Starting with C5R block....
08-16-2002, 05:17 PM
#181
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Re: Starting with C5R block.... If you had the spherical valve train on a C5R motor that had an intake that could support the super high RPM's, oh my god that would make me cry! You're my hero! <img border="0" alt="[hail]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_hail.gif" />
I am curious though how much power you could get out of a C5R engine given no rules and limitations. 600rwhp seems to be achieveable though how high would you have to spin the motor to get there?
I am curious though how much power you could get out of a C5R engine given no rules and limitations. 600rwhp seems to be achieveable though how high would you have to spin the motor to get there?
08-16-2002, 07:14 PM
#182
Re: Starting with C5R block.... I have read too much. Its time to add my .02 I normally try to be constructive on this site and help out where I can. I have to draw the line here. This has to be the biggest [EDIT] contest I have ever seen. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> A man with an "endless" budget taking sincere advice from the internet. Smart move bro. Lets see here, lets take a 50k car with matched serial #s and collectors value and lets deface it and turn it into a hotrod. Good one. If you wanted a C5R from the start why not let GMMG complete the install and have one of the #ed ZL1s with a matched data sheet. Or if you wanted a hotrod why not go buy a stripper Z28 and build the C5R package around it. Either of the above ideas makes plenty of sense, yet what you are doing to an awesome car makes absolutely none.
As for all the GRB followers, I find it amusing you can sit here and toot this guys horn just because he has money to blow. C5Rs are nothing new. I agree its a badass set up, but all this bowing down and praising GRB is simply idiotic. While youre on your knees [EDIT] <img border="0" alt="[gay]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_rainbow.gif" /> It will be a cold day in hell before I am jealous of another mans fortune or his extreme desire for public admiration.
Lastly, I wish you luck with your ZL1, while its sad you are trashing a truly awesome car, Im sure in the end you will be happy. If nothing else you have guys on their knees for miles waiting to [EDIT] and praise you for your bank account and 12k C5R heads.
EDITOR'S NOTE!- You are certainly entitled to share your opinions of other's projects but please try to do it in a less offensive and immature manner. Thanks! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
<small>[ August 19, 2002, 01:25 PM: Message edited by: Colonel ]</small>
As for all the GRB followers, I find it amusing you can sit here and toot this guys horn just because he has money to blow. C5Rs are nothing new. I agree its a badass set up, but all this bowing down and praising GRB is simply idiotic. While youre on your knees [EDIT] <img border="0" alt="[gay]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_rainbow.gif" /> It will be a cold day in hell before I am jealous of another mans fortune or his extreme desire for public admiration.
Lastly, I wish you luck with your ZL1, while its sad you are trashing a truly awesome car, Im sure in the end you will be happy. If nothing else you have guys on their knees for miles waiting to [EDIT] and praise you for your bank account and 12k C5R heads.
EDITOR'S NOTE!- You are certainly entitled to share your opinions of other's projects but please try to do it in a less offensive and immature manner. Thanks! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
<small>[ August 19, 2002, 01:25 PM: Message edited by: Colonel ]</small>
08-17-2002, 12:07 AM
#183
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Re: Starting with C5R block.... <img border="0" alt="[jester]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_jest.gif" /> Holy Shnizit!!!!!! <img border="0" alt="[jester]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_jest.gif" /> <img border="0" alt="[judgement]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_judge.gif" /> <img border="0" alt="[jester]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_jest.gif" /> <img border="0" alt="[jester]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_jest.gif" />
08-18-2002, 09:23 AM
#185
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Re: Starting with C5R block.... Thank God someone on this site knows what I am talking about. Cammin Beast is just telling it like it is. When I told GRB what I thought of his project everyone on this site flamed me and said I was a hater and ****. I know GRB and his engine builder are way over their heads and why in the hell ask for help over the internet. This just does not make sense. GRB needs professional help not guys with bolt-ons and a few guys with heads and cams telling him how to build a motor. There are a few guys on thie site who know what they are doing but 99% of people on this site have never even built a motor in their life and what little knowledge they do have is just from the internet and magazines. Best of Luck with your car and I will see ya at the track GRB!!!! LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
08-19-2002, 01:11 PM
#186
TECH Senior Member
Re: Starting with C5R block.... That was harsh and very immaturely said by Cammin, IMO. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> Personnal attacks should be taken to email. This isn't the place for it.
