities
seem to be endless. That's why I was wondering if anyone is using either one
of these right now, with a set up similar to mine.
BTW - current dyno - on a Mustang - 336 RW and 339 TQ.
Originally Posted by Hawkeye2
Thunder racing also suggested that one, or with a 112. I was getting concerned that
it might be too much cam, and then I tried to study the relationship between the
224 / 114 or the 220 / 112 and how they would differ. I have met someone with
the 220 who has told me he wished he went with the 224! Ahhh!! The possibilities
seem to be endless. That's why I was wondering if anyone is using either one
of these right now, with a set up similar to mine.
BTW - current dyno - on a Mustang - 336 RW and 339 TQ.
it might be too much cam, and then I tried to study the relationship between the
224 / 114 or the 220 / 112 and how they would differ. I have met someone with
the 220 who has told me he wished he went with the 224! Ahhh!! The possibilities
seem to be endless. That's why I was wondering if anyone is using either one
of these right now, with a set up similar to mine.
BTW - current dyno - on a Mustang - 336 RW and 339 TQ.
For your cause, you should go with the 224 with 114 LSA, more power, can still pass emissions (down here in Houston you can, not sure were you live) and make decent power. My vote is 224 as well. Good luck man
See my sig. My TR220 is on a 114. The car idles close to stock from outside. Inside the car has a little more shake than stock but it's not bad, to the untrained it would just seem like an slight miss in the engine.
I have a torque curve that is pancake flat from 3500 rpm to 6200 rpm. It's right at 350 rwtq.
I lost a slight amount to low end torque vs. stock. On the street it is more important to be in the right gear below 3000 rpm now with the TR220. Above 3500 rpm all hell breaks loose.
If I were going to do it again, I would put in an LPE GT2-3...BUT I am satisfied with the TR220 114. I think now more than ever the LPE GT2-3 is the best street cam made.
From what I have heard and seen, the TR220 114 will idle better than the CC216/220 114 due to the more agressive lobes.
Good Luck.
I have a torque curve that is pancake flat from 3500 rpm to 6200 rpm. It's right at 350 rwtq.
I lost a slight amount to low end torque vs. stock. On the street it is more important to be in the right gear below 3000 rpm now with the TR220. Above 3500 rpm all hell breaks loose.
If I were going to do it again, I would put in an LPE GT2-3...BUT I am satisfied with the TR220 114. I think now more than ever the LPE GT2-3 is the best street cam made.
From what I have heard and seen, the TR220 114 will idle better than the CC216/220 114 due to the more agressive lobes.
Good Luck.
Last edited by equandt; Aug 5, 2004 at 01:12 PM.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 71
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by BigBronco
currently you are around 360 rwhp on a dynojet... you should be running near mid 12's right now, considering you hook and can drive very well at the track.
For your cause, you should go with the 224 with 114 LSA, more power, can still pass emissions (down here in Houston you can, not sure were you live) and make decent power. My vote is 224 as well. Good luck man
For your cause, you should go with the 224 with 114 LSA, more power, can still pass emissions (down here in Houston you can, not sure were you live) and make decent power. My vote is 224 as well. Good luck man
Milan if I'm close to my goal! Cam selection can be simple and complex. I
guess some of it turns out to be trial and error! Oh I wish my neighbour
was still alive! He did 23 years as a Ford Engineer in camshaft design at
the Dearborn Tech Centre.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 71
Likes: 0
I was in the 107 range before the mods. Just figured a cam would make
better use of the intake and headers. Since it's all about breathing
air in and getting it out, anything that helps the flow should make more
power. It should be that simple!
better use of the intake and headers. Since it's all about breathing
air in and getting it out, anything that helps the flow should make more
power. It should be that simple!
Dont let these people tell you that small cams dont make power. My B1 (221/.558/114) made 380rwhp with MAC midlength headers, 2.5" ypipe, no free mods, stock TB, and the fact that it was 100% humidity and raining outside didnt help either. I trapped mid-115 on a +2000DA night.
I've had the CC 216/220 for almost three years now and have been very happy with it. I've got AS 5.3's sitting in my shop waiting to go on. Depending on what I dyno with the new heads will determine if I move up to 224/224.
FWIW the CC 216/220 does not idle stock it has a definite lope. Somebody said earlier that it has more agressive ramps than theTR 220/220, that's hard to believe since the TR has so much more lift. I'd like further comment on that.
FWIW the CC 216/220 does not idle stock it has a definite lope. Somebody said earlier that it has more agressive ramps than theTR 220/220, that's hard to believe since the TR has so much more lift. I'd like further comment on that.
TECH Addict
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,907
Likes: 1
From: Bergen County, NJ
I went with the TR220 (see "cam wish list" post) because I was looking for power under the curve, stealth, ability to pass emissions, spring life, driveability, and a specifc hp target of about 375 at the rear wheels so as to not overload clutch, rear, etc. and wind up replacing a bunch of additional parts to handle 400+. Actual results were 364 at the rear wheels, so in retrospect, I would have gone with a TR224 or something in the 222/224 range with a little more exhaust duration. The 216 cam will give about 10 HP less than the TR220, and the TR224 will give you about 10 HP more. Driveability, lope etc will be about the same with a 114 lsa, and with your 4.10s, you can handle the little bit of low rpm surge.