Racehead

I thought both you and Tony were being an *** to not only WAHUSKER, but to anybody who'd dare to actually buy the hotcam as well. I wasn't trying to be an *** at all. Anyway I've argue'd this slow ramp rate/fast ramp rate/ area under the curve thing too many times already. Everybody knows how you feel about this cam. No need to try and make people feel badly about their carefully chosen cam just because it doesn't make sense to you.

Nine Ball

iTrader: (38)

I replied in this thread before WAHUSKER. And, I've bashed hotcams since they first came out....before this site was even around



Your logic still doesn't make any sense, there are much better cams available that do everything better than the hotcam, except for sell at its lower price. You seem to think that the (LT4 cough, cough) hotcam specs make a broader power band and "more area under the curve". BS. The way you make it sound is that the hotcam is the only cam available that produces a broad power band and more area under the curve. Did you not read the messages clearly, that there are quite a few cams that do EVERYTHING better, including make more power across the rpm range, idle better, etc..?

I can't believe people still argue about the merits of the weak hotcam after 5 years, even though a ton of cam research has taken place since then along with many better iterations of valve spring and retainer design. The "not" cam is an old design, and the specs aren't creative (LT4), and we have better parts available.

you might as well start campaigning the merits of the LS1 intake manifold over the LS6 too. Its cheap, and thats about all it has going for it also. Sure, you can make power with an LS1 intake, but you can make more with an LS6 intake. Same situation here.

Colonel

" thought both you and Tony were being an *** to not only WAHUSKER, but to anybody who'd dare to actually buy the hotcam as well."

Well, ya thought wrong. That wasn't our intent.

I do not try to make others feel bad for running the Hotcam. In fact, you'll notice that I've stating that I'm happy for the people who are satisfied with their Hotcam. My ONLY purpose in "bashing" (if that's what you want to call it) the Hotcam is to keep folks from making a mistake. That info is for the benefit of WHOEVER happens to be reading the thread. I don't assume that the original poster is the only one reading so my comments aren't always directed at him or her.

...But seriously, we're ALL asses!

Nine Ball

iTrader: (38)

Where did Colonel put anyone down here for buying a hotcam? He only said the cam itself sucks, not the buyer. You know what, I hate Kia vehicles too and I think they suck, but I don't think the buyers suck. See the difference?

If you guys would lose the defensive attitude about a crappy camshaft, you might just learn from these replies. We WANT to help you.

Colonel

BTW, Husker wasn't even the thread starter so I don't know why you brought it up that I was putting down him having a Hotcam in his thread.

...Nevermind, I see you deleted that post.

Colonel

Ahhh....I found it.

Racehead wrote-

"This thread is WAHUSKERS about his cam that's already in his car. You're trying to save him from the cam he's already running, or ruining his thread to save other people who have not yet bought a cam. Your position here on this board should preclude you from acting in either one of these manners IMO"

Oh reeeeeeeeeally? (Ok, I admit, now I'm most certainly being an ***.)

Racehead

I never said that the Hotcam was the "only" cam with a broad powerband. That would be stupid, the stock cam has a broad power band. I simply said that it "does" have a broad powerband.

And your LS1/LS6 camparison is invalid. The LS6 makes more torque and hp at every point in the rpm band + has NO longevity/durability issues to mention. I still wouldn't try to make somebody feel stupid about their choice of manifolds if they posted up their "LS1" intake manifold #'s. Just not me.

Nine Ball

iTrader: (38)

Colonel, damn you. you.....***.....hotcam hater.....redneck!



If only the LS1 intake manifold had such diehard supporters. Oh well, just add this one to the long list of hotcam threads that future readers will find on their search feature. Hopefully we helped them save a few bucks in the longrun by going with something better.

BTW, Colonel doesn't know **** about cams. He was only the first LS1 owner ever to run 9s on motor with a hydraulic cam. Hell, I was only the first 6-speed owner ever to run 11s on motor. We don't know **** about LS1s

Racehead

Your right, at 1st I was thinking he had started it, then realized he hadn't, so I deleted it. You caught me. Being an Admin does have its advantages you know

Racehead

I wouldn't even think about talking down your drag racing expertise. I've been a member for awhile now and am well aware of alot of your accomplishments.

Nine Ball

iTrader: (38)

Both silly arguments. Thanks for pointing out that the hotcam has a broad powerband. Big deal. We are talking about comparisions here, and why make a statement like that if it isn't being used in a comparison context? So what if it makes a broad powerband....if the powerband is lower across the board? Thats like saying "the hotcam is round and long". Is it rounder and longer than other cams? Then who cares, we are comparing here.

The LS1/LS6 intake is VERY valid. You are correct that the LS6 improves power and torque across the band. But, there are several other cams that do that over the hotcam too. There are even cams that will get you your 100K miles and still outperform the hotcam. Why is it so hard to understand that??? If you have better parts available now compared to 1999, why not use them? Thats like saying the LS1 intake is better because it is cheaper, and for no other reasons.

We should change your name from "Racehead" to "Hardhead"

ram-it

You have to consider that we all work on our own cars here in the NW group. No different with anyone else on here. When someone starts calling what you've bought, labored on **** it becomes personal. It's great to know about these other things but to constantly have it drilled into your head that your stuff sucks gets to be a little much. We are all on your site for info and support. Not to get kicked in the nuts over something that we have done that you would not have.