I think flow testing on FULLY ported LS6 v/s FULLY ported C5R heads at .600, .700, and .800 lift woud be interesting and would show the true benefits of C5R heads (notice the emphasis on FULLY as in, NOT just CNC'd.)
P.S., I'd go with one big TB rather than two smaller ones.
I think flow testing on FULLY ported LS6 v/s FULLY ported C5R heads at .600, .700, and .800 lift woud be interesting and would show the true benefits of C5R heads (notice the emphasis on FULLY as in, NOT just CNC'd.)
P.S., I'd go with one big TB rather than two smaller ones.
08-19-2002, 01:19 PM
#187
LS1Tech Co-Founder
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Re: Starting with C5R block.... Cammin, why do you care so much, just skip over this thread then if it bothers you.
If someone can spend like $100,000 on a car and combo then my reaction is like cool, let's see what they do.
If someone can spend like $100,000 on a car and combo then my reaction is like cool, let's see what they do.
08-19-2002, 09:27 PM
#188
Re: Starting with C5R block.... </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Colonel:
<strong>That was harsh and very immaturely said by Cammin, IMO. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> Personnal attacks should be taken to email. This isn't the place for it.
I think flow testing on FULLY ported LS6 v/s FULLY ported C5R heads at .600, .700, and .800 lift woud be interesting and would show the true benefits of C5R heads (notice the emphasis on FULLY as in, NOT just CNC'd.)
P.S., I'd go with one big TB rather than two smaller ones.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Colonel, sorry ya feel my post was immature. In my eyes it had its place in the thread as much as anyone elses post. Why can one man say how totally cool he is for building an ultimate race car, yet I cant state my opinion in regards to trashing a serial#d and data sheet having collectors vehicle.
I do agree with EvilZ in that he is taking advice from the wrong source of people. If GRB had so much money and was building the ultiate car he should consult people who have experience in such. 99% of the responses on this thread have been people with bolt on cars and absolutely no experience in high performance engine building. Why would a person building a 50k engine resort to taking advice from a person of this caliber.
Thats just my .02 If ya dont like it do as was said to me above. Simply skip over it. Had I felt out of place I would have said it in email. I still feel what I said wasnt out of place and deserved to be stated.
<strong>That was harsh and very immaturely said by Cammin, IMO. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> Personnal attacks should be taken to email. This isn't the place for it.
I think flow testing on FULLY ported LS6 v/s FULLY ported C5R heads at .600, .700, and .800 lift woud be interesting and would show the true benefits of C5R heads (notice the emphasis on FULLY as in, NOT just CNC'd.)
P.S., I'd go with one big TB rather than two smaller ones.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Colonel, sorry ya feel my post was immature. In my eyes it had its place in the thread as much as anyone elses post. Why can one man say how totally cool he is for building an ultimate race car, yet I cant state my opinion in regards to trashing a serial#d and data sheet having collectors vehicle.
I do agree with EvilZ in that he is taking advice from the wrong source of people. If GRB had so much money and was building the ultiate car he should consult people who have experience in such. 99% of the responses on this thread have been people with bolt on cars and absolutely no experience in high performance engine building. Why would a person building a 50k engine resort to taking advice from a person of this caliber.
Thats just my .02 If ya dont like it do as was said to me above. Simply skip over it. Had I felt out of place I would have said it in email. I still feel what I said wasnt out of place and deserved to be stated.
