what weight oil do you run?
06-10-2010, 09:50 PM
#21
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I have an interesting story regarding oil viscosity.
I have a LS1 powered Dragster.... it's a basic and easy to maintain set-up.
Here are the specs:
The car weighs about 1650 lbs.
LS1, stock bottom end, TSP TV2 cam, .030 off the heads, stock intake and TTB.
4L60E with 5200 convertor.
Here is the story.
I was running Castrol GTX3 15W-40 mineral oil and it consistently ran 9.2 @ 145mph.
I changed the oil to Mobil 1 5W-30 full synthetic and the car consistenly ran 9.5 @ 140. Yes, it added .3 to the ET and lost 5 MPH....
I scratched my head for a long time over this, then I went back to the much cheaper Castrol 15W-40 and got right back to 9.2 @ 145.
I use the HPTuners MPVI interface to log all data from each run. The one thing I noticed, was slightly lower oil pressure with the Mobil 1. I believed that it was perhaps not quite pumping the lifters up enough. It wouldn't take much of a drop in lift to kill the 30 odd HP that I was seeing.
I spoke to the "Mobil man" and he was very surprised and has given me some Mobil 1 15W-50 to try. Our drag season is over for now and I'm changing motors too, so I'll never find out if the better oil makes any difference.
Just thought I'd put it out there, take from it what you will...
I have a LS1 powered Dragster.... it's a basic and easy to maintain set-up.
Here are the specs:
The car weighs about 1650 lbs.
LS1, stock bottom end, TSP TV2 cam, .030 off the heads, stock intake and TTB.
4L60E with 5200 convertor.
Here is the story.
I was running Castrol GTX3 15W-40 mineral oil and it consistently ran 9.2 @ 145mph.
I changed the oil to Mobil 1 5W-30 full synthetic and the car consistenly ran 9.5 @ 140. Yes, it added .3 to the ET and lost 5 MPH....
I scratched my head for a long time over this, then I went back to the much cheaper Castrol 15W-40 and got right back to 9.2 @ 145.
I use the HPTuners MPVI interface to log all data from each run. The one thing I noticed, was slightly lower oil pressure with the Mobil 1. I believed that it was perhaps not quite pumping the lifters up enough. It wouldn't take much of a drop in lift to kill the 30 odd HP that I was seeing.
I spoke to the "Mobil man" and he was very surprised and has given me some Mobil 1 15W-50 to try. Our drag season is over for now and I'm changing motors too, so I'll never find out if the better oil makes any difference.
Just thought I'd put it out there, take from it what you will...
06-10-2010, 11:26 PM
#22
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I have an interesting story regarding oil viscosity.
I have a LS1 powered Dragster.... it's a basic and easy to maintain set-up.
Here are the specs:
The car weighs about 1650 lbs.
LS1, stock bottom end, TSP TV2 cam, .030 off the heads, stock intake and TTB.
4L60E with 5200 convertor.
Here is the story.
I was running Castrol GTX3 15W-40 mineral oil and it consistently ran 9.2 @ 145mph.
I changed the oil to Mobil 1 5W-30 full synthetic and the car consistenly ran 9.5 @ 140. Yes, it added .3 to the ET and lost 5 MPH....
I scratched my head for a long time over this, then I went back to the much cheaper Castrol 15W-40 and got right back to 9.2 @ 145.
I use the HPTuners MPVI interface to log all data from each run. The one thing I noticed, was slightly lower oil pressure with the Mobil 1. I believed that it was perhaps not quite pumping the lifters up enough. It wouldn't take much of a drop in lift to kill the 30 odd HP that I was seeing.
I spoke to the "Mobil man" and he was very surprised and has given me some Mobil 1 15W-50 to try. Our drag season is over for now and I'm changing motors too, so I'll never find out if the better oil makes any difference.
Just thought I'd put it out there, take from it what you will...
I have a LS1 powered Dragster.... it's a basic and easy to maintain set-up.
Here are the specs:
The car weighs about 1650 lbs.
LS1, stock bottom end, TSP TV2 cam, .030 off the heads, stock intake and TTB.
4L60E with 5200 convertor.
Here is the story.
