Thunder Racing Camshaft "Reverse Split"
Here's some interesting reads concerning reverse split that PredatorZ pops up in.
https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...=reverse+split
https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...=reverse+split
https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...=reverse+split
https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...=reverse+split
Yeah actually.....me. I was going to go with a custom cam spec'd by Patrick G. Through researching on LS1Tech, I found a lot of people talking about the TR230. I found a new one in the FS section for a great price and I PM'd Pat G about it. He (arguably one of the MOST knowledgeable cam gurus) said it would be a great choice for my wants. Granted, it would not make quite as much peak power as the cam he spec'd me, but he said it was still an excellent choice.
On top of that, I've seen PredatorZ, the other noted cam guru, recommend reverse splits frequently. He's actually a big fan of them. So yes, I took the advice of knowledgeable members when going with my TR230. They are proven over and over again.
On top of that, I've seen PredatorZ, the other noted cam guru, recommend reverse splits frequently. He's actually a big fan of them. So yes, I took the advice of knowledgeable members when going with my TR230. They are proven over and over again.
Hate to bust your bubble but Patrick G is not one of the most knowledgeable cam gurus, even he will admit to you that he has a lot to learn. He can get you in the ballpark, but if I am getting a custom cam specced where I need every last HP, I'm going to someone who knows EXACTLY what they're doing.
And also, when some of these guys are recommending "reverse splits" are they only reverse splits at .050" and they change to traditional splits over .200" where it matters?
I wasn't going to post because I didn't think 1969mach1 really searched too hard
However, I feel I must defend my beloved TR230. Is it the most awesome cam around? Hell yes! Haha, of course you could do better with a custom cam guru but it works very nicely with stock heads if optimized correctly. Here's a quick link to an old thread of mine in the dyno section. Hint to 1969mach1, search the whole board not just one section.
https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...703&highlight=
My best mph so far is 127.75 with consistent 127+ traps. I'm currently working on hitting 130+ with this combo. I just switched out to Edelbrock stepped LTs and I'm porting my FAST as we speak. I'm also getting an HPtuners setup so I can update from the old 241 heads/LS6 intake program. If that doesn't do it I might get my LS6 heads ported by VIPERBLUELXs guy, he picked up 32rwhp from stock 243s to ported 243s on an X1 cam. Then I'm plan on spraying a 150rw shot to beat my buddies 587rwhp C6Z (if I must). So long story short it's not the end all, be all cam for LSx motors...but it can run like a ************ if done right.
Larry
However, I feel I must defend my beloved TR230. Is it the most awesome cam around? Hell yes! Haha, of course you could do better with a custom cam guru but it works very nicely with stock heads if optimized correctly. Here's a quick link to an old thread of mine in the dyno section. Hint to 1969mach1, search the whole board not just one section.https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...703&highlight=
My best mph so far is 127.75 with consistent 127+ traps. I'm currently working on hitting 130+ with this combo. I just switched out to Edelbrock stepped LTs and I'm porting my FAST as we speak. I'm also getting an HPtuners setup so I can update from the old 241 heads/LS6 intake program. If that doesn't do it I might get my LS6 heads ported by VIPERBLUELXs guy, he picked up 32rwhp from stock 243s to ported 243s on an X1 cam. Then I'm plan on spraying a 150rw shot to beat my buddies 587rwhp C6Z (if I must). So long story short it's not the end all, be all cam for LSx motors...but it can run like a ************ if done right.
Larry
Thread Starter
TECH Regular
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 458
Likes: 0
From: Bellaire, TX
ThankYou, SIR
I will try harder next time....
I will try harder next time....
