LS3 CT525 Break in - Robin and anyone else?
05-25-2010, 12:54 AM
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LS3 CT525 Break in - Robin and anyone else? We're about to start racing the new GM LS3 based crate CT525 engine in an endurance marine application with sustained periods of WOT. The installation manual says to use Mobil 1 5/30 and makes no reference to using any other oil for break in like a conventional oil with high ZDDP for better ring seal and break in of the other metal parts. I'm concerned that that the manual is written fairly generically and isn't tailored specifically for the ct525 engine in a racing application. Shouldn't I use a proper break in oil and won't a standard Mobil 1 5w30 be a little light to protect an engine in a marine racing application. I was thinking about using Joe Gibbs or Brad Pen Break in oil and then maybe Mobil 1's 5/50 (only available in Canada) but I won't bother if the engine doesn't need it? What are the factory bearing clearances on these engines? We'll be running the engine temp around 160F and our oil temp around 220F. Thanks in advance.
05-25-2010, 11:40 AM
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Good questions. I have NEVER used synthetic oils for break in. I think that as a certified application the OEM must use the same oil that they are certified with the EPA and mileage numbers.
In the GM Performance Parts Catalogue from 2008 there is a page about engine break in procedure. It's page 402 if you can dig up the 2008 Catalogue. I agree with most all of the points made regarding engine break in procedures.
It’s interesting that they specifically say NOT to use synthetic oils for break in. Yet most of the crate engines come with their recommended oil already in the pan. Drain that out.
I have had issues with the Joe Gibbs break in oil so I do not so I do not use that. I do still use their synthetics oil though. I would use the Brad Penn break in oil.
I don’t think that the thin oil will be an issue. Remember these things have tight clearances like OEM engines. The LS3 also takes a bit longer to break in than many other crate engines that I have seen. If it were mine I would not switch to a 20-50 until the engine has been run for awhile.
The top ring end gap on the engine that I checked was .012. These things are tight.
Robin
In the GM Performance Parts Catalogue from 2008 there is a page about engine break in procedure. It's page 402 if you can dig up the 2008 Catalogue. I agree with most all of the points made regarding engine break in procedures.
It’s interesting that they specifically say NOT to use synthetic oils for break in. Yet most of the crate engines come with their recommended oil already in the pan. Drain that out.
I have had issues with the Joe Gibbs break in oil so I do not so I do not use that. I do still use their synthetics oil though. I would use the Brad Penn break in oil.
I don’t think that the thin oil will be an issue. Remember these things have tight clearances like OEM engines. The LS3 also takes a bit longer to break in than many other crate engines that I have seen. If it were mine I would not switch to a 20-50 until the engine has been run for awhile.
The top ring end gap on the engine that I checked was .012. These things are tight.
Robin
05-25-2010, 11:52 PM
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Good questions. I have NEVER used synthetic oils for break in. I think that as a certified application the OEM must use the same oil that they are certified with the EPA and mileage numbers.
In the GM Performance Parts Catalogue from 2008 there is a page about engine break in procedure. It's page 402 if you can dig up the 2008 Catalogue. I agree with most all of the points made regarding engine break in procedures.
It’s interesting that they specifically say NOT to use synthetic oils for break in. Yet most of the crate engines come with their recommended oil already in the pan. Drain that out.
I have had issues with the Joe Gibbs break in oil so I do not so I do not use that. I do still use their synthetics oil though. I would use the Brad Penn break in oil.
I don’t think that the thin oil will be an issue. Remember these things have tight clearances like OEM engines. The LS3 also takes a bit longer to break in than many other crate engines that I have seen. If it were mine I would not switch to a 20-50 until the engine has been run for awhile.
The top ring end gap on the engine that I checked was .012. These things are tight.
Robin
In the GM Performance Parts Catalogue from 2008 there is a page about engine break in procedure. It's page 402 if you can dig up the 2008 Catalogue. I agree with most all of the points made regarding engine break in procedures.
It’s interesting that they specifically say NOT to use synthetic oils for break in. Yet most of the crate engines come with their recommended oil already in the pan. Drain that out.
I have had issues with the Joe Gibbs break in oil so I do not so I do not use that. I do still use their synthetics oil though. I would use the Brad Penn break in oil.
I don’t think that the thin oil will be an issue. Remember these things have tight clearances like OEM engines. The LS3 also takes a bit longer to break in than many other crate engines that I have seen. If it were mine I would not switch to a 20-50 until the engine has been run for awhile.