08-21-2002, 04:54 PM
#189
TECH Senior Member
Re: Starting with C5R block.... Make no mistake. You ARE entitled to share you're opinion. I stated that in your post that I cleaned the filth from. I take no exception to your sharing of opinion. Heck, for all you know I may even agree with your opinion in this matter.
However, you can convey your opinion without the use of such lude and crude language. You can also take personnal attacks to private email since they have no technical merit and thus do not belong here. Deal? Thanks. That's all I'm asking. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
However, you can convey your opinion without the use of such lude and crude language. You can also take personnal attacks to private email since they have no technical merit and thus do not belong here. Deal? Thanks. That's all I'm asking. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
08-21-2002, 10:18 PM
#191
Re: Starting with C5R block.... Just a heads up---I contacted Coates about their spherical rotary valve right after I took delivery of my Formula--tha was May 1999. They stated they had no interest in designing a set of heads for the LS1 motors. If I am not mistaken; they have dropped that project and moved on to other things. Now; the rumored "Camless" C6 heads would be very cool. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
08-23-2002, 01:40 AM
#192
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Re: Starting with C5R block.... My $.10,
I have been actively envolved in this thread.GRB is not asking how to build a motor, but rather asking people what the best combo would be.
Some of the guys on here have had 15 cams or more plus just as many head sets, and so they have knowledge on this subject. Several members have Stage 3 heads..........and others have a 427.
Did you ever stop and think about what others have, or have had! Valuable information is being past on here and as such......if someone read this post in the future it may help them further. Remember that GRB is going to keep us all posted on the build and in doing so we may benefit from it.
Obviously it is of interest to people because of all the replys, and all of the follow-ups.
Also, remember he asked to be unique, and so, he got our opinion as to what unique is!
It is also obvious why he is building a ZL1 up........did you not read the entire post? It is a legend in it self and originally came with a 427. Who cares if its #ed, if you plan to keep the car forever it doesn't matter.....even if you don't, it makes it more "unique/special" then a "stripper"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BTW,
Your entire post seems a statement of jealousy, rather then an opinion. He has money and so what........do you think that if he didn't have money we wouldn't be interested? Get real man, if you think that someone has to have money for people to be interested it is because you don't have any.
I have been actively envolved in this thread.GRB is not asking how to build a motor, but rather asking people what the best combo would be.
Some of the guys on here have had 15 cams or more plus just as many head sets, and so they have knowledge on this subject. Several members have Stage 3 heads..........and others have a 427.
Did you ever stop and think about what others have, or have had! Valuable information is being past on here and as such......if someone read this post in the future it may help them further. Remember that GRB is going to keep us all posted on the build and in doing so we may benefit from it.
Obviously it is of interest to people because of all the replys, and all of the follow-ups.
Also, remember he asked to be unique, and so, he got our opinion as to what unique is!
It is also obvious why he is building a ZL1 up........did you not read the entire post? It is a legend in it self and originally came with a 427. Who cares if its #ed, if you plan to keep the car forever it doesn't matter.....even if you don't, it makes it more "unique/special" then a "stripper"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BTW,
Your entire post seems a statement of jealousy, rather then an opinion. He has money and so what........do you think that if he didn't have money we wouldn't be interested? Get real man, if you think that someone has to have money for people to be interested it is because you don't have any.
08-23-2002, 10:17 AM
#193
Re: Starting with C5R block.... Ya know grb; if you wanted to be unique in that neighborhood of yours, and keep American Muscle under the hood, you could buy an Ultima GTR and have them install a C5R motor instead of the LS1. Or buy a Mosler MT900 and install a C5R motor instead of the LS1. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> Then you'd have the exotic chassis and the monster American motor!! <img border="0" alt="[Burnout]" title="" src="graemlins/burnout.gif" />
08-23-2002, 10:35 AM
#194
LS1Tech Co-Founder
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Re: Starting with C5R block.... The point of a thread like this is to debate different combinations of parts. I think folks have given GRB some points to ponder and some data points regarding potential issues or the potential costs. Personally I think our board helps people like GRB become educated buyers. And keep in mind, he's got some money to spend and this is not an average build. He's not looking to pinch pennies.
