Bent and Broken Pushrods... NEED HELP!!!
Originally Posted by DaddySS
For the pushrods to have bent like that the valves had to have hit the pistons or siezed in the guides due to the engine heat. I would take the heads off and inspect.
If the valves hit the pistons, it's pretty much time for a new motor???
Why would the valves hit his pistons? The stock pushrods are weak, every LS1 book out there states that. You effectively almost doubled you column loading on the pushrods and they buckled. No surprise there. See if you can find the rest of the pushrods that are broke. Do you have access to a boroscope? That would aid in finding the broken pieces and you can also inspect your pistons.
I am not familiar with the f-body setup, but the Vette has "camel mode" that the engine goes into if the engine temp goes too high. They alternate the pistons that are firing so you can limp home without damaging the motor. Not sure if the f-body has this feature. I wouldn't panic yet, sounds like you did the right thing in parking it. Although I would be willing to bet you "goosed" if a few times with the headers open.
I am not familiar with the f-body setup, but the Vette has "camel mode" that the engine goes into if the engine temp goes too high. They alternate the pistons that are firing so you can limp home without damaging the motor. Not sure if the f-body has this feature. I wouldn't panic yet, sounds like you did the right thing in parking it. Although I would be willing to bet you "goosed" if a few times with the headers open.
Teching In
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 27
Likes: 0
From: Memphis, TN
Originally Posted by red1999z28
Ididn't even think about that...yeah the 918's could be too stiff for the stock pushrods...
That sucks, Mike, but atleast you finally figured out the problem with the car. Hope it gets back on the road soon.
Man, you are gonna have to pull the motor down, pull the heads and at least have them gone over to ensure everything is ok. Also, not time for a new motor. As far as money goes as long as you didn't deposit a ton O junk in the bottom end or run coolant through it a set of aftermarket heads would probiably cost you as much as a stripped junkyard special that's assuming the valves are bent. Could even send your head off to TEA or somebody to port and install new springs and such if the heads are TKO.
if the pushrods are bent then that means you valves hit the top of your pistons. this is not good. the stock pushrods are "weaker" than the valves hopefully you do not have any ben valves. i have never seen that many bent pushrods out of one motor at the same time. that thing must have ran horrible. you need to find out what caused this. you say that you did not over rev you car. but it looks like a something that would happen if you did. you did not do any burnouts bouncing off the limiter??
you should have ran hardened pushrods. the stock ones weak an can bend even with a stock cam and valve springs after a while of high revving. thats why everyone upgrades to hardened ones.pull the heads off and inspect everything closely.
take it as s learning experience
I would think it is time to pull the whole motor apart and see what is damaged. Those are the worst pushrods I've seen. The rocker bolts were tight either from over heating the motor or maybe the violent compacting of the pushrods slamed the rocker up and stretched the threads a little out of whack. Never broke any craftsmen sockets or any others for that matter on a rocker bolts. They should come off very easily if everything is good. I would be worried about lifter damage also if the push rods are that bad.
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Had pulled the heads yet, but I bought a set of used LS1 heads in case they are damaged when I remove them.
I have 241 casting heads now and bought 853 casting heads... Anyone know the exact differenences?
I have 241 casting heads now and bought 853 casting heads... Anyone know the exact differenences?
Originally Posted by DarknessZ28
Had pulled the heads yet, but I bought a set of used LS1 heads in case they are damaged when I remove them.
I have 241 casting heads now and bought 853 casting heads... Anyone know the exact differenences?
I have 241 casting heads now and bought 853 casting heads... Anyone know the exact differenences?
You could do a little hand porting yourself and get them up and flowing a little better though, tons of guys do their own port job.
A better choice might come from TSP though, have you seen these? The price is delicious. Throw a set of PRC duals on and a nice camshaft and this is going to be the best thing that ever happened to you
http://www.texas-speed.com/shop/item...d=649&catid=20
I don't see why bent and broken pushrods necessarily equals damaged valves & heads & pistons. With much patience and an extending pen magnet, you can probably fish the pushrod pieces out. If you can successfully get the broken pieces out, why not do the simple thing first? Put some hardened pushrods in it and fire it up. If you have a bent valve hanging, you should be able to see that just by eyeballing them. To do a simple valve check, get an adapter for your air compressor and screw it in to each spark plug location. Turn on the air and if it's blowing out from a bent valve or bad piston, you'll hear it. I wouldn't yank heads until I knew it was absolutely necessary. Why set out on a mission to fix a problem that may not exist? Any day now I'm expecting someone to post a problem with his engine overheating and the majority opinion here is going to be to pull the heads real fast to see if there's any coolant in the engine. Slow down and do the easy stuff first.
I don't believe you necessarily need hardened pushrods when you're using 918s. Comp told me I needed them only after upgrading to Pro Mag roller rockers which use guide plates. That means you MUST use hardened pushrods. The guideplates will slowly eat away at the sides of the pushrods as they rub up against the slot in the guideplates. If I pulled my rockers off and found pushrods looking anything like that I'd say it required at least a top end tear down. On the other hand if I had missing pushrods I'm have to dig deeper. The pan MUST come off minimum! I find it hard to believe those pushrods could manage to get past the lifters and cam without being destroyed as well as doing damaged to everything they touched on their way to the bargain basement (Oil Pan). An engine is not meant to be a garbage disposal for metal parts and when it is used as one only bad things can happen. This motor must have been over boosted or on the bottle. If not, you don't want the guy who turned the wrenches before it exploded doing any work on your GenIII! It appears that the pistons may have kissed the valves and in that case the pushrods may have been the weak link. I wouldn't rule out some bent valves too. The piston crowns also need to be closely inspected because if the valves smacked the pistons hard enough to bend the pushrods the piston crowns may have been fractured as well. This doesn't even take into account bottom end damage. I'd pull the timing cover to see what is going on with the sprockets and chain. This block may have reached the point of diminishing returns.
W/ your setup, yeah you need to pull the heads especially if the setup broke. As for guys saying that if you bend the pushrods you bent the valves... not always true. I know several guys who have bent PRs but not valves, and another who bent valves by hitting the pistons on a 3-2 misshift and didn't bend PRs...