VSGLS1

iTrader: (8)

Whistler and myself pulled my valve covers and by looking at the retainers we knew the rockers were hitting. The rockers didn't clearance themselves, they chewed up the retainers. I have to get the pics hosted then I will put them up. The car is now much quiter, noticably. Hopefully this was part of my problem with the setup.

Hannibal

I pulled my valve cover tonight (only on the driver side) and the tops of my retainers were chewed up pretty good. My hope is that IF any damage to the motor was going to occur due to floating metal, that it would have happend at this point (heads have been on the car for about 4-5 weeks already). Gonna change the oil ASAP as a precaution. Took some pics and will be sending them to you in the AM Terry.

<----- Not very happy customer.

VSGLS1

iTrader: (8)

You need to machine the rockers, reinstall them then change the oil/filter. Put in some cheap crap and filter then let it run for 20-30 minutes to circulate. Drain and put in what you normally would. That is about the only way to flush the oil system of the shavings. I gotta do that after work tomorrow.

Hannibal

I am not sure if I really want to grind away at my stock rockers .........

jmX

Those rockers in the picture (mine) have lasted just fine with 2 years worth of use on several different cams, including XE lobed cams from COMP. While I have no info about how they may flex more, I do know that they haven't broken.

FWIW, there are other retainer setups out there that won't require the cutting of the rockers. Maybe installed height was an issue on the heads and they had to use the type of retainers they are using. When other vendors send out their larger spring heads, it seems they use the flat type retainer that clears fine (which is what my current GTP/Thunder Racing heads use).

mike m

iTrader: (6)

will the yella terra rockers fit better, or will they have to buy different springs or retainers. i myself would not want to be grinding down a stock rocker. they dont make aftermarket parts for no good reason. is this a common problem or is this just patriot?

gomer

iTrader: (13)

I installed the Yella Terras on my car and they fit perfectly, they are recessed in the area where the factory rockers were touching. The problem has nothing to do with the head, it is the diameter of the valve spring and retainer that is used with it. If you use a dual spring with a stock diameter, you won't have this problem. You can specify that you want stock diameter dual springs when you order your heads.

Hannibal

I am with you on that. Why grind an area and potentially create a weak point on my rocker?

I mean - you dont buy what is said to be a set of "Camaro SS" wheels (same dimensions) - and what should be a simple swap, then come to find out after the fact that you have to grind all your calipers down in order to get clearance. While most of us know that the chances of caliper failure are small - there is still that chance. I mean, what if you didnt want to make that modification to your car? What if you didnt want to take that chance? Sure you could go out and spend another X amount of dollars to buy an aftermarket caliper that would fit - but I am sure you never factored that money into your buying decision - especially when you didnt know of the issue to begin with.

I know that is probably an oversimplified way to look at this but it applies. I am not comfortable grinding away at my stock rockers for many reasons. And I am not interested in spending another $500 for a set of YT rockers that would give me clearance. All i am saying here is that I never knew about this issue upfront (until I saw this thread) and am quite "annoyed" that something else has come up that could be a problem that I HAVE to deal with at this point - and more then likely in a financial manner again.

J-Rod

I am always amazed at how folks put engines together without checking things like clearances. Let this be an object lesson that an egine has pretty tight tolerances that should always be checked. Never assume anything is "right". Check it...

Anyhow, if you are only talking about a few thousandths, take the rockers off the car, a dress them with a dremel tool. Hannibal, unless you are removing a significant ammount of material, I would not see this as a huge source of potential failure. The one thing I would suggest is to not make a notch, but rather a rounded area. A notch with a shrap angle will create a potential stress riser, and could be a source for potential cracking.

Hannibal

I understand the means to making my rockers clear - but A) I dont trust myself enough to take a dremmel to them as I have never done something of the like B) REALLY dont like the idea of modifying a vitial peice of my car in this manner.

When these heads were bought - it was DISCUSSED that it would only be a simple swap involved - take part A off and replace with part B. This was part of the selling point to it. I made it clear that I did not have the technical "know-how" to tweak things in the process and wasnt interested in doing such. When I bought these heads - none of these issues were mentioned. Now, it has been said that there is a "disclaimer/instruction" noted with each new set of heads being sent out. Thats all well and good - but I never received such instruction - not when I purchased my heads or after. And had I been told that there would (possibly) be a clearance issue - I would have either spec'd different springs or factored in another $500 for YT's which appear to solve the problem as I would not have been interested in modifying my rockers in any way. With that being said - I also dont know if I would have been interested in spending another $500 for new rockers cause that would affected my whole view on the "total package" price and may have swayed my decision.