08-23-2002, 11:26 AM
#195
6600 rpm clutch dump of death Administrator
Re: Starting with C5R block.... Look guys. I know all about numbers matching, and how important that is.
I helped a friend find a 69SS 396 Chevelle. We had to look at 32 cars over a 3 year period to find one that was "right".
I own a numbers matching 67 Camaro SS350 with A/C and an automatic.
So, I can appreciate originality.
However, as folks have already pointed out. Its his car and its his money.
This is supposed to be a good site to pick up technical info about the LS1. If you have something to add to his request for technical data then fine stand up and say so.
While folks are protected by the Constitution and have rights under that Constitution to speak their mind in a public forum, perhaps they might temper that with a bit of maturity.
You may not agree with GRB's actions but there is nothing wrong with building your dream car. Especially if Lamar Walden is helping you do it.
I wonder how many of you naysayers out there would change your tune if he said John Lingenfelter, MTI, or ARE was putting it together?
How about adding CONSTRUCTIVE criticism if you need to add anything.
I.E.
I disagree, and here is why....
Not
%#@%@# you, you @$@!$!!! Why are you building that you are a ^#$%^#@ #@$$%@#....
I helped a friend find a 69SS 396 Chevelle. We had to look at 32 cars over a 3 year period to find one that was "right".
I own a numbers matching 67 Camaro SS350 with A/C and an automatic.
So, I can appreciate originality.
However, as folks have already pointed out. Its his car and its his money.
This is supposed to be a good site to pick up technical info about the LS1. If you have something to add to his request for technical data then fine stand up and say so.
While folks are protected by the Constitution and have rights under that Constitution to speak their mind in a public forum, perhaps they might temper that with a bit of maturity.
You may not agree with GRB's actions but there is nothing wrong with building your dream car. Especially if Lamar Walden is helping you do it.
I wonder how many of you naysayers out there would change your tune if he said John Lingenfelter, MTI, or ARE was putting it together?
How about adding CONSTRUCTIVE criticism if you need to add anything.
I.E.
I disagree, and here is why....
Not
%#@%@# you, you @$@!$!!! Why are you building that you are a ^#$%^#@ #@$$%@#....
08-23-2002, 05:08 PM
#196
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Re: Starting with C5R block.... Guy's I have talked with Ray "GRB" a number of times while I was selling him my C5R heads and valves. This guy is a totally nice guy. He does not lie about what he is doing and is really spending some time looking at all the different ways he can go. My heads were on the board "one" day before he bought them. I overnighted the heads to him and he even paid the full $171 shipping cost. He has been straight up the whole time. I talked with Lamar and he was a straight up guy with a whole lot of knoweledge we can benefit from. He has got some serious connections in the racing scene. The people that know me on the board know that I am a non bullshitter. I have even had to prove it at those late night street races before when talk gets out of hand.
There are different racers out there. Some of which are just Dyno racers. To me Ray "GRB" is a man that loves car period.
By the way if someone starts to get rude with me I will let you know right now, "I WILL MAKE PLANS TO MEET YOU."
THANKS! Daniel "EL ES 1"
There are different racers out there. Some of which are just Dyno racers. To me Ray "GRB" is a man that loves car period.
By the way if someone starts to get rude with me I will let you know right now, "I WILL MAKE PLANS TO MEET YOU."
THANKS! Daniel "EL ES 1"
08-23-2002, 05:29 PM
#197
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Re: Starting with C5R block.... If you want to go fast call Keith Black and put a real motor in it....HEMI <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> <img border="0" alt="[Fluffy]" title="" src="graemlins/fluffy.gif" />
<small>[ August 23, 2002, 05:30 PM: Message edited by: TimeWarp ]</small>
<small>[ August 23, 2002, 05:30 PM: Message edited by: TimeWarp ]</small>
08-25-2002, 01:04 AM
#198
Re: Starting with C5R block.... Any update on your C5R set-up?
