Will 1.8 ratio rockers/stock cam make the exhaust sound cooler
#41
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Originally Posted by ss1
Wow! mrr23, you beat me to it!
So I'm going to hijack this post for a minute. I'm the guy who was asking you about the 1.80/1.89 rockers not long ago. I just figure it's not worth starting a new thread over, since we're already on the subject and have everybodys attention.
My cam in my car is the one I mentioned above. It's .544/.544" 230/222 114 lobe separation. #'s and mods in sig below.
Since my current cam works well, but is slightly on the small side. I don't want to get involved in changing the cam. Would it be worth my while to try out 1.80, 1.82, or 1.85 rockers and bump up the lift to .576, .582" or .592"? This would put me in the ballpark of most of the newer cams on the market.
So I'm going to hijack this post for a minute. I'm the guy who was asking you about the 1.80/1.89 rockers not long ago. I just figure it's not worth starting a new thread over, since we're already on the subject and have everybodys attention.
My cam in my car is the one I mentioned above. It's .544/.544" 230/222 114 lobe separation. #'s and mods in sig below.
Since my current cam works well, but is slightly on the small side. I don't want to get involved in changing the cam. Would it be worth my while to try out 1.80, 1.82, or 1.85 rockers and bump up the lift to .576, .582" or .592"? This would put me in the ballpark of most of the newer cams on the market.
Originally Posted by ss1
Another dumb question, If I put on the new rockers, would something in the tune need to be changed? My current tune is decent and I don't want to mess anything up. There aren't any shops that I know of in my area that i'd want to mess around with my car.
Last edited by mrr23; 03-17-2007 at 02:26 PM.
#43
1.8
I've read that the Crane varible ratio rockers are extremely hard on valve springs plus high cost being forced to purchase another set of push rods Crane is forcing me to buy the Harlan Sharp 1.8 rockers.
I think the HP rockers are better than SLP or Comp. because of the roller tips,plus they are priced resomably.
Will the HP 1.8 rockers require pushrod guides?
Thanks
I think the HP rockers are better than SLP or Comp. because of the roller tips,plus they are priced resomably.
Will the HP 1.8 rockers require pushrod guides?
Thanks
#44
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no harder than if you built the same ramp rate into the cam that would be happening at the valve. in fact, i would venture to say less. with the advantage of higher ratio rocker, it takes less valve spring seat pressure. also, i have mentioned the lifters, pushrods, and rockers are moving slower on the cam side. so, the spring has less inertia to have to control speed wise.
the vinci/crane rocker kit consists of rockers, posilocks, shorter chrome-moly pushrods, guideplates and screw-in-studs. one of the benefits of having shorter pushrods is less flex. besides them being chrome-moly. so, for first time buyers, they are really only buying two additional parts, the guideplates and screw-in-studs.
after all, if you are buying aftermarket rockers, you will be getting the posilocks (except for the upgraded factory rockers that nasty perforance does) and should be buying stronger pushrods as well.
the vinci/crane rocker kit consists of rockers, posilocks, shorter chrome-moly pushrods, guideplates and screw-in-studs. one of the benefits of having shorter pushrods is less flex. besides them being chrome-moly. so, for first time buyers, they are really only buying two additional parts, the guideplates and screw-in-studs.
after all, if you are buying aftermarket rockers, you will be getting the posilocks (except for the upgraded factory rockers that nasty perforance does) and should be buying stronger pushrods as well.
#45
Hey guys, question for you. Do the stock rocker ratio with the Crane Gold Race LS1/6 1.7:1 Full Roller Aluminum Rockers have any benefit over the stock rockers? I have the money, and if the mod is good for something I might as well go for it. -Ed
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FWIW, I'm running Crane Gold 1.8's with a 242/250 .580/.580 109LSA cam with no issues at all. Yes my pistons are flycut though.
Here is my most receint Dyno with the current setup.
Here are the pistons and rockers.
Here is my most receint Dyno with the current setup.
Here are the pistons and rockers.
