Abdullah

iTrader: (2)

trick flow heads will make a little better power than the AFR heads. i would go that way first trick flow heads then AFR then Dart.

little Red Camaro

iTrader: (14)

I order the trickflow head and cam package from Mike at TEA, can't say enough about them. He was super nice, and explained everything clearly and didn't try pushing something on me that I didn't want, like 5.3 heads, like some places do. And to top it off I feel I got a hell of deal for the set up.

firebirdman469

iTrader: (3)

Why hasn't anyone mentioned ETP? I guess maybe because it isn't an option in his poll?

tee-boy

iTrader: (8)

what sponsors carry the TF's?

smokeyrider05

iTrader: (9)

trick flow has a kit that perform beautifully. 515 hp at flywheel

07BlueDevilZ06

iTrader: (8)

my vote is

1 ETP --------great hp and quality
2 TFS/Trickflow-- make the most hp but need to buy expensive roller rockers only reason they are # 2
3 AFR good hp best customer support
4 Dart need work to compair in hp

ETP and AFR can be difficult to get they are built to order matters if they have castings ready.

Best availablity TFS/Trickflow huge companys involved Summit racing, Trickflow and TFS money is no object for Summit so they have the most units on the shelf ready for sale.

07BlueDevilZ06

iTrader: (8)

Anyone know what the highest hp out of a stock 346 is with a heads cam combo is? I thought it was tea/tfs combo like 515hp.

George

Viper

iTrader: (6)

I know miami993c297 hit 511rwhp with ETP heads:

https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...228&highlight=

davered00ss

iTrader: (4)

AFR's have a proven track record and are probably the most common head on here. The TFS need rockers/pushrods, and are relatively new with less people running them. Dart had issues when they were ported by TSP, so porting them might not be an option. I voted for AFR's.

Robert@SPEEDSOUTH

The only head we use is AFR, and if we need a set to be a bit different to match a particular combo we have Tony port it. Obviously we deal with a lot of companies in this industry and customer service is becoming only a memory for a few of them out there, but not AFR. Tony and Jerami are top notch and they (AFR & these guys) do what they say they’re going to do. It sounds simple, but you would be amazed how many people or products in this industry don’t. I’m sure there are plenty of shops on here that would agree with that last statement.

Tony Mamo @ AFR

iTrader: (13)

Thought I would hop on here quickly

(Robert we appreciate the nice post above!) And for that matter we appreciate all the others with positive commentary in this thread as well.

While a few of you are citing some high powered combinations I felt one of the strongest ones I have seen with AFR 205's was being overlooked (it was awhile back). This was a very optimized fairly aggressive stock displacement build that also laid down the smack to the tune of 510 RWHP thru an M6 Vette....

https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...917&highlight=

Lets not forget my own former build which still holds the 224 cammed record (as far as I know), knocking down 475 consistantly and a few 480 runs in there as well (best was 481/440). A more aggressive cam would have easily cleared the 500 mark and a very aggressive cam (240 ish) might have put my former combo in the five teens....

What's my point....IMO any of the "big three" are capable of putting down a solid number (and they all obviously have). Once you toss out the differences in flow benchs and get rid of the advertising fluff there really isnt much difference between them all (when comparing similar sized runners). They are all very capable performers, enough so that other aspects of your purchase should start to be scrutinized to better decide (customer service, ease of installation, CARB # or do you care, more otpimized port volume for your particular application, etc. etc.) As far as the power goes, it will be the supporting mods and the attention to detail to the rest of the combination that will have a far larger impact on your dyno's bottom line...

Tony M.

Ron@Vengeance

iTrader: (51)

Very well written post Tony!!! I agree 100%. TrickFlow/AFR both offer excellent cylinder heads. Its almost like Ford Vs Chevy.. Both offer excellent products and each have their +s and -s

We sell both AFR and TrickFlow. We have used most of the other companies out there and we stick with what works EVERY TIME.. We have made great power with both cylinder heads and both have been 100% reliable from our experience.