The top ring end gap on the engine that I checked was .012. These things are tight.
Robin
Here is the Installation manual for the CT525. http://www.gmperformanceparts.com/_r...ack/CT_525.pdf
As stated above, I have concerns that the oil recommendation page is generically placed in the manual from another non-competition manual because of it's reference to the engine having a dipstick, which it doesn't have.
I spoke to a guy at CJ Rayburn that is building race cars with the Ct525 and they recommend using Mobil 1 5w30 for both break in and racing.
http://www.cjrayburn.com/new_product.html
Robin, is there an LS engineer you could ask to clarify this for me......please?
05-26-2010, 02:36 AM
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If the tune is right drive it like you stole it out of the box and the rings will seat quickly and nicely. Just change the oil a couple times in the first 1K.
I will be doing a LS2 stroker soon and it will be broken in on the dyno prolly.... This is totally against the way I learned in my old SBC days but things have changed and IMO this is perfectly alright if not the best way to break in a new motor..... My last SBC in 94 was a stock truck 350 and it was broken in with Rotella at WOT after the oil was hot. It used no oil whatsoever the whole time I owned it. Sold it in 99 to a buddy and still going strong at 250K+.....
I will be doing a LS2 stroker soon and it will be broken in on the dyno prolly.... This is totally against the way I learned in my old SBC days but things have changed and IMO this is perfectly alright if not the best way to break in a new motor..... My last SBC in 94 was a stock truck 350 and it was broken in with Rotella at WOT after the oil was hot. It used no oil whatsoever the whole time I owned it. Sold it in 99 to a buddy and still going strong at 250K+.....
06-01-2010, 10:04 PM
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OK I take back my comment about a problem with Joe Gibbs break in oils. As I stated in my original post I use the Joe Gibbs oil in my 7 second LSX Nitrous race car.
I had an issue a couple of years ago with the break in oil and could not get an answer. Well I guess I was asking the wrong people. After my post the guys at Scoggin Dicky were concerned about my experience.
On Friday I received a call from Lake Speed Jr. of Joe Gibbs Racing Oils. Lake was very interested in my problem and we discussed the situation. It seems that the break in oil or I should say some of the properties in the break in oil had a reaction with the VP NO2 fuel that we were using on the dyno.
While the oil was good to go on the break in our mistake was leaving the oil in the engine after installing it in the car. I should have drained the oil when I was done on the dyno.
Now if you are using a VP race fuel you should not run the oil for an extended period. If you are using the oil in a street application you are good to go. There was no damage, I just didn't like the look of the oil after I drained it from the engine.
As I said before I love the Joe Gibbs products. Now I am pleased to say I will use their break in oil whenever I freshen my LSX engines. I was very impressed that Mr. Speed took the time to help me out.
Great customer service.
Robin
I had an issue a couple of years ago with the break in oil and could not get an answer. Well I guess I was asking the wrong people. After my post the guys at Scoggin Dicky were concerned about my experience.
On Friday I received a call from Lake Speed Jr. of Joe Gibbs Racing Oils. Lake was very interested in my problem and we discussed the situation. It seems that the break in oil or I should say some of the properties in the break in oil had a reaction with the VP NO2 fuel that we were using on the dyno.
While the oil was good to go on the break in our mistake was leaving the oil in the engine after installing it in the car. I should have drained the oil when I was done on the dyno.
Now if you are using a VP race fuel you should not run the oil for an extended period. If you are using the oil in a street application you are good to go. There was no damage, I just didn't like the look of the oil after I drained it from the engine.
As I said before I love the Joe Gibbs products. Now I am pleased to say I will use their break in oil whenever I freshen my LSX engines. I was very impressed that Mr. Speed took the time to help me out.
Great customer service.
Robin
Last edited by Robin L; 06-02-2010 at 06:17 AM.
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06-01-2010, 11:33 PM
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Where do you get that break in oil from. I have just used Castrol 10w 40 and have not had any issues with 2 different ls motors nitrous at that.
Basically start it up let it run for 20 mins cool off drain it and put fresh oil in. Then take it out the next day rip it some change the oil and then let it go.
Basically start it up let it run for 20 mins cool off drain it and put fresh oil in. Then take it out the next day rip it some change the oil and then let it go.