I wasn't going to post because I didn't think 1969mach1 really searched too hard However, I feel I must defend my beloved TR230. Is it the most awesome cam around? Hell yes! Haha, of course you could do better with a custom cam guru but it works very nicely with stock heads if optimized correctly. Here's a quick link to an old thread of mine in the dyno section. Hint to 1969mach1, search the whole board not just one section.
https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...703&highlight=
My best mph so far is 127.75 with consistent 127+ traps. I'm currently working on hitting 130+ with this combo. I just switched out to Edelbrock stepped LTs and I'm porting my FAST as we speak. I'm also getting an HPtuners setup so I can update from the old 241 heads/LS6 intake program. If that doesn't do it I might get my LS6 heads ported by VIPERBLUELXs guy, he picked up 32rwhp from stock 243s to ported 243s on an X1 cam. Then I'm plan on spraying a 150rw shot to beat my buddies 587rwhp C6Z (if I must). So long story short it's not the end all, be all cam for LSx motors...but it can run like a ************ if done right.
Larry
However, I feel I must defend my beloved TR230. Is it the most awesome cam around? Hell yes! Haha, of course you could do better with a custom cam guru but it works very nicely with stock heads if optimized correctly. Here's a quick link to an old thread of mine in the dyno section. Hint to 1969mach1, search the whole board not just one section.https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...703&highlight=
My best mph so far is 127.75 with consistent 127+ traps. I'm currently working on hitting 130+ with this combo. I just switched out to Edelbrock stepped LTs and I'm porting my FAST as we speak. I'm also getting an HPtuners setup so I can update from the old 241 heads/LS6 intake program. If that doesn't do it I might get my LS6 heads ported by VIPERBLUELXs guy, he picked up 32rwhp from stock 243s to ported 243s on an X1 cam. Then I'm plan on spraying a 150rw shot to beat my buddies 587rwhp C6Z (if I must). So long story short it's not the end all, be all cam for LSx motors...but it can run like a ************ if done right.
Larry
On The Tree
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 111
Likes: 1
From: Nederland, TX
why do people pipe up just to be ********? its startin to sound like corral.net over here.. so many people miss the boat with this hobby..
the reason i pipe up here.. i remember reading a thread where a vendor was talking about this new combo they put together and he posted up some dyno graphs.. and patrick spit out valve timing events based on the power curve.. and the other guy later confirmed he was correct. yeah pat G is a moron
i dont even know the guy (patrick) never pm'd him or anything, but ive learned a lot from his shared comments, and i actually enjoy learning - cars are my primary hobby.
69 mach.. your (stang) is absolutely gorgeous
the reason i pipe up here.. i remember reading a thread where a vendor was talking about this new combo they put together and he posted up some dyno graphs.. and patrick spit out valve timing events based on the power curve.. and the other guy later confirmed he was correct. yeah pat G is a moron
i dont even know the guy (patrick) never pm'd him or anything, but ive learned a lot from his shared comments, and i actually enjoy learning - cars are my primary hobby.
69 mach.. your (stang) is absolutely gorgeous
Last edited by Coreyc619; Jun 30, 2008 at 11:13 PM.
Hate to bust your bubble but Patrick G is not one of the most knowledgeable cam gurus, even he will admit to you that he has a lot to learn. He can get you in the ballpark, but if I am getting a custom cam specced where I need every last HP, I'm going to someone who knows EXACTLY what they're doing.
And also, when some of these guys are recommending "reverse splits" are they only reverse splits at .050" and they change to traditional splits over .200" where it matters?
And also, when some of these guys are recommending "reverse splits" are they only reverse splits at .050" and they change to traditional splits over .200" where it matters?
You didn't burst my bubble....and I'll continue to trust Pat G's word when it comes to cams over just about anyone. He has built insane setups with cams he personally spec'd and many, many people have been absolutely thrilled with cams he spec'd for them. You do know he specs cams as a service to this site, right? All you have to do is click on the link in his sig. So yes, contrary to your belief, he is one of the most knowledgeable cam gurus on this site.
https://ls1tech.com/forums/generation-iii-internal-engine/772576-got-cam-heads-rocker-machining-questions-about-ls1-ls2-ls6-read-me-first.html
Check this out....notice at the bottom in his signature, it says camshaft specialist!!
Last edited by 99Hawk262; Jul 1, 2008 at 03:55 AM.
