Generation III Internal Engine 1997-2006 LS1 | LS6
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by:

ARP rod bolts...just swap them w/the factory ones???

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 07-05-2005, 07:39 PM
  #1  
TECH Regular
Thread Starter
iTrader: (8)
 
SSblack98's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 420
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Unhappy ARP rod bolts...just swap them w/the factory ones???

I have a 2002 LS1 short block and I have ARP rod bolts that I bought to replace the factory bolts that everyone says are weak. Is this just a direct swap out? I have been told by one person that I might need to get the rods resized if I changed to the ARP's. IS THIS TRUE??? If so I am not going to bother with them. ANY HELP IS APPRECIATED!
Old 07-05-2005, 08:18 PM
  #2  
TECH Addict
iTrader: (49)
 
HavATampa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 2,128
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default

Search is your friend......friend.

https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...ight=rod+bolts
Old 07-06-2005, 11:41 AM
  #3  
Cal
TECH Veteran
iTrader: (1)
 
Cal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Northern Utah
Posts: 4,692
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts

Default

There are two types of ARP rod bolts. If you're going to use the High Performance bolts, you don't need to resize the rod ends. But if you are putting in the ARP Pro series, the big ends of the rods should be resized and oversized bearings installed. The Katech rod bolts don't require resizing either. The Katech bolts are a better choice.

Installing the bolts is a good idea imo. It also gives you a chance to inspect and replace any bad bearings you might have. There is no need to "change the bolts one at a time to avoid dislodging the bearings" as sugested in that thread. This is just more internet misinformation. The bearings are designed with little tabs that keeps them in aligned.
The following users liked this post:
Homer_Simpson (12-05-2021)
Old 07-06-2005, 12:59 PM
  #4  
TECH Addict
iTrader: (2)
 
crainholio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,977
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts

Default

Originally Posted by SSblack98
I have a 2002 LS1 short block and I have ARP rod bolts that I bought to replace the factory bolts that everyone says are weak. Is this just a direct swap out?
I'm not sure which "everyone" you're talking to, but evidently not everyone knows that GM upgraded the bolt design for the '01+ models and they're plenty strong enough for most applications.

I'd feel much safer running the revised GM bolts as assembled from St. Cathy's plant than I would installing new rod bolts without measuring bearing clearances on all 8 rods.

In fact, that's what I did.
Old 07-06-2005, 01:18 PM
  #5  
TECH Regular
Thread Starter
iTrader: (8)
 
SSblack98's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 420
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

I bought the "high performance" ARP bolts not the pro series. So do you guys think it is worth the time to mess with them or just stay w/the factory '02 rod bolts? BTW, I have NO plans of running any nitrous or boost, it is a NA heads/cam car all the way. If this really isn't worth my time I would rather not mess with it being that I am in no way a machinist or professional engine builder. Thanks for the input!
Old 07-06-2005, 01:50 PM
  #6  
TECH Addict
iTrader: (2)
 
crainholio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,977
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts

Default

Count my vote towards leaving the bolts as they are. Put on a stronger timing chain and a ported oil pump.
Old 07-06-2005, 02:02 PM
  #7  
TECH Regular
Thread Starter
iTrader: (8)
 
SSblack98's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 420
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Thanks, yea I already installed comp lifters, LS6 ported oil pump and LS2 chain. Just trying to think of everything, think I will leave the bolts alone. No sense going through the effort and screwing something up. It should hold together, it only has 22k and is out of an 02 A4 vette a lady owned so it hasn't been stressed so far in its life!
Old 07-06-2005, 05:15 PM
  #8  
Cal
TECH Veteran
iTrader: (1)
 
Cal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Northern Utah
Posts: 4,692
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts

Default

Originally Posted by SSblack98
I bought the "high performance" ARP bolts not the pro series. So do you guys think it is worth the time to mess with them or just stay w/the factory '02 rod bolts? BTW, I have NO plans of running any nitrous or boost, it is a NA heads/cam car all the way. If this really isn't worth my time I would rather not mess with it being that I am in no way a machinist or professional engine builder. Thanks for the input!
Stress on rod bolts has nothing to do with nitrous or boost. It's only spinning the engine fast that stresses the bolts. If you miss a shift and over rev the motor, it might be nice to know it won't throw a rod.
Old 07-06-2005, 05:32 PM
  #9  
TECH Resident
iTrader: (11)
 
