Resleeving
Resleeving So i am looking to resleeve my LS1 cylinders with some Darton Sleeves, but the sleeves they make for the LS1 are the stock bore, and they dont recogmend boring past +0.008? does anyone know anything more about sleeving the ls1? i thought i have seen people running 4.00 in the aluminum LS1 block? and also does anyone know of a good machine shop that can do resleeving, and honning my cylinders for some new forged pistons in the south/ south east? any where from like texas to florida? i live in new orleans, but would rather drive/ ship my parts and have the machining done right the first time 
any good reading material or anything would be appriciated!! email me jfn002@latech.edu
any good reading material or anything would be appriciated!! email me jfn002@latech.edu
Originally Posted by jnoehl
So i am looking to resleeve my LS1 cylinders with some Darton Sleeves, but the sleeves they make for the LS1 are the stock bore, and they dont recogmend boring past +0.008? does anyone know anything more about sleeving the ls1? i thought i have seen people running 4.00 in the aluminum LS1 block? and also does anyone know of a good machine shop that can do resleeving, and honning my cylinders for some new forged pistons in the south/ south east? any where from like texas to florida? i live in new orleans, but would rather drive/ ship my parts and have the machining done right the first time any good reading material or anything would be appriciated!! email me jfn002@latech.edu
any good reading material or anything would be appriciated!! email me jfn002@latech.eduwow... got search?
Darton makes MID sleeves for the ls1 all the way up to a 4.125 bore, with with a 4" stroke is a 427ci.
Anyone whos anyone seems to send Steve at RED their motor to do their sleeves. Mine were done by Darton themselves. You can go to Thunder Racing, texas speed along with just about any other major sponsor and get the sleeves from them, theyre 1320 dollars. Expect to pay upwards of 2500 for a resleeved block.
Anything else please search, theres plenty on the subject!
Last edited by jermzz; Sep 16, 2006 at 09:05 PM.
Steve did mine ,he is DA'MAN.
i think you can even acheivea 454 or is it a 455 with the MID.
Steve did help design the sleeves and come up with the propper way to install them.
i have his link in my Sig.
RED=Race Engine Developement
i think you can even acheivea 454 or is it a 455 with the MID.
Steve did help design the sleeves and come up with the propper way to install them.
i have his link in my Sig.
RED=Race Engine Developement
Originally Posted by jermzz
wow... got search?
Darton makes MID sleeves for the ls1 all the way up to a 4.125 bore, with with a 4" stroke is a 427ci.
Darton makes MID sleeves for the ls1 all the way up to a 4.125 bore, with with a 4" stroke is a 427ci.
In regards to the question, you can only hone the STOCK sleeves to a max .010". If you have a block with Darton sleeves, you can get pretty much whatever size you want up to 4.200". You will need to decide if you want a MID wet sleeve or a dry sleeve block. MID wet's are more expensive and can handle more HP, but you have to run speacial coolant and head gaskets which also add into the price. The dry sleeves are more cost effective and can handle a beating. If your only looking for a 4" bore, the stock LS2 block is the way to go. It comes with a 4" bore, no sleeving required. If you still want a sleeved block, then I reccomend the dry sleeved LS2. I'd only go MID if I were after 800+ rwhp. I have the dry LS2, and Steve would be my number one choice for installation. Katech would be second. I wouldn't let anyone other than those 2 do a sleeved motor.
the problem with dry sleeves (other than factory) is they have a chance to drop and it is pretty much a crap shoot.. there are many many many reports of dry sleeves dropping regardless of who installed them. With the MID , the block will fall apart before a sleeve drops, but you have to run evans coolant at $55 a gal and special head gaskets which arent bad.
If you do build a 4.125 or larger , do expect to pay more for parts like heads than an ls1 or ls2 bore
If you do build a 4.125 or larger , do expect to pay more for parts like heads than an ls1 or ls2 bore
Originally Posted by Beast96Z
Got info? Darton has sleeves up to 4.200" for the LS1 and 2.
