First Time Dyno Sheet...Tell Me What You Think?
06-21-2002, 02:57 PM
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Staging Lane
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First Time Dyno Sheet...Tell Me What You Think? Do the HP numbers seem low for my mods and dyno tuning?
How do the HP & TQ curves look?
Does the HP line normally slope down that steep after peak?
Should my peak HP be at higher rpm's?
Obviously, I'm not sure what to look for. The car feels pretty strong and pulls nice and hard from 3500 to 5500 rpm's after the cam install.
Any thoughts are appreciated.
Try this address...
http://www.villagephotos.com/pubbrow...selected=50635
<small>[ June 21, 2002, 03:56 PM: Message edited by: SS 2Grand ]</small>
How do the HP & TQ curves look?
Does the HP line normally slope down that steep after peak?
Should my peak HP be at higher rpm's?
Obviously, I'm not sure what to look for. The car feels pretty strong and pulls nice and hard from 3500 to 5500 rpm's after the cam install.
Any thoughts are appreciated.
Try this address...
http://www.villagephotos.com/pubbrow...selected=50635
<small>[ June 21, 2002, 03:56 PM: Message edited by: SS 2Grand ]</small>
06-21-2002, 03:18 PM
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Re: First Time Dyno Sheet...Tell Me What You Think? The numbers are ok.. but
I havent seen any cars dyno really well with those SLP headers with cats. May want to consider a different set of headers
Chris
I havent seen any cars dyno really well with those SLP headers with cats. May want to consider a different set of headers
Chris
06-21-2002, 03:22 PM
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Re: First Time Dyno Sheet...Tell Me What You Think? What did your numbers come out to? With stock internals I dyno'd 338/358 and I am getting ready to drop in a TR224. I hope to get at least 370, I hope (the sheet isnt showing when I looked)
<small>[ June 21, 2002, 03:23 PM: Message edited by: bd mnky ]</small>
<small>[ June 21, 2002, 03:23 PM: Message edited by: bd mnky ]</small>
06-21-2002, 03:58 PM
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Re: First Time Dyno Sheet...Tell Me What You Think? I think I fixed the link to the dyno sheet...
My numbers were...
RWHP = 328
RWTQ = 362
Car's mods are in sig. I know with an A4 and a somewhat loose convertor that the numbers would be lower, but I was expecting more HP. I think the TQ is OK.
Tom @ Speed Inc recommended the SLP headers, that's why I went with them.
My numbers were...
RWHP = 328
RWTQ = 362
Car's mods are in sig. I know with an A4 and a somewhat loose convertor that the numbers would be lower, but I was expecting more HP. I think the TQ is OK.
Tom @ Speed Inc recommended the SLP headers, that's why I went with them.
06-21-2002, 04:52 PM
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Re: First Time Dyno Sheet...Tell Me What You Think? I would think that with that cam & headers you should have at least 360-370 hp. I got 350 hp in a '02 WS6 with just a T1 cam, Corsa exhaust, a lid & tuning.
Les
Les
06-24-2002, 10:08 AM
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Re: First Time Dyno Sheet...Tell Me What You Think? Yeah, I definitely need to get to the track this Summer.
I had quite a few problems with this round of mods. The cam and ported TB swap went smoothly, but when we started dynoing it, that's when everything went south. I pulled 329rwhp and 359rwtq after the two installs, but before dyno tuning. Then, my battery died on the dyno. We had to send out my computer to get it re-flashed by a GM dealer. Five days later (thanks GM!) the computer was back and my SS was back on the dyno with a new battery as well. After a total of 11 pulls!!!, my numbers only went up by 3rwtq and 0rwhp. Speed Inc. did so many pulls because they themselves thought these numbers were low. I too was hoping to pick up a few ponies with the dyno tuning.
When I went to pick the car up, it was stumbling very bad at idle and I was getting a perpetual flashing SES. They A-tapped the car and my computer wasn't even registering that the SES light was flashing because even though A-tap was showing mis-fires, nothing was showing up about the code for the SES light?
They kept it overnight and found a bad plug, so they installed an entire new set. Now, the cars runs pretty good now, only an occasional SES light after long periods of idleing in OD. We did not get the car up on the dyno after the new plugs and smoothed out idle, but I'm not sure I would have picked up any HP numbers based on this alone?