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Originally Posted by 4mula
try running a simple 224 cam with 581 lift on it and dont fly cut, see what happens
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Originally Posted by LETHL_SS
FWIW, I'm running Crane Gold 1.8's with a 242/250 .580/.580 109LSA cam with no issues at all. Yes my pistons are flycut though.
Here is my most receint Dyno with the current setup.
Here is my most receint Dyno with the current setup.
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Originally Posted by MadSeason
Hey guys, question for you. Do the stock rocker ratio with the Crane Gold Race LS1/6 1.7:1 Full Roller Aluminum Rockers have any benefit over the stock rockers? I have the money, and if the mod is good for something I might as well go for it. -Ed
cliff notes:
stock rockers come off the seat at 1.54 and reach the advertised 1.7 at almost full lift. on the way back down, they convert back to 1.54. the vinci/crane 1.7 rockers actually start off at 1.79. then, by .250-.300 valve lift, they start converting to 1.72. then on the way back down. start converting back to 1.79.
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So when is a good time to upgrade the rockers? I know this probably isnt the best source of info but, horsepower tv upgraded the rockers on thier ls1 project didnt they? Either way, they always say roller rockers are much better than standard rockers. Is this completely true or is the difference so small it doesnt even matter?
#53
Originally Posted by mrr23
very much so. vinci has this exact question answered on their tech and tuning page . right about in the middle of the page.
cliff notes:
stock rockers come off the seat at 1.54 and reach the advertised 1.7 at almost full lift. on the way back down, they convert back to 1.54. the vinci/crane 1.7 rockers actually start off at 1.79. then, by .250-.300 valve lift, they start converting to 1.72. then on the way back down. start converting back to 1.79.
cliff notes:
stock rockers come off the seat at 1.54 and reach the advertised 1.7 at almost full lift. on the way back down, they convert back to 1.54. the vinci/crane 1.7 rockers actually start off at 1.79. then, by .250-.300 valve lift, they start converting to 1.72. then on the way back down. start converting back to 1.79.
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Originally Posted by 98_Formula
^^ would those be safe to use with a high lift cam? like the ms3 or g5x4
my opinion is this: so long as you have proper piston to valve clearance and proper valve spring control, they will work.
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Originally Posted by nokeman
So when is a good time to upgrade the rockers? I know this probably isnt the best source of info but, horsepower tv upgraded the rockers on thier ls1 project didnt they? Either way, they always say roller rockers are much better than standard rockers. Is this completely true or is the difference so small it doesnt even matter?
this is one of those opinion questions. there are people running 9s with stock rockers. and some running 9s with the vinci/crane rockers. you'll get answers like you don't need them unless you are turning 7000+ rpms. and you'll get my answer of if you are trying to extract the most that you can, then get them. i've been running them with a stock cam for over a year. i like the added power without the annoyance of a larger cam. (well, the wife does)
is 15-20 rwhp a small difference?
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Originally Posted by LETHL_SS
FWIW, I'm running Crane Gold 1.8's with a 242/250 .580/.580 109LSA cam with no issues at all. Yes my pistons are flycut though.
Here is my most receint Dyno with the current setup.
Here is my most receint Dyno with the current setup.
#58
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just a thought
but if anyone is so interested in using 1.8 rockers
y not just adapt some exhaust ls7 when they come out
i think they will be significantly lower priced than aftermarket
this is what i plan on doing with a motor im building
the cam is a 02 z06 204/218 .550/.550@117.5 lsa
with 1.8 rockers it should increase 1-2*more and .582 lift theoretically
but if anyone is so interested in using 1.8 rockers
y not just adapt some exhaust ls7 when they come out
i think they will be significantly lower priced than aftermarket
this is what i plan on doing with a motor im building
the cam is a 02 z06 204/218 .550/.550@117.5 lsa
with 1.8 rockers it should increase 1-2*more and .582 lift theoretically
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Originally Posted by vettenuts
Very nice . How much lifter preload are you running? Also, what is the rest of your setup (springs, lifters, etc.)
I'm not running any shims and the preload is set at .075". I'm still using stock lifters, have the crane dual valve springs, and 7.200" moly pushrods. The rest of the bottom end is stock but with ARP bolts throughout.