In regards to the question, you can only hone the STOCK sleeves to a max .010". If you have a block with Darton sleeves, you can get pretty much whatever size you want up to 4.200". You will need to decide if you want a MID wet sleeve or a dry sleeve block. MID wet's are more expensive and can handle more HP, but you have to run speacial coolant and head gaskets which also add into the price. The dry sleeves are more cost effective and can handle a beating. If your only looking for a 4" bore, the stock LS2 block is the way to go. It comes with a 4" bore, no sleeving required. If you still want a sleeved block, then I reccomend the dry sleeved LS2. I'd only go MID if I were after 800+ rwhp. I have the dry LS2, and Steve would be my number one choice for installation. Katech would be second. I wouldn't let anyone other than those 2 do a sleeved motor.
In regards to the question, you can only hone the STOCK sleeves to a max .010". If you have a block with Darton sleeves, you can get pretty much whatever size you want up to 4.200". You will need to decide if you want a MID wet sleeve or a dry sleeve block. MID wet's are more expensive and can handle more HP, but you have to run speacial coolant and head gaskets which also add into the price. The dry sleeves are more cost effective and can handle a beating. If your only looking for a 4" bore, the stock LS2 block is the way to go. It comes with a 4" bore, no sleeving required. If you still want a sleeved block, then I reccomend the dry sleeved LS2. I'd only go MID if I were after 800+ rwhp. I have the dry LS2, and Steve would be my number one choice for installation. Katech would be second. I wouldn't let anyone other than those 2 do a sleeved motor.
Last edited by jermzz; Sep 16, 2006 at 10:47 PM.
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Block sleeving Actually I did your block too. I'm Darton's installer.
There are two current MID offerings for the LS1. The first can be finished from 4.125" to 4.160" bore. The second goes from 4.170" to 4.200" bore. The gaskets are the limiting factor on bore size. The required Cometics will safely clear a 4.185" bore. I have done several blocks at this bore size. With 4.125" stroke you end up with a 454. You can use a 4.25" crank with the newest longer length sleeves for 468".
Pricing has gone up a bit from the $1,320 quoted for the sleeves.
Keith, the Darton dry sleeves for the LS2 LS7 blocks have a much larger diameter flange than what people were using on the earlier LS1 LS6 blocks. Also the LS2 LS7 blocks are solid between the cylinders unlike the earlier blocks which had a coolant channel. The new sleeves have more than sufficient flange seating area to keep them from sinking. Darton also incorporated sealant grooves in the lower body of the dry liners to keep oil from creeping up between the sleeve and the block and preventing good heat transfer. The LS7 dry liner will go from 4.125" to 4.185" normally aspirated. The sleeves can be installed in either the LS2 or LS7 block.
Steve
There are two current MID offerings for the LS1. The first can be finished from 4.125" to 4.160" bore. The second goes from 4.170" to 4.200" bore. The gaskets are the limiting factor on bore size. The required Cometics will safely clear a 4.185" bore. I have done several blocks at this bore size. With 4.125" stroke you end up with a 454. You can use a 4.25" crank with the newest longer length sleeves for 468".
Pricing has gone up a bit from the $1,320 quoted for the sleeves.
Keith, the Darton dry sleeves for the LS2 LS7 blocks have a much larger diameter flange than what people were using on the earlier LS1 LS6 blocks. Also the LS2 LS7 blocks are solid between the cylinders unlike the earlier blocks which had a coolant channel. The new sleeves have more than sufficient flange seating area to keep them from sinking. Darton also incorporated sealant grooves in the lower body of the dry liners to keep oil from creeping up between the sleeve and the block and preventing good heat transfer. The LS7 dry liner will go from 4.125" to 4.185" normally aspirated. The sleeves can be installed in either the LS2 or LS7 block.
Steve
Originally Posted by jermzz
wow... got search?
Darton makes MID sleeves for the ls1 all the way up to a 4.125 bore, with with a 4" stroke is a 427ci.
Anyone whos anyone seems to send Steve at RED their motor to do their sleeves. Mine were done by Darton themselves. You can go to Thunder Racing, texas speed along with just about any other major sponsor and get the sleeves from them, theyre 1320 dollars. Expect to pay upwards of 2500 for a resleeved block.
Anything else please search, theres plenty on the subject!
Darton makes MID sleeves for the ls1 all the way up to a 4.125 bore, with with a 4" stroke is a 427ci.
