rumor or fact ????????????come in and help?????????????
11-13-2002, 01:46 PM
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rumor or fact ????????????come in and help????????????? i have heard a lot about rod bolts being poor in the ls-1, but who has actually ever had a problem with them?
Would they be able to handle 6800 rpm and 420 rwhp?
Who has replaced them with out pulling the engine? PLease explain
Would they be able to handle 6800 rpm and 420 rwhp?
Who has replaced them with out pulling the engine? PLease explain
11-13-2002, 01:55 PM
#2
Re: rumor or fact ????????????come in and help????????????? You will probably want to change them, but it is a big job to try and do it in the car. I don't think you will have enough room to torque the new bolts properly. I would wait untill you have the engine pulled for other work, and then change the rod bolts while you have the engine on a stand.
11-13-2002, 02:13 PM
#3
Re: rumor or fact ????????????come in and help????????????? Can't wait until GoergeC chimes in on this one <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> He threw a rod through his block and nearly burned his car down to the ground at the strip. Don't think it's worth the risk not to change them IMO.
11-13-2002, 02:50 PM
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Re: rumor or fact ????????????come in and help????????????? </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Reckless:
<strong>Can't wait until GoergeC chimes in on this one <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> He threw a rod through his block and nearly burned his car down to the ground at the strip. Don't think it's worth the risk not to change them IMO.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Oh sheeeet !!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="gr_eek2.gif" />
Oh how I need to replace my rod bolts!!
That's a lot of work to pull the motor and replace just the rod bolts.
But then again, can't afford to spin a bearing or throw a rod through the block either <img border="0" title="" alt="[Sad]" src="gr_sad.gif" />
<strong>Can't wait until GoergeC chimes in on this one <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> He threw a rod through his block and nearly burned his car down to the ground at the strip. Don't think it's worth the risk not to change them IMO.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Oh sheeeet !!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="gr_eek2.gif" />
Oh how I need to replace my rod bolts!!
That's a lot of work to pull the motor and replace just the rod bolts.
But then again, can't afford to spin a bearing or throw a rod through the block either <img border="0" title="" alt="[Sad]" src="gr_sad.gif" />
11-13-2002, 02:56 PM
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Re: rumor or fact ????????????come in and help????????????? when I built up a STOCK bottom end for my car I used ARP Pro2000 rod bolts for the above mentioned reasons....
I spin up to 7000-7200 now <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="gr_images/icons/cool.gif" />
I spin up to 7000-7200 now <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="gr_images/icons/cool.gif" />
11-13-2002, 08:14 PM
#7
Re: rumor or fact ????????????come in and help????????????? George was running high 10s on his stock short block, and I think he was hitting 6800 on a regular basis. Threw a rod through the block, oil went everywhere onto the headers, started a serious fire, burned everything under the car, out of commission for several months, had to build new motor, etc.
ARP Rod Bolts = $150
Time to change the rod bolts = 6 hours
Revving your LS1 to 7000 without worries = priceless <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
Todd
PS - George is not the only one to suffer this horrible fate!
ARP Rod Bolts = $150
Time to change the rod bolts = 6 hours
Revving your LS1 to 7000 without worries = priceless <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
Todd
PS - George is not the only one to suffer this horrible fate!
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11-14-2002, 07:25 AM
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Re: rumor or fact ????????????come in and help????????????? Will better rod bolts help prevent a spun bearing??
I'm not sure if the torque on these bolts (let's say ARP Pro 2000 bolts) differ from the stock bolts?
Can they just be swapped one at a time without distorting the bearings or having any other side affects?
Thanks,
Mike
PS - It appears I can have ARP Rod Bolts installed in the car by one of ours sponsors for about $650 ($500 labor/$150 parts). I want to do a new shortblock in a year, but don't want a rod failure this summer.
I'm not sure if the torque on these bolts (let's say ARP Pro 2000 bolts) differ from the stock bolts?
Can they just be swapped one at a time without distorting the bearings or having any other side affects?