Price is roughly the same depending on how you option the heads. TrickFlow does suggest using roller rockers. This isnt mandatory. It is suggested due to the cylinder heads having bronze guides. Using roller rockers will reduce the wear on the guides thus reduce oil consumption down the road. In my opinion all ported/aftermarket cylinder heads with bronze guides should use roller rockers. We have ran several sets of TFS heads and AFR heads with no issue with stock rockers,but we also havent heard back as far as long term oil consumption is concerned.

I am thankful to have two companies like TrickFlow/AFR manufacturing products for our LSX vehicles. Theres nothing wrong with having a choice in the matter

On that note, I have TrickFlow 235cc Cylinder heads on my Z06 and I am building a 416 for my TBSS that will be running AFR 225s that Tony just shipped me last week.

As for Darts, I feel it is an insult to both AFR/TrickFlow to include them in this poll... Thats just my opinion though

Tony Mamo @ AFR

iTrader: (13)

Thanks Ron....

And just for clarification my analogy of the "big three" in my former post was aimed more at ourselves, TFS, and ETP.....not the Dart LS heads. There is nothing wrong with the Dart and they make a very nice as cast piece (which is not easy to do), BUT an as cast piece will never perform the same as a highly optimized properly designed CNC head. The repeatability alone rules that out assuming the port design is worthy. Then once you spend the money porting the Darts you might as well have considered a full CNC piece to begin with....

Just my .02

Tony

Gary Z

I like these polls - my vote counts the same as an expert's.

smokeyrider05

iTrader: (9)

in the trick flow kit it comes with everything harland sharp roller rocker's, new push rods. no guess work involved.

Pure One

AFR is definately the way to go. They have great people who work there, the best customer service, and an exellent product. AFR has always been the guys to beat when it come to LSx heads. Everytime someone thinks they have caught up AFR is yet another step or two ahead. Tony does an great job on these heads. Just an example of how great AFR customer service is take a look at any of his past post where he is helping people out whether it be his product or not. He even chimed in on your thread. I would consider that great service.

vader99

iTrader: (4)

So, should someone use roller rockers with the afr heads as well? Is there any long term evidence of excessive bronze valve guide wear because of using the stock rockers?

If a person checks your wipe pattern and pushrod length and shims stuff accordingly would that help to compensate for not using new roller rockers on these heads, especially the tfs?

What do stock ls1 heads use for valve guides?

transAm-98

iTrader: (1)

I went with the TFS on my build mainly cause I wanted to try something different and I had seen some really good #'s with 346's. But my other choice would have been AFR's for sure they have a proven track record and make great #'s on everything they seem to get bolted on to.

TEA Tech

Yes, any LS head with bronze guides should use roller rockers. We've had AFR heads and GM heads with bronze guides show considerable wear in 10K miles.

Stock rockers scrub the valve tip above .550" lift, the more you shim a stock rocker, the worse the scrub becomes. A stock rocker should work like a rocking chair to open the valve, which is not at all how a roller rocker works. A stock rocker will have a wide pattern, if you shim it up to reduce the width of the pattern, you will increase the scrub, and this scrub is the source of the friction that causes tip and guide wear.

A roller rocker works just the opposite, as you shim it up it reduces the sweep pattern, since it rolls there is no scrub.

If someone wants to run stock rockers on a TFS head the best thing they can do is put in springs with less pressure. The TFS heads come with the Max Pressure spring made for roller rockers that check at 160/450 lbs, a Gold spring checks at 140/360 lbs.

Stock heads have powdered metal guides, we have seen less than .0001" wear in 100K miles, as opposed to .002"-.003" wear in 10K miles on the bronze guides. Hope this helps.

marcus769

Vote for Darts. I've got pretty good numbers with my Dart head/cam car. Numbers in my sig. Stock bottom end..