Nine Ball

iTrader: (38)

My '02 SS isn't a drag car. I've got cruiser experience too you know. My '98 Formula was also my daily driver. I've logged about 400 dyno runs and tuned about 30 different LS1s, not to mention building several engine setups of various sizes. Drag racing is just another hobby, and useful for monitoring performance. If you guys weren't interested in performance you wouldn't be doing cam swaps

Think of our advice as "tough love". We really do want to help others out, but we really do dislike the hotcam and how much it is hyped up sometimes without deserving the hype.

ram-it

Your right Nineball. But I am trying to do things on a budget and would have loved to have had an LMG cam and new rockers too. Maybe someday I will upgrade but it will be when I change the heads. Thanks for the tough love! Its nice to know we can disagree sometimes and still talk shop.

Nine Ball

iTrader: (38)

People sell used cams all the time, keep your eyes peeled in the classifieds forums. Don't really need new rockers, the stock ones work for the majority of them. I sure would recommend one thing though, get the best valvespring setup you can afford, don't skimp in that area. Saving a buck there could cost you an engine.

Racehead

Every single attribute that you've mentioned that other cams have over the hotcam I've agreed with
1) more power = I agree
2) smoother idle = I agree
3) can have a broad or broader power band = I agree.

What you can't seem to agree with is

1) The hotcam makes "good" power . .... Yes I know others make more, don't say it
2) It's very easy on the valve train. I wouldn't hesitate to run the SSCC with the hotcam and LS6 springs and no other mods except for tuning. Can't say that about most other cams including the previously mentioned TR224 or the B1.
3) It's inexpensive.

There you are, 3 good things about the Hotcam. OK it's your turn to dis-agree now

And on this note I'll return the general membership to the Colonels and Nine ***** never before discussed opinion

Visceral

iTrader: (1)

I will point out that a long time ago in a far away place there was only one other cam-only car with more power than mine (398 rwhp). He had a B1 and made 401 If I remember correctly.

What do I have now? MTI is redo'ing the shortblock in my car with wet sleeves instead of dry sleeves, and the X1 in my 387 is being switched to a Z1 on a 114. Do I wish I had the quiet valvetrain from the Hotcam? Hell yeah. Do I know how to get it with the performance I need? No idea. If I had to do it all over again and put a cam in a cam-only car... I think I would choose something along the lines of the MTI Stealth 2, unless you could find me a slower-ramp-rate cam that performed nearly as well.

1BDHWK

iTrader: (18)

I don't reply much on here, but love replying to Hotcam Posts. I'll be the first to admit that there are a LOT better cams than the Hotcam. But I bought mine for $250 and I can't complain. With headers, true duals, 9", steel driveshaft, and stock heads, I put down 399.2 rwhp and 392.6 rwtq SAE in street trim!!! I consistantly run 12.2-12.1 in my 3800 lbs of fat car driving like a wuss. And it loves the spray. I definitely can't complain about the cam. But I will be going much bigger (motor and cam) if I can ever get out of this damn country!!! IRAQ In and out since the beginning of the War. I will not sit here and say buy the Hotcam. I would suggest something different if you have more funds, but for a cheap cam, you can really beat it.

Nine Ball

iTrader: (38)

sooo.... when are you going to put the LS1 intake on your car?

kenkaru

First off, my car is a '98 M6 and my Hotcam runs absolutely fine here in Kansas in 100 degrees with humidy with the AC on. I don't know where you're coming up with this NEEDS tuning stuff. Everyone knows you can drill the TB on an auto if you need to.

A key point of the hotcam is that it makes power without reving to the moon.



You guys who are full-time Hotcam bashers acknowledge that the Hotcam's only advantage over any other cam is price. I agree with you on that. Where I don't agree though, is where you keep going on and on like that price factor means nothing at all!? That's like John Force coming onto the board, and saying that you are a sally and wasting your time with your setup because you're not making 16 billion HP. "I mean come on dude, if you're gonna swap a cam and heads, you might as well go all the way with alky, a big blower with a big block." There's always someone bigger and badder. So you've got a setup bigger and badder than a hotcam. wow.

A hotcam swap makes 25-30hp,
"mild cam X" makes 30-35 hp.

Granted, more hp is more hp but more money is more money as well.
Hotcam with wprings = 415. the thunder cams w/springs are $600. I payed 185 less than a thunder cam and those extra funds went toward my $299 uncoated pacesetter headers. My header/cam combo is definitely making more power than just a 224 cam. I opened this thread to hopefully see some good info on track times but, as always, the same 3-4 hotcam haters have taken this thread over. You don't like it (even though you never had it) and that's ok. Just shut up about it already because everyone knows that the big selling point is the price.
I'm so sick of hearing about how "old" the hotcam is, as if the design is deteriorating over time. Our whole freakin engine design is "old". Who are you gonna impress with your "new technology" cam specs when your motor has pushrods and 2 valves per cylinder!?

If the hotcam really sucks then why don't you guys shut the F up and allow people to post their first hand experiences with it and if it does suck... well the proof will be in the pudding. I've seen nothing but good stuff from actual hotcam owners.

Look at my sig. I obviously don't have tons of money! lol Hotcam suits me perfect.