Thanks,
Mike
PS - It appears I can have ARP Rod Bolts installed in the car by one of ours sponsors for about $650 ($500 labor/$150 parts). I want to do a new shortblock in a year, but don't want a rod failure this summer.
11-14-2002, 07:32 AM
#9
Re: rumor or fact ????????????come in and help????????????? There's no doubt the bolts are a wise investment, and very necessary, I just questioned if ArgonZ was running his car hard enough to warrant that much labor. if it only takes 6 hours to change them all in an F body, then it's not as bad as I thought.
Ed
Ed
11-14-2002, 07:33 AM
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Re: rumor or fact ????????????come in and help????????????? Actually, I broke 2 connecting rods. Only one went through the block, though. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />
It wasn't a stock bottom end, since I had a .005 hone and Wiseco replacement pistons. In any case, I reaaaaallllllllllyyyyyyy wish I had spent the extra little bit of $$$ on rod bolts when I put that engine together. However, if I hadn't grenaded it, I probably wouldn't have this awesome ARE 382 in the car now, so I guess it all works out in the end. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
Seriously though, I would replace the rod bolts with ARP pieces if you have the ability to do so. It's good inexpensive insurance.
It wasn't a stock bottom end, since I had a .005 hone and Wiseco replacement pistons. In any case, I reaaaaallllllllllyyyyyyy wish I had spent the extra little bit of $$$ on rod bolts when I put that engine together. However, if I hadn't grenaded it, I probably wouldn't have this awesome ARE 382 in the car now, so I guess it all works out in the end. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
Seriously though, I would replace the rod bolts with ARP pieces if you have the ability to do so. It's good inexpensive insurance.
11-14-2002, 08:10 AM
#11
Re: rumor or fact ????????????come in and help????????????? The rod bolts and rod bearing are pretty much independent. When I sold my other short block, and installed a stock short block back into the car, I just went through and replaced the rod bolts, one rod at a time, with APR rod bolts. Just use the instructions included with the bolts. I think they suggest torquing them to 45 pounds 3 different times to apply the proper stretch to the new bolts.
Todd
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11-14-2002, 01:01 PM
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Re: rumor or fact ????????????come in and help????????????? </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by GeorgeC:
<strong>Actually, I broke 2 connecting rods. Only one went through the block, though. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />
It wasn't a stock bottom end, since I had a .005 hone and Wiseco replacement pistons. In any case, I reaaaaallllllllllyyyyyyy wish I had spent the extra little bit of $$$ on rod bolts when I put that engine together. However, if I hadn't grenaded it, I probably wouldn't have this awesome ARE 382 in the car now, so I guess it all works out in the end. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
Seriously though, I would replace the rod bolts with ARP pieces if you have the ability to do so. It's good inexpensive insurance.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Would it be worth it to spend ~$750 to have it done? I can understand when you are doing a shortblock or have the motor out of the car, but what about paying a shop to do it in the car (or pull the motor) just for the rod bolts only?
Is it overkill (the odds are with me) to not change them for a year or so. Or should I just take that hit as insurance that I have a weakpoint fixed.
Thanks,
Mike
<strong>Actually, I broke 2 connecting rods. Only one went through the block, though. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />
It wasn't a stock bottom end, since I had a .005 hone and Wiseco replacement pistons. In any case, I reaaaaallllllllllyyyyyyy wish I had spent the extra little bit of $$$ on rod bolts when I put that engine together. However, if I hadn't grenaded it, I probably wouldn't have this awesome ARE 382 in the car now, so I guess it all works out in the end. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
Seriously though, I would replace the rod bolts with ARP pieces if you have the ability to do so. It's good inexpensive insurance.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Would it be worth it to spend ~$750 to have it done? I can understand when you are doing a shortblock or have the motor out of the car, but what about paying a shop to do it in the car (or pull the motor) just for the rod bolts only?
Is it overkill (the odds are with me) to not change them for a year or so. Or should I just take that hit as insurance that I have a weakpoint fixed.