I was running Castrol GTX3 15W-40 mineral oil and it consistently ran 9.2 @ 145mph.
I changed the oil to Mobil 1 5W-30 full synthetic and the car consistenly ran 9.5 @ 140. Yes, it added .3 to the ET and lost 5 MPH....
I scratched my head for a long time over this, then I went back to the much cheaper Castrol 15W-40 and got right back to 9.2 @ 145.
I use the HPTuners MPVI interface to log all data from each run. The one thing I noticed, was slightly lower oil pressure with the Mobil 1. I believed that it was perhaps not quite pumping the lifters up enough. It wouldn't take much of a drop in lift to kill the 30 odd HP that I was seeing.
I spoke to the "Mobil man" and he was very surprised and has given me some Mobil 1 15W-50 to try. Our drag season is over for now and I'm changing motors too, so I'll never find out if the better oil makes any difference.
Just thought I'd put it out there, take from it what you will...
06-11-2010, 10:18 AM
#23
Interesting, but i highly doubt the 5w-30 mobil 1 being the culprit. M1 5w-30 is not a thick 30wt and being said it's a synthetic, it's natural lubricity is quite high compared to most conventionals. It will be interesting to see what you find next time out with the heavier oil. A lighter viscosity, if formulated correctly will usually always yield more hp. But remember, there are heavier and lighter 5w-30's for example.
Not all "synthetics" are created equal. You can't compare for example Mobil 1 to Motul or Redline, as the base oil formulation is entirely different. One is a modified hydrocarbon while the others are synthetic esters. Esters are some of the most capable lubricants on the planet when combined with a balanced additive package. There is a reason the stuff is $10-15 per quart. The high dollar synthetics deliver. These ester base oils are used by 99% of all major race teams. You won't find conventional in any of these motors. We all know they aren't using it to keep the engines clean. They want them to stay together.
Not all "synthetics" are created equal. You can't compare for example Mobil 1 to Motul or Redline, as the base oil formulation is entirely different. One is a modified hydrocarbon while the others are synthetic esters. Esters are some of the most capable lubricants on the planet when combined with a balanced additive package. There is a reason the stuff is $10-15 per quart. The high dollar synthetics deliver. These ester base oils are used by 99% of all major race teams. You won't find conventional in any of these motors. We all know they aren't using it to keep the engines clean. They want them to stay together.
06-13-2010, 10:54 AM
#24
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True. But look at the engines listed in the sigs of the people responding to this thread. They're stroker motors which typically have looser clearances compared to stock LS engines. Most LS engine builders will recommend a heavier weight oil for stroker motors for this very reason.
The new GT500's require 5w-50 which actually works good for the LS stroker motors because of the lower cold pour rating.
The new GT500's require 5w-50 which actually works good for the LS stroker motors because of the lower cold pour rating.
06-21-2010, 10:53 AM
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snip < Not all "synthetics" are created equal. You can't compare for example Mobil 1 to Motul or Redline, as the base oil formulation is entirely different. One is a modified hydrocarbon while the others are synthetic esters. Esters are some of the most capable lubricants on the planet when combined with a balanced additive package. There is a reason the stuff is $10-15 per quart. The high dollar synthetics deliver. These ester base oils are used by 99% of all major race teams. You won't find conventional in any of these motors. We all know they aren't using it to keep the engines clean. They want them to stay together.
Pete
06-21-2010, 12:48 PM
#28
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A 50wt in a stock clearanced LS motor is too heavy period. It is not needed and is too viscous. Old school guys that know little about current lubrication run 50wts cause they think a higher viscosity is better. It is not. You get no lower wear than with a 30wt and some studies show a very high wt oil used in an engine spec'd for a lighter one can INCREASE wear.
I care about race teams because of your false statements regarding SYNTHETICS. Im tired of people here that dont even know what the "w" in oil means yet they like to share misinformation with the guys trying to learn. Synthetics have their place and will not wear our an engine when proper OCI and viscosity are followed. And your self test proves nothing. Any trended UOA's with particle counts. Detailed tear downs of several engines? Well then your study holds no water. It's not data.