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Thread Starter
TECH Regular
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 458
Likes: 0
From: Bellaire, TX
I like what I'm seeing on these TR230 and MTI X1 cam's. I went up to MTI here in Houston yesterday to see what would say. I told the guy what I had and what I was looking to do and they too said X1 would be the BEST cam to run, with a strong torque curve and great power under the curve. He then stated to later get a set of there stage 2E heads, that this combo is landing people in the low-low 11's and a few in the 10's... with other mods as well.
I like what I'm seeing on these TR230 and MTI X1 cam's. I went up to MTI here in Houston yesterday to see what would say. I told the guy what I had and what I was looking to do and they too said X1 would be the BEST cam to run, with a strong torque curve and great power under the curve. He then stated to later get a set of there stage 2E heads, that this combo is landing people in the low-low 11's and a few in the 10's... with other mods as well.
that is a tried and true proven setup man!! look up WILWAXU, hes running the MTI 2E/X1 and is in the 10's in his auto. the thing i love bout the TR230 or MTI X1 is that they are older grinds that are proven, and people are still running them, even with all the new big cams out there right now. im happy with my X1 so far.
I like the way so many people look at just one aspect of a cam and decide if it works for their application of not. Reverse splits have their place, as do high lift cams, 108 degree lobe separations and solid rollers. Combination is the key.
A stock, street driven LS1 car with headers and exhaust responds very well to a reverse split cam. Once you start adding better flowing heads and a better flowing intake, you've changed the combination, and symetric or traditional splits help to exhaust the additional gases.
If you are building a drag car to run nitrous all the time, then by all means spec a cam to work with it. Reverse splits offer enough duration to get the job done, enough overlap to scavenge that exhaust, and maintain decent street manors for the drivability.
TR230/224 -111LSA = 5 degrees overlap
230/236 - 111LSA = 11 degrees overlap
Which one will be the better daily driver / weekend warrior? The one with 6 degrees less overlap.
Which one would work better on a track only car that doesn't have to idle on the street and runs a big shot?
Three words to remember: Combination, Compromise and Compression. All three are key to selecting the proper cam.
A stock, street driven LS1 car with headers and exhaust responds very well to a reverse split cam. Once you start adding better flowing heads and a better flowing intake, you've changed the combination, and symetric or traditional splits help to exhaust the additional gases.
If you are building a drag car to run nitrous all the time, then by all means spec a cam to work with it. Reverse splits offer enough duration to get the job done, enough overlap to scavenge that exhaust, and maintain decent street manors for the drivability.
TR230/224 -111LSA = 5 degrees overlap
230/236 - 111LSA = 11 degrees overlap
Which one will be the better daily driver / weekend warrior? The one with 6 degrees less overlap.
Which one would work better on a track only car that doesn't have to idle on the street and runs a big shot?
Three words to remember: Combination, Compromise and Compression. All three are key to selecting the proper cam.
Thread Starter
TECH Regular
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 458
Likes: 0
From: Bellaire, TX
I like the way so many people look at just one aspect of a cam and decide if it works for their application of not. Reverse splits have their place, as do high lift cams, 108 degree lobe separations and solid rollers. Combination is the key.
A stock, street driven LS1 car with headers and exhaust responds very well to a reverse split cam. Once you start adding better flowing heads and a better flowing intake, you've changed the combination, and symetric or traditional splits help to exhaust the additional gases.
If you are building a drag car to run nitrous all the time, then by all means spec a cam to work with it. Reverse splits offer enough duration to get the job done, enough overlap to scavenge that exhaust, and maintain decent street manors for the drivability.
TR230/224 -111LSA = 5 degrees overlap
230/236 - 111LSA = 11 degrees overlap
Which one will be the better daily driver / weekend warrior? The one with 6 degrees less overlap.
Which one would work better on a track only car that doesn't have to idle on the street and runs a big shot?
Three words to remember: Combination, Compromise and Compression. All three are key to selecting the proper cam.