ThirdGenLS1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Boston
Posts: 987
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts

Default

if you have the engine out why not do it. Not like it takes all that long to do it if you have the engine on the stand(not like its going to hurt anything). I replaced my bolts while my engine was on the stand with the katech bolts. Everything seems to be ok so far.

Justin
Old 07-06-2005, 10:17 PM
  #10  
Launching!
 
v8-7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Texas, dont mess with us!
Posts: 246
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

im going with some Katechs.

I just made a post on this subject a few days ago, im sure the thread can be found on page 2,lol.
Old 07-07-2005, 08:07 AM
  #11  
TECH Regular
Thread Starter
iTrader: (8)
 
SSblack98's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 420
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

My main reason for thinking of NOT replacing them was talk of having to remeasure clearances and clearances changing with the new bolts. If the 01-up bolts are stong enough for my application I'd rather not mess with the factory clearances and risk screwing up a bearing because the clearance wasn't just right. I can handle cam swaps, head swaps and stuff like that but when you are talking about critical tolerances like rod bearing clearance I'm not sure how I feel about messing with that if it is not necessary. If you engine builders out there really think that it won't compromise the clearances by me just changing the bolts then maybe I will change them. Also, should I use the factory torque specs or should the arp bolts have a specific torque? (I haven't opened them yet or read the instructions). Thanks to everyone for the input so far!
Old 07-07-2005, 08:33 AM
  #12  
TECH Addict
iTrader: (2)
 
crainholio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,977
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts

Default

Originally Posted by SSblack98
If you engine builders out there really think that it won't compromise the clearances by me just changing the bolts then maybe I will change them.
Any competent engine builder will cringe at the thought of swapping rod bolts without measuring bearing clearances...but:

The only game changing input I'd consider would be from Lingenfelter's engine guy if someone can get it. Here's why.

For years, Lingenfelter took new LS1 engines from GM and reworked them for the ASA racing series. The rework included, among other things, new rod bolts. If Lingenfelter did research and didn't find it necessary to re-measure rod bearing clearances...they were confident enough with the rod bolts they used and their torquing process, then I'd change my stance on the matter assuming you use the same exact rod bolts and torquing procedure/specs as they did.

Ed Potter from Lingenfelter posts here occasionally, I'd track him down and see if he can find out from their engine guy.
Old 07-07-2005, 08:55 AM
  #13  
TECH Regular
Thread Starter
iTrader: (8)
 
SSblack98's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 420
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Yea, I know some people have had success with just swaping them out but I still at this point think its taking a bigger chance not getting the clearances right as opposed to just leaving them alone. Unless some known engine builder can prove me wrong. Plus I am only gonna be running it to about 6700-6800 rpms.
Old 07-07-2005, 11:09 AM
  #14  
Launching!
iTrader: (10)
 
TAF Motorsports's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Queen Creek, AZ
Posts: 288
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts

Default

remember guys, stock rods are cracked cap rods so you wont have the cap shift like you would with standard rods.
Attached Thumbnails ARP rod bolts...just swap them w/the factory ones???-rod1.jpg   ARP rod bolts...just swap them w/the factory ones???-rod2.jpg   ARP rod bolts...just swap them w/the factory ones???-rod3.jpg   ARP rod bolts...just swap them w/the factory ones???-rod4_1.jpg  

Last edited by tom97ss; 07-07-2005 at 12:18 PM.
Old 07-07-2005, 11:12 AM
  #15  
Launching!
iTrader: (10)
 
TAF Motorsports's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Queen Creek, AZ
Posts: 288
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts

Default

Originally Posted by SSblack98
Unless some known engine builder can prove me wrong. Plus I am only gonna be running it to about 6700-6800 rpms.
Katech http://www.katechengines.com/katech_inc/
Old 07-07-2005, 12:02 PM
  #16  
TECH Addict
iTrader: (2)
 
crainholio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,977
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts

Default

Bearing crush is a function of the pressure the rod bolts place on the rod cap, and bearing clearance is a function of (among other things) bearing crush.

