Removing AIR system
Re: Removing AIR system I have a feeling that if there are no flow tests, like there is on EGR, it should be simple to replace the control circuit with a resistor of the right size.... Now if someone can measure the right size <img src="gr_stretch.gif" border="0">
\chris
\chris
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From: Richmond, VA Where fast cars, well......are hard to come by.
Re: Removing AIR system I thought the AIR system periodically turns on and the pcm looks for way lean readings on the o2's to make sure the pump works. If that's the case, then we just need a relay that kicks in when the AIR circuit is activated to send a 'false' o2 reading to the pcm. <img src="images/icons/confused.gif" border="0">
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Re: Removing AIR system What it actually does is pump in fresh air at startup to help light the cats off faster. If you take it off with cats on the car the PCM can inject more fuel than required at startup which can kill the cats over time. (It is expecting the added air charge from the AIR Pump)
Cheers,
Chris
Cheers,
Chris
Re: Removing AIR system [quote]Originally posted by J'sRamAir:
<strong>
This is what I want to know. I don't see why this would be any different than the !CAGS mod. Certainly a better option than $500 programming. I'll be running an ORP within a few months anyway.
[ February 06, 2002: Message edited by: J'sRamAir ]</strong><hr></blockquote>
Does anyone have a working AIR pump around that they can measure the resistance of? Dont worry about Impedence... since its DC, the steady state resistance is all the load we need to simulate. Considering that there may be more than 2 pins, you may have to measure a matrix of resistances and if it chassis grounds, you want to measure the resistance of each pin to the chassis or to the bolt that it bolts to the car with.
\chris
<strong>
This is what I want to know. I don't see why this would be any different than the !CAGS mod. Certainly a better option than $500 programming. I'll be running an ORP within a few months anyway.
[ February 06, 2002: Message edited by: J'sRamAir ]</strong><hr></blockquote>
Does anyone have a working AIR pump around that they can measure the resistance of? Dont worry about Impedence... since its DC, the steady state resistance is all the load we need to simulate. Considering that there may be more than 2 pins, you may have to measure a matrix of resistances and if it chassis grounds, you want to measure the resistance of each pin to the chassis or to the bolt that it bolts to the car with.
\chris
Re: Removing AIR system [quote]Originally posted by Chris ARE 360:
<strong>What it actually does is pump in fresh air at startup to help light the cats off faster. If you take it off with cats on the car the PCM can inject more fuel than required at startup which can kill the cats over time. (It is expecting the added air charge from the AIR Pump)
Cheers,
Chris</strong><hr></blockquote>
But its open loop at startup, hence it wont even be looking at the O2s. The o2's are heated sensors too and need to be warmed up as well. I dont know how all of this will react with each other... true.... there may be some big problems if you remove the extra o2 of the AIR pump after is goes closed loop...but does it ever run the AIR pump closed loop? I dunno :/
\chris
<strong>What it actually does is pump in fresh air at startup to help light the cats off faster. If you take it off with cats on the car the PCM can inject more fuel than required at startup which can kill the cats over time. (It is expecting the added air charge from the AIR Pump)
Cheers,
Chris</strong><hr></blockquote>
But its open loop at startup, hence it wont even be looking at the O2s. The o2's are heated sensors too and need to be warmed up as well. I dont know how all of this will react with each other... true.... there may be some big problems if you remove the extra o2 of the AIR pump after is goes closed loop...but does it ever run the AIR pump closed loop? I dunno :/
\chris
Re: Removing AIR system *IF* I were to remove the AIR pump, I would leave the tubes there and secure them where the AIR pump used to be. Then install the blockoff plate between the tube and the headers. We have emmissions station wrench monkeys here whose idea of a emmissions test includes looking for things like AIR pumps. I think the AIR pump itself is hard enough to see that they just verify that there are lines going to the headers. This would be only 5lbs dropped rather than 8 tho ;-)
\chris
\chris
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Verdad Gallardo Re: Removing AIR system So wait...are you saying that the PCM injects extra fuel at startup to light off the cats? I dont think it does...I think only fresh air through the AIR pump. Maybe though... I should go do some google'in
\chris
\chris
Re: Removing AIR system very interesting. I too was planning on removing the AIR system. Somebody figure out if we can use a resistor!! <img src="graemlins/gr_hail.gif" border="0" alt="[hail]" />
Re: Removing AIR system I removed my air system, well not really, I still have the pump and tubes, just installed the block off plates. I run off road pipes with my FLP's, but would it kill my CATS if I ran like it is now? I only have to have them in for a month or so, for a court case involving a ticket for improper emissions control device <img src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0">
Anyway, I'm going to remove the pump entirely this spring before i race. Thoughts. Thanks.
Anyway, I'm going to remove the pump entirely this spring before i race. Thoughts. Thanks.
Re: Removing AIR system Well...On the big scale, for most (99.999% of us)...(In fact almost everyone except Raughammer)... saving 4 lbs while risking a bunch of ECM codes and Emmissions hassles seems like a poor risk... but then hey... who am I? <img src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" border="0">
\chris
\chris
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From: Lexington, SC
Re: Removing AIR system Well I wouldn't mind doing this just so I can have something to do one Saturday afternoon. I wouldn't do it just for the weight anyway...I think it would look much better under the hood. It seems like it should be real easy to remove, that's why I want to find out to see if a resistor of some type would work. I don't know much about electronics. So again, does anyone know if a resistor like the !CAGS mod would work for the AIR and/or EGR system? Doesn't look like anyone knows. <img src="gr_sad.gif" border="0">
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Jan 2002
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From: LSU
Re: Removing AIR system If someone would give me details on this resistor mod I will try it when I remove my AIR tomorrow. As long as these codes present no harm for the motor I can live with them.
I have absolutely NO codes from the removal of AIR, and the car has been running without it for almost 6 months. The only code from the last scan I did was from the EGR, and I am waiting for the cam to tune it all out.