Is your car an automatic, or a 6-speed? I don't remember seeing it in your previous posts.
<img border="0" alt="[Firebird]" title="" src="graemlins/formula.gif" />
Is your car an automatic, or a 6-speed? I don't remember seeing it in your previous posts.
<img border="0" alt="[Firebird]" title="" src="graemlins/formula.gif" />
08-25-2002, 11:14 AM
#199
Re: Starting with C5R block.... </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by z0sense:
<strong>My $.10,
I have been actively envolved in this thread.GRB is not asking how to build a motor, but rather asking people what the best combo would be.
Some of the guys on here have had 15 cams or more plus just as many head sets, and so they have knowledge on this subject. Several members have Stage 3 heads..........and others have a 427.
Did you ever stop and think about what others have, or have had! Valuable information is being past on here and as such......if someone read this post in the future it may help them further. Remember that GRB is going to keep us all posted on the build and in doing so we may benefit from it.
Obviously it is of interest to people because of all the replys, and all of the follow-ups.
Also, remember he asked to be unique, and so, he got our opinion as to what unique is!
It is also obvious why he is building a ZL1 up........did you not read the entire post? It is a legend in it self and originally came with a 427. Who cares if its #ed, if you plan to keep the car forever it doesn't matter.....even if you don't, it makes it more "unique/special" then a "stripper"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BTW,
Your entire post seems a statement of jealousy, rather then an opinion. He has money and so what........do you think that if he didn't have money we wouldn't be interested? Get real man, if you think that someone has to have money for people to be interested it is because you don't have any.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Interesting reply you have. You are correct, some members on this board have had 15 cams and 10 heads. My question to you is how many of them were on race prepped C5R motors? How many of them made the power the desired? Im assuming you have a C5R race crate with C5R heads as well since you are so willingly making your educated contributions here.
As for jealousy, not in the least. I have the right to state my opinion as much as the next guy. Im sorry I didnt jump on the band wagon and praise him for building a motor....
As for the ZL1, I know its history quite well, I also believe its being offered with the C5R 427 straight from GMMG. That being the case, the car would be worth much more with original #s and matching block vin#s.
<strong>My $.10,
I have been actively envolved in this thread.GRB is not asking how to build a motor, but rather asking people what the best combo would be.
Some of the guys on here have had 15 cams or more plus just as many head sets, and so they have knowledge on this subject. Several members have Stage 3 heads..........and others have a 427.
Did you ever stop and think about what others have, or have had! Valuable information is being past on here and as such......if someone read this post in the future it may help them further. Remember that GRB is going to keep us all posted on the build and in doing so we may benefit from it.
Obviously it is of interest to people because of all the replys, and all of the follow-ups.
Also, remember he asked to be unique, and so, he got our opinion as to what unique is!
It is also obvious why he is building a ZL1 up........did you not read the entire post? It is a legend in it self and originally came with a 427. Who cares if its #ed, if you plan to keep the car forever it doesn't matter.....even if you don't, it makes it more "unique/special" then a "stripper"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BTW,
Your entire post seems a statement of jealousy, rather then an opinion. He has money and so what........do you think that if he didn't have money we wouldn't be interested? Get real man, if you think that someone has to have money for people to be interested it is because you don't have any.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Interesting reply you have. You are correct, some members on this board have had 15 cams and 10 heads. My question to you is how many of them were on race prepped C5R motors? How many of them made the power the desired? Im assuming you have a C5R race crate with C5R heads as well since you are so willingly making your educated contributions here.
As for jealousy, not in the least. I have the right to state my opinion as much as the next guy. Im sorry I didnt jump on the band wagon and praise him for building a motor....
As for the ZL1, I know its history quite well, I also believe its being offered with the C5R 427 straight from GMMG. That being the case, the car would be worth much more with original #s and matching block vin#s.