I don't know if cracked-cap rods are less prone to variation in crush in this manner than conventional rods, however. Lingenfelter is the only shop I know of with experience in this area with lots of engines on the field.
Old 07-07-2005, 04:55 PM
  #17  
Cal
TECH Veteran
iTrader: (1)
 
Cal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Northern Utah
Posts: 4,692
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts

Default

Originally Posted by crainholio
For years, Lingenfelter took new LS1 engines from GM and reworked them for the ASA racing series. The rework included, among other things, new rod bolts. If Lingenfelter did research and didn't find it necessary to re-measure rod bearing clearances...they were confident enough with the rod bolts they used and their torquing process, then I'd change my stance on the matter assuming you use the same exact rod bolts and torquing procedure/specs as they did.
Right! And guess what kind of rod bolts Lingenfelter uses? Katech! Listen, like I said in my other post, if you use Katech bolts, you don't have to resize. Just torque to spec. The Katech bolts were developed by Katech in conjunction with GM for the ASA racing series, as noted above. And they were designed to go in without resizing. You don't have to be a machinist to install them; you only need to know how to use a torque wrench. I have these bolts and my engine sees 7000 rpm on a regular basiss.
Old 07-07-2005, 05:30 PM
  #18  
LS1TECH Sponsor
iTrader: (33)
 
Steve Burger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Out on the farm in Central IL
Posts: 4,399
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts

Default

I went with the Katech bolts as well. No problems here so far.
Old 07-07-2005, 06:15 PM
  #19  
TECH Regular
Thread Starter
iTrader: (8)
 
SSblack98's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 420
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Cal
Right! And guess what kind of rod bolts Lingenfelter uses? Katech! Listen, like I said in my other post, if you use Katech bolts, you don't have to resize. Just torque to spec. The Katech bolts were developed by Katech in conjunction with GM for the ASA racing series, as noted above. And they were designed to go in without resizing. You don't have to be a machinist to install them; you only need to know how to use a torque wrench. I have these bolts and my engine sees 7000 rpm on a regular basiss.
I understand that Katech bolts are designed to be swapped out w/no resizing. Now maybe I should have done more research before I bought them but what I think everyone has forgotten here is that I already HAVE the ARP "high performance" rod bolts. And my original question (which no one so far seems to know the answer for sure) is whether I can swap out the oem bolts for the ones I have and be safe. I called Lingenfelter and they told me the same thing Cal is saying which is that they only use (and sell) the Katech bolts. SO basically I can send back the bolts I have and buy katechs, or swap in the bolts I have or leave the freakin thing alone!
Old 07-07-2005, 07:50 PM
  #20  
10 Second Club
iTrader: (5)
 
BAIN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Fort Worth, TX
Posts: 1,455
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts

Default

Originally Posted by SSblack98
I understand that Katech bolts are designed to be swapped out w/no resizing. Now maybe I should have done more research before I bought them but what I think everyone has forgotten here is that I already HAVE the ARP "high performance" rod bolts. And my original question (which no one so far seems to know the answer for sure) is whether I can swap out the oem bolts for the ones I have and be safe. I called Lingenfelter and they told me the same thing Cal is saying which is that they only use (and sell) the Katech bolts. SO basically I can send back the bolts I have and buy katechs, or swap in the bolts I have or leave the freakin thing alone!

Hey I'm in the same boat. I already have the ARP's. Wonder if we called ARP if you would find someone that would tell yes or no? I crossed referenced the part# off my ARP's from Thunder in my Jeg's magazine and in the add it says:

" Strongest, most reliable OEM replacement rod bolts available!"

Part # 070-134-6006....Chevy LS1


Quick Reply: ARP rod bolts...just swap them w/the factory ones???



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:47 PM.