All I know is - while they have done right by me up to this point - I keep saying to myself "what next."

v8maro

iTrader: (4)

Yes, I was sold this same 'package'. I was told it was a simple swap of part A with part B, that's why I was also attracted to this deal - no bullshit to deal with (guess I was WAY wrong). HAD I been forewarned about clearance issues with the rockers, I would have figured in the extra $500 for the YT's, but since I did not know, I used that money towards my tune.
If I have any grinding on my rockers or retainers, I'm gunna be pissed if I have to change this oil again, I spend $75 on an AMSOil change, not to mention i'm going to have to GRIND my rockers with tools I don't have. This is a LOT of BS that was not planned nor was it even a concept that was relayed to me. I thought these heads were tested and I was not the f'n alpha/beta tester of these, and I could rely on a part not failing. Aren't the retainers made of titanium? If the retainers are being chewed up and not the rockers, how could this be??

<----- another disgruntled customer...

-Steve >

Mustang Hat'r 2

iTrader: (24)

I checked mine again over the weekend and they were still hitting. So I took a dremal to them took about 2 mins per rocker not to bad the flushed the engine and everthing is fine now even quited down my valve train some
All you people that are complaining I got simple rule that I have alwas went by for cars
" More Power More Maintenance " If you buy an aftermarket part expect problems thats just the way it goes. If you think this is a PITA try putting in a BMR K-member didnt fit for **** had to redrill holes. Or even worse a Canton oil pan on a LT1 that was the biggest POS design I have ever seen hit everything. Mosar rearend. I can go on and on. Your buying after market parts not stock replacemant parts, **** happens.

v8maro

iTrader: (4)

Bullshit.

I can name some sponsors that can tell me what will fit what and what will work and what wont. On the other hand I can also mention some sponsors who can't even tell me if there will be clearance issues.
If I buy an after market part, they should know what will need to be done to a car to INSTALL them right!? Why the hell should we be the guinea pigs!??!?!
WTF man, I hope one day you get a shitty crank or something, throw some rods through your block, then i'll be sitting here saying, "dude, **** happens".

-Steve

Mustang Hat'r 2

iTrader: (24)

This is realy not that big of a deal. Its just a little extra work thats unexpected. Its not like we all got bad springs and blew are engines to ****. I should have checked the clearence thats my fault. I bet a lot of sponsors couldnt tell you **** about what will and will not fit your car there all a little different. What might fit my car might not fit your car or vice versa.

v8maro

iTrader: (4)

I will repeat, I was sold on this as a "100% swap for stock H/C upgrade package." I even asked, "hey, do I need to switch the rockers?" answer "no".
Now come to find out, they don't fit, time for someone to fix the problem, my cam package that is supposed to be 100% compatable with all parts, is now 95% compatable and costs me $500 more.

where is that bs flag??

-Steve

Tally TransAm

iTrader: (17)

it sucks that they dont clear, but i have to say when you add something to the motor as modified as cylinder heads you have to check clearances, its just the way it goes, granted people probably should have been told "hey you should check that the rockers dont hit after you install the heads," but spending an hour grinding a couple thousands of an inch off the rocker isnt going to keep me from getting these heads

mike m

iTrader: (6)

welp i gotta say it guys. thats why they have been named the walmart heads. 1st they were using cheap valves that fell apart and now the springs are too big. whats next??? now is there a price difference for a different set of springs? these heads better start showing more then the average 20hp gains for all this agrivation.

jmX

The springs being "too big" doesnt make these walmart heads, tons and tons of people specifically ORDER their heads to come with these "too big" springs, including me. You're getting a reliable spring, with the downside being that some material needing to be removed from the rocker.

I do agree that this should have been disclosed at the time of ordering, or you should be given the option of a stock diameter spring, and that is where they messed up.

Clearance the rockers (it'll seriously take less than an hour if you just go buy a dremmel or a grinder from home depot), send the heads back, buy some yella terras, whatever...its unfortunate but it isn't the end of the world. I had the exact same thing happen to me when I (and Visceral) got heads from ARE...bolted them on....fired the car up, LOUD noises...turns out they don't clear. Never a peep from ARE about this.

My next set of heads had the exact same springs, but a new retainer that thunder racing uses, and my *stock* unmodified rockers clear just fine. Some retainers will clear, some won't.

SScam68

iTrader: (20)

You put ANY aftermarket part you better make sure everything else is OK.

Just the way it works guys, deal with it.

As for the broken valves, if I remember correctly, Patriot doesn't manufacture their own valves yet they still compensated their customers for a manufacturing flaw that wasn't theirs. That says a lot!

mike m

iTrader: (6)

well ok ill say this then patriot has just as good customer service as walmart.