A stock, street driven LS1 car with headers and exhaust responds very well to a reverse split cam. Once you start adding better flowing heads and a better flowing intake, you've changed the combination, and symetric or traditional splits help to exhaust the additional gases.
If you are building a drag car to run nitrous all the time, then by all means spec a cam to work with it. Reverse splits offer enough duration to get the job done, enough overlap to scavenge that exhaust, and maintain decent street manors for the drivability.
TR230/224 -111LSA = 5 degrees overlap
230/236 - 111LSA = 11 degrees overlap
Which one will be the better daily driver / weekend warrior? The one with 6 degrees less overlap.
Which one would work better on a track only car that doesn't have to idle on the street and runs a big shot?
Three words to remember: Combination, Compromise and Compression. All three are key to selecting the proper cam.
I completely agree, combination is KEY with any build. Like my first post states, "Has any body used this cam in a "cam only mod" (with the stock, untouched 241-LS1 heads)???? I'm looking to run this cam in my 01 Z28 A4 car. The mod I have to go along with the cam swap are. Kooks LT, Kooks ORY, 3600 VIG, with 3.42 gears.
The current mod on the car now are... SLP lid, Flowmaster cat-back, Hypertech tuner, and 150 wet shot."
The car is not my DD nor will is see much track time. The car gets driven 50-75 miles a month.
I could careless amout peak HP. I want a came that will have a strong torque curve and made great power under the curve. On the street, stop light to stop light "strong TORQUE curve" and "HP under the curve" will spank any car that makes 500-600HP @ 8500 RPM any day.
I completely agree, combination is KEY with any build. Like my first post states, "Has any body used this cam in a "cam only mod" (with the stock, untouched 241-LS1 heads)???? I'm looking to run this cam in my 01 Z28 A4 car. The mod I have to go along with the cam swap are. Kooks LT, Kooks ORY, 3600 VIG, with 3.42 gears.
The current mod on the car now are... SLP lid, Flowmaster cat-back, Hypertech tuner, and 150 wet shot."
The car is not my DD nor will is see much track time. The car gets driven 50-75 miles a month.
I could careless amout peak HP. I want a came that will have a strong torque curve and made great power under the curve. On the street, stop light to stop light "strong TORQUE curve" and "HP under the curve" will spank any car that makes 500-600HP @ 8500 RPM any day.
The current mod on the car now are... SLP lid, Flowmaster cat-back, Hypertech tuner, and 150 wet shot."
The car is not my DD nor will is see much track time. The car gets driven 50-75 miles a month.
I could careless amout peak HP. I want a came that will have a strong torque curve and made great power under the curve. On the street, stop light to stop light "strong TORQUE curve" and "HP under the curve" will spank any car that makes 500-600HP @ 8500 RPM any day.
Reverse split cams don't like spray. Think about it. They will cost you power even on a 100-150 shot.
And if reverse split cams work so well, why do 90%+ of cammed LS motors run traditional split? Have you ever seen someone ask for cam advice and someone KNOWLEGABLE recommend a reverse split? Nope, didn't think so.
Reading random advice here is not going to get you the perfect cam, hell, it might not even get you close! I'm not saying the cams are crap, I'm saying there are much better choices out there.
And if reverse split cams work so well, why do 90%+ of cammed LS motors run traditional split? Have you ever seen someone ask for cam advice and someone KNOWLEGABLE recommend a reverse split? Nope, didn't think so.
Reading random advice here is not going to get you the perfect cam, hell, it might not even get you close! I'm not saying the cams are crap, I'm saying there are much better choices out there.
His point is very valid. I always wondered why my 150 shot did not net me 150hp. Off the spray my car at the time put down 480/460 and 592/680 on spray. I gained 220tq and only 112 of the 150 when I used the MegaDeath. I wasnt really upset because the car ran amazingly well but just wanted the other 38hp.
The only issue I have is that my 2k came with the 26# injectors so I am at 110% duty cycle at 6000 rpms. So I ordered some green top SVO 42# injectors.
You will not be disappointed in the TR 230