Anyone whos anyone seems to send Steve at RED their motor to do their sleeves. Mine were done by Darton themselves. You can go to Thunder Racing, texas speed along with just about any other major sponsor and get the sleeves from them, theyre 1320 dollars. Expect to pay upwards of 2500 for a resleeved block.
Anything else please search, theres plenty on the subject!
__________________
Steve Demirjian
Race Engine Development
Oceanside, Ca.
760-630-0450
web: www.raceenginedevelopment.com/
e-mail: race-engine-development@***.net
Steve Demirjian
Race Engine Development
Oceanside, Ca.
760-630-0450
web: www.raceenginedevelopment.com/
e-mail: race-engine-development@***.net
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Originally Posted by KHShapiro
the problem with dry sleeves (other than factory) is they have a chance to drop and it is pretty much a crap shoot.. there are many many many reports of dry sleeves dropping regardless of who installed them. With the MID , the block will fall apart before a sleeve drops, but you have to run evans coolant at $55 a gal
coating The coating is phosphate. It will not prevent cavitation damage to the sleeves. You must still run Evans in street engines.
The coating was put on to prevent the sleeves from rusting in racing engines that have to run water because of track rules.
The coating was put on to prevent the sleeves from rusting in racing engines that have to run water because of track rules.
Originally Posted by Joe Racer
Darton has begun to put a coating on the outside of the 4.200 sleeves, making it unnecessary to run the Evans coolant. According to them, over time, this coating will be added to the smaller bore versions of MID sleeves.
__________________
Steve Demirjian
Race Engine Development
Oceanside, Ca.
760-630-0450
web: www.raceenginedevelopment.com/
e-mail: race-engine-development@***.net
Steve Demirjian
Race Engine Development
Oceanside, Ca.
760-630-0450
web: www.raceenginedevelopment.com/
e-mail: race-engine-development@***.net
If your gonna get a block done definately go with steve or someone he recommends. He pretty much knows who has the equipment and training to do the job correctly. He did my block for me also btw.
Last edited by BlkHwk; Sep 17, 2006 at 04:07 PM.
Originally Posted by Steve - Race Eng
Actually I did your block too. I'm Darton's installer.
There are two current MID offerings for the LS1. The first can be finished from 4.125" to 4.160" bore. The second goes from 4.170" to 4.200" bore. The gaskets are the limiting factor on bore size. The required Cometics will safely clear a 4.185" bore. I have done several blocks at this bore size. With 4.125" stroke you end up with a 454. You can use a 4.25" crank with the newest longer length sleeves for 468".
Pricing has gone up a bit from the $1,320 quoted for the sleeves.
Keith, the Darton dry sleeves for the LS2 LS7 blocks have a much larger diameter flange than what people were using on the earlier LS1 LS6 blocks. Also the LS2 LS7 blocks are solid between the cylinders unlike the earlier blocks which had a coolant channel. The new sleeves have more than sufficient flange seating area to keep them from sinking. Darton also incorporated sealant grooves in the lower body of the dry liners to keep oil from creeping up between the sleeve and the block and preventing good heat transfer. The LS7 dry liner will go from 4.125" to 4.185" normally aspirated. The sleeves can be installed in either the LS2 or LS7 block.
Steve
There are two current MID offerings for the LS1. The first can be finished from 4.125" to 4.160" bore. The second goes from 4.170" to 4.200" bore. The gaskets are the limiting factor on bore size. The required Cometics will safely clear a 4.185" bore. I have done several blocks at this bore size. With 4.125" stroke you end up with a 454. You can use a 4.25" crank with the newest longer length sleeves for 468".
Pricing has gone up a bit from the $1,320 quoted for the sleeves.
Keith, the Darton dry sleeves for the LS2 LS7 blocks have a much larger diameter flange than what people were using on the earlier LS1 LS6 blocks. Also the LS2 LS7 blocks are solid between the cylinders unlike the earlier blocks which had a coolant channel. The new sleeves have more than sufficient flange seating area to keep them from sinking. Darton also incorporated sealant grooves in the lower body of the dry liners to keep oil from creeping up between the sleeve and the block and preventing good heat transfer. The LS7 dry liner will go from 4.125" to 4.185" normally aspirated. The sleeves can be installed in either the LS2 or LS7 block.