Maybe I just have a dog from the factory? The SOTP meter feels great from 3,500rpm's on up, a definite gain there. Speed Inc. was great through this whole ordeal and I would recommend them to anyone. My car was there so long, I thought I was going to have to pay for parking! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
I had quite a few problems with this round of mods. The cam and ported TB swap went smoothly, but when we started dynoing it, that's when everything went south. I pulled 329rwhp and 359rwtq after the two installs, but before dyno tuning. Then, my battery died on the dyno. We had to send out my computer to get it re-flashed by a GM dealer. Five days later (thanks GM!) the computer was back and my SS was back on the dyno with a new battery as well. After a total of 11 pulls!!!, my numbers only went up by 3rwtq and 0rwhp. Speed Inc. did so many pulls because they themselves thought these numbers were low. I too was hoping to pick up a few ponies with the dyno tuning.
When I went to pick the car up, it was stumbling very bad at idle and I was getting a perpetual flashing SES. They A-tapped the car and my computer wasn't even registering that the SES light was flashing because even though A-tap was showing mis-fires, nothing was showing up about the code for the SES light?
They kept it overnight and found a bad plug, so they installed an entire new set. Now, the cars runs pretty good now, only an occasional SES light after long periods of idleing in OD. We did not get the car up on the dyno after the new plugs and smoothed out idle, but I'm not sure I would have picked up any HP numbers based on this alone?
Maybe I just have a dog from the factory? The SOTP meter feels great from 3,500rpm's on up, a definite gain there. Speed Inc. was great through this whole ordeal and I would recommend them to anyone. My car was there so long, I thought I was going to have to pay for parking! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
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06-24-2002, 11:17 AM
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Re: First Time Dyno Sheet...Tell Me What You Think? I finally just got my TR224 in and am getting that damn intermiten SES light as well. I really wan to get it dyno'd before I chnage my plugs, kinda want to do a step by step deal until I get it all done. But man a cam is a great thing isn't it <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
06-24-2002, 11:19 AM
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Re: First Time Dyno Sheet...Tell Me What You Think? BTW I bought my SLP LT's from Tom as well, they are awsome to deal with. <img border="0" alt="[cheers]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_cheers.gif" />
06-24-2002, 02:58 PM
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Re: First Time Dyno Sheet...Tell Me What You Think? Is that dyno sheet for real? 7300 RPM, a flat power curve from 6000-7300, and a perfectly flat AF ratio from 4500-7300. It sounds too good to be true. I almost feel like you're pulling a practical joke. I'm new to LS1s so I'll assume that this is just the norm for a combo like yours.
A couple questions: What mods did you do to the shortblock to make it safe at 7300, and how did you get the AF ratio flat?
As for my two cents, your flat power curve is a really neat feat. The benefit to that is it allows you to make the best average accelleration in a given gear. This is a design philosophy I used to subscribe to.
I have since learned differently. To make power you combine RPM and Torque. These also happen to be the two things that are bad for the engine (too much RPM and the shortblock comes apart, too much torque and you have detonation) so the key to making good power is to push both of these variables (RPM and torque) to their safe limits.
Since I am not a LS1 expert, I am going to make the assumption that you know what you're doing and your shortblock is safe to 7300.
The reason you're not making good power [for your RPM level] is you're not making enough torque at high RPM. Since your torque peak is at 3700 you have the highest tendancy to detonate there. At RPMs above that your torque drops, which reduces your tendancy to detonate but also decreases the power.
If your concern is making the most power possible without blowing the motor up, what you need to do is make a flat torque curve (which implies an increasing horsepower curve).
Given the current dyno graph, the best way to achieve this is a centrifugal blower. I'm actually a fan of turbos myself, but in this particular case where you've got a declining torque curve the blower will fix ya right up.
Buy a t-trim and a whole bunch of pulleys, then start small and keep going bigger until the torque curve is flat and just shy of detonation.
Assuming you can make 360 ft/lbs without detonation (is it detonating at 3700 now?), you can make another 200hp and maintain the same margin of safety against detonation as you currently see (except right now the margin of safety is thinnest at 3700, and with a flat torque curve it will be that thin everywhere).
Sorry if I confused more than helped.
- Steve
A couple questions: What mods did you do to the shortblock to make it safe at 7300, and how did you get the AF ratio flat?
As for my two cents, your flat power curve is a really neat feat. The benefit to that is it allows you to make the best average accelleration in a given gear. This is a design philosophy I used to subscribe to.
I have since learned differently. To make power you combine RPM and Torque. These also happen to be the two things that are bad for the engine (too much RPM and the shortblock comes apart, too much torque and you have detonation) so the key to making good power is to push both of these variables (RPM and torque) to their safe limits.
Since I am not a LS1 expert, I am going to make the assumption that you know what you're doing and your shortblock is safe to 7300.
The reason you're not making good power [for your RPM level] is you're not making enough torque at high RPM. Since your torque peak is at 3700 you have the highest tendancy to detonate there. At RPMs above that your torque drops, which reduces your tendancy to detonate but also decreases the power.