Thanks,
Mike
11-14-2002, 01:26 PM
#13
Re: rumor or fact ????????????come in and help????????????? Do you race Mike? If so, consider this:
You are making a pass and all of a sudden at the top of 3rd gear right before you shift, a rod bolt lets go and your rod makes a big hole in your block. Suddenly oil is all over the place (including your tires) and you are going 80mph or more. Is this what you want to risk? If so, then wait. Don't think any insurance company will cover that.
Todd
You are making a pass and all of a sudden at the top of 3rd gear right before you shift, a rod bolt lets go and your rod makes a big hole in your block. Suddenly oil is all over the place (including your tires) and you are going 80mph or more. Is this what you want to risk? If so, then wait. Don't think any insurance company will cover that.
Todd
11-14-2002, 02:04 PM
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Re: rumor or fact ????????????come in and help????????????? hmmm... I'm guessing to do this with the motor in the car you'd have to hold it up from the top and drop the K-Member?
Anyone have instructions on how to replace the rod bolts? Or rather, are the ARP bolts direct replacements or does some machining need to be done for any reason? What should they be torqued to?
Anyone have instructions on how to replace the rod bolts? Or rather, are the ARP bolts direct replacements or does some machining need to be done for any reason? What should they be torqued to?
11-14-2002, 02:29 PM
#15
Re: rumor or fact ????????????come in and help????????????? I've never done it, but the oil pan will come off with the engine in the car. May have to raise the engine a little (loosen mounts). No machining is needed for the bolts. Direct replacement.
Todd
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11-14-2002, 05:53 PM
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Re: rumor or fact ????????????come in and help????????????? </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Reckless:
<strong>Do you race Mike? If so, consider this:
You are making a pass and all of a sudden at the top of 3rd gear right before you shift, a rod bolt lets go and your rod makes a big hole in your block. Suddenly oil is all over the place (including your tires) and you are going 80mph or more. Is this what you want to risk? If so, then wait. Don't think any insurance company will cover that.
Todd</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Todd,
Thanks!
Point taken. (Your scenario would be even uglier on the street <img border="0" title="" alt="[Sad]" src="gr_sad.gif" /> ) Too many reasons not to do it! (My insurance would not cover the car at the track anyway)
I am just getting into racing. I am currently saving for my 12-bolt & driveshaft. Then I will be at the track much more often.
Mike
<small>[ November 14, 2002, 05:57 PM: Message edited by: Brownie ]</small>
<strong>Do you race Mike? If so, consider this:
You are making a pass and all of a sudden at the top of 3rd gear right before you shift, a rod bolt lets go and your rod makes a big hole in your block. Suddenly oil is all over the place (including your tires) and you are going 80mph or more. Is this what you want to risk? If so, then wait. Don't think any insurance company will cover that.
Todd</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Todd,
Thanks!
Point taken. (Your scenario would be even uglier on the street <img border="0" title="" alt="[Sad]" src="gr_sad.gif" /> ) Too many reasons not to do it! (My insurance would not cover the car at the track anyway)
I am just getting into racing. I am currently saving for my 12-bolt & driveshaft. Then I will be at the track much more often.
Mike
<small>[ November 14, 2002, 05:57 PM: Message edited by: Brownie ]</small>
11-14-2002, 05:55 PM
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Re: rumor or fact ????????????come in and help????????????? </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by horist:
<strong>hmmm... I'm guessing to do this with the motor in the car you'd have to hold it up from the top and drop the K-Member?
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">This is the way I was told by Speed Inc. They have not done it this way yet. Not a big fan of being the first.
But I need to get this done.
Mike
<strong>hmmm... I'm guessing to do this with the motor in the car you'd have to hold it up from the top and drop the K-Member?
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">This is the way I was told by Speed Inc. They have not done it this way yet. Not a big fan of being the first.
But I need to get this done.
Mike
11-15-2002, 12:06 AM
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Re: rumor or fact ????????????come in and help????????????? </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">originally posted by Reckless:
Revving your LS1 to 7000 without worries = priceless
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"><img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
You can say that again <img border="0" alt="[hail]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_hail.gif" />
Revving your LS1 to 7000 without worries = priceless
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"><img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
You can say that again <img border="0" alt="[hail]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_hail.gif" />