Steve
We spoke in another thread remember I said I had bought this block from another member of the forum and I was looking for the thinnest the wall could be because I had damage? I was told to contact dave at cartek because he got the sleeves which are definitly "dry" sleeves NOT MID. I found out later the sleeves were installed by a premire shop in NJ, after I Was told they were done by Darton .... I havnt had time to figure out that one yet. So you didn't do this one, but I wish you had.
Sorry to hijack.
The problem with dry sleeving is that its not that most sleeves "drop", the aluminum block expands differently than the iron the sleeves are made of and it doesnt go back either and continuingly gets worse as time goes on until it reaches its "plateu" of movement. Usually after this happens you can redeck the block and all is well. The problem with this is look at what you have to go through to get it right if it moves. The dry sleeves are usually installed by most shops are bottomed out in the bore so its pretty much not going to "drop".
Originally Posted by BlkHwk
55 a gal! I think I paid around $28 a gal for the NPGR
Cartek Charlie Weston does the blocks for Cartek as far as I know. Charlie has a good shop and reputation.
Are you having a problem with the block?
Are you having a problem with the block?
Originally Posted by jermzz
Then why dont you remember doing this block? We spoke in another thread remember I said I had bought this block from another member of the forum and I was looking for the thinnest the wall could be because I had damage? I was told to contact dave at cartek because he got the sleeves which are definitly "dry" sleeves NOT MID.
I found out later the sleeves were installed by a premire shop in NJ, after I Was told they were done by Darton .... I havnt had time to figure out that one yet. So you didn't do this one, but I wish you had.
Sorry to hijack.
We spoke in another thread remember I said I had bought this block from another member of the forum and I was looking for the thinnest the wall could be because I had damage? I was told to contact dave at cartek because he got the sleeves which are definitly "dry" sleeves NOT MID. I found out later the sleeves were installed by a premire shop in NJ, after I Was told they were done by Darton .... I havnt had time to figure out that one yet. So you didn't do this one, but I wish you had.
Sorry to hijack.
__________________
Steve Demirjian
Race Engine Development
Oceanside, Ca.
760-630-0450
web: www.raceenginedevelopment.com/
e-mail: race-engine-development@***.net
Steve Demirjian
Race Engine Development
Oceanside, Ca.
760-630-0450
web: www.raceenginedevelopment.com/
e-mail: race-engine-development@***.net
Iron block sleeving Yes, it is possible to put the MID sleeves in an iron block. It is a lot of work compared to machining aluminum. That means it costs a lot more to do.
I did an LQ9 block a couple of years ago. I also do the 5.4 iron Ford blocks. Currently working on an MID sleeve with Darton for the Chrysler 6.1 liter block.
Steve
I did an LQ9 block a couple of years ago. I also do the 5.4 iron Ford blocks. Currently working on an MID sleeve with Darton for the Chrysler 6.1 liter block.
Steve
Originally Posted by Cop Car
can/do they sleeve iron blocks? you know like the 5.3 and 6.0 blocks. i want to know if anyone has resleved a 5.3...
__________________
Steve Demirjian
Race Engine Development
Oceanside, Ca.
760-630-0450
web: www.raceenginedevelopment.com/
e-mail: race-engine-development@***.net
Steve Demirjian
Race Engine Development
Oceanside, Ca.
760-630-0450
web: www.raceenginedevelopment.com/
e-mail: race-engine-development@***.net
Gaskets Cometic designed an MID specific head gasket for Darton. That is the only recommended gasket to use with an MID sleeved block. That particular gasket will also work with dry sleeved LS2 LS7 blocks.
Evans is currently $32.50 a gallon.
Evans is currently $32.50 a gallon.
Originally Posted by jermzz
What special head gaskets? NPG is 27, it must have went up, I was only paying 20 a few months ago.. crap!
__________________
Steve Demirjian
Race Engine Development
Oceanside, Ca.
760-630-0450
web: www.raceenginedevelopment.com/
e-mail: race-engine-development@***.net
Steve Demirjian
Race Engine Development
Oceanside, Ca.
760-630-0450
web: www.raceenginedevelopment.com/
e-mail: race-engine-development@***.net