If your concern is making the most power possible without blowing the motor up, what you need to do is make a flat torque curve (which implies an increasing horsepower curve).
Given the current dyno graph, the best way to achieve this is a centrifugal blower. I'm actually a fan of turbos myself, but in this particular case where you've got a declining torque curve the blower will fix ya right up.
Buy a t-trim and a whole bunch of pulleys, then start small and keep going bigger until the torque curve is flat and just shy of detonation.
Assuming you can make 360 ft/lbs without detonation (is it detonating at 3700 now?), you can make another 200hp and maintain the same margin of safety against detonation as you currently see (except right now the margin of safety is thinnest at 3700, and with a flat torque curve it will be that thin everywhere).
Sorry if I confused more than helped.
- Steve
06-24-2002, 02:59 PM
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Re: First Time Dyno Sheet...Tell Me What You Think? Even after getting mine dyno tuned, I still get the occasional flashing SES light whenever I'm stopped at a light for more than 30 seconds. Then the light goes away. This seems to really only happen when the car is cold though. It rarely happens when the car is warm.
Even though my HP numbers are low for my mods, I can definitely feel the difference the cam made. Pulls very hard mid-range to about 5500 rpms.
Even though my HP numbers are low for my mods, I can definitely feel the difference the cam made. Pulls very hard mid-range to about 5500 rpms.
06-24-2002, 03:10 PM
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Re: First Time Dyno Sheet...Tell Me What You Think? Steve,
First off, that is a little over my head <img border="0" title="" alt="[Embarrassed]" src="gr_emb.gif" /> since this is the first time I've ever dyno'ed any car. I have no reason to believe the dyno sheet isn't legit since I've been going to Speed Inc. for my mods over the past couple of years and they are a well-respected sponsor of this site. However, I wasn't there during this particular dyno run either.
Anyone else have any thoughts on this dyno? That's exactly why I posted the dyno sheet here, to get opinions on how it looked from the many people on this board who are much more experienced than I am.
First off, that is a little over my head <img border="0" title="" alt="[Embarrassed]" src="gr_emb.gif" /> since this is the first time I've ever dyno'ed any car. I have no reason to believe the dyno sheet isn't legit since I've been going to Speed Inc. for my mods over the past couple of years and they are a well-respected sponsor of this site. However, I wasn't there during this particular dyno run either.
Anyone else have any thoughts on this dyno? That's exactly why I posted the dyno sheet here, to get opinions on how it looked from the many people on this board who are much more experienced than I am.
06-24-2002, 03:17 PM
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Re: First Time Dyno Sheet...Tell Me What You Think? I believe they were corrected numbers. That's what I thought the SAE stood for? It was very hot and humid (around 90F) the day they dynoed.
Also, my tires are inflated to around 25psi. Would 32psi have helped my numbers?
Also, my tires are inflated to around 25psi. Would 32psi have helped my numbers?
06-24-2002, 03:19 PM
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Re: First Time Dyno Sheet...Tell Me What You Think? I dont know too much about this, but does anyone else find it weird that his torque peaks at around 3600 RPM? Isnt it suppost to be more like 4300-4400 with a cam that size? And the HP numbers do seem a little low. Stock 02 LS1s are dynoing 318.
06-24-2002, 04:59 PM
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Re: First Time Dyno Sheet...Tell Me What You Think? Thats really weird that the TQ peak is at 3600. Damn, its lower than that stock. It should be at least 1000 rpm higher than that. Also, what is your rev limiter at? 7300 rpm on a stock bottom ended motor. Thats a little high for stock heads...Notice how low the torque is there. Wonder what the ICL is for your cam? Advanced about 107? to get the power down that low in the band. It should be between 110 and 114 with a 114 LSA depending on the grind and how the chain tolerances stack up. Also, a flashing SES light is not normal for a 222 cam.
Brad
Brad
06-24-2002, 05:54 PM
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Re: First Time Dyno Sheet...Tell Me What You Think? Flashing SES at idle?
Ask PaulG about that on the www.MFBA.org ubb. I think that is the sign of a broken valvespring or the MAF has a messed up wire. His car car dynoed about 20rwhp lower than it should have too.
Ask PaulG about that on the www.MFBA.org ubb. I think that is the sign of a broken valvespring or the MAF has a messed up wire. His car car dynoed about 20rwhp lower than it should have too.
06-24-2002, 06:28 PM
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Re: First Time Dyno Sheet...Tell Me What You Think? is the torque supposed to drop off that badly? the hp curve looks good but that torque curve looks really weird. i know it drops after peak but sheesh its down around 225lb-ft at 7000.