You are right when you say an LS is nothing special. You need to realize with any engine a given or recommended viscosity should be followed. An LS motor is specd for a 30wt oil. As long as the oil used is a good 30wt then there should be zero issues. If the user wants to use a 40wt that is often allowed. When you start moving to twice the viscosity effeciency suffers and there is no gained benefit(ie wear). Your oil pump was not designed for a 50wt oil, neither were your small bearing clearances. Leave a 50wt for an all out race motor where clearances are large.
What oils are these friends of yours using? Brand and viscosity?
I care about race teams because of your false statements regarding SYNTHETICS. Im tired of people here that dont even know what the "w" in oil means yet they like to share misinformation with the guys trying to learn. Synthetics have their place and will not wear our an engine when proper OCI and viscosity are followed. And your self test proves nothing. Any trended UOA's with particle counts. Detailed tear downs of several engines? Well then your study holds no water. It's not data.
You are right when you say an LS is nothing special. You need to realize with any engine a given or recommended viscosity should be followed. An LS motor is specd for a 30wt oil. As long as the oil used is a good 30wt then there should be zero issues. If the user wants to use a 40wt that is often allowed. When you start moving to twice the viscosity effeciency suffers and there is no gained benefit(ie wear). Your oil pump was not designed for a 50wt oil, neither were your small bearing clearances. Leave a 50wt for an all out race motor where clearances are large.
What oils are these friends of yours using? Brand and viscosity?
06-21-2010, 03:19 PM
#32
I have an interesting story regarding oil viscosity.
I have a LS1 powered Dragster.... it's a basic and easy to maintain set-up.
Here are the specs:
The car weighs about 1650 lbs.
LS1, stock bottom end, TSP TV2 cam, .030 off the heads, stock intake and TTB.
4L60E with 5200 convertor.
Here is the story.
I was running Castrol GTX3 15W-40 mineral oil and it consistently ran 9.2 @ 145mph.
I changed the oil to Mobil 1 5W-30 full synthetic and the car consistenly ran 9.5 @ 140. Yes, it added .3 to the ET and lost 5 MPH....
I scratched my head for a long time over this, then I went back to the much cheaper Castrol 15W-40 and got right back to 9.2 @ 145.
I use the HPTuners MPVI interface to log all data from each run. The one thing I noticed, was slightly lower oil pressure with the Mobil 1. I believed that it was perhaps not quite pumping the lifters up enough. It wouldn't take much of a drop in lift to kill the 30 odd HP that I was seeing.
I spoke to the "Mobil man" and he was very surprised and has given me some Mobil 1 15W-50 to try. Our drag season is over for now and I'm changing motors too, so I'll never find out if the better oil makes any difference.
Just thought I'd put it out there, take from it what you will...
I have a LS1 powered Dragster.... it's a basic and easy to maintain set-up.
Here are the specs:
The car weighs about 1650 lbs.
LS1, stock bottom end, TSP TV2 cam, .030 off the heads, stock intake and TTB.
4L60E with 5200 convertor.
Here is the story.
I was running Castrol GTX3 15W-40 mineral oil and it consistently ran 9.2 @ 145mph.
I changed the oil to Mobil 1 5W-30 full synthetic and the car consistenly ran 9.5 @ 140. Yes, it added .3 to the ET and lost 5 MPH....
I scratched my head for a long time over this, then I went back to the much cheaper Castrol 15W-40 and got right back to 9.2 @ 145.
I use the HPTuners MPVI interface to log all data from each run. The one thing I noticed, was slightly lower oil pressure with the Mobil 1. I believed that it was perhaps not quite pumping the lifters up enough. It wouldn't take much of a drop in lift to kill the 30 odd HP that I was seeing.
I spoke to the "Mobil man" and he was very surprised and has given me some Mobil 1 15W-50 to try. Our drag season is over for now and I'm changing motors too, so I'll never find out if the better oil makes any difference.
Just thought I'd put it out there, take from it what you will...
Its really nothing to scratch your head over....people put WAY TOO much thought into oil...FOR BASICALLY STOCK or moderately modded LSx engines (450-600 RWHP). It just doesn't matter what oil you use, they all work just fine....AS LONG AS ITS KEPT CLEAN.
AND AGAIN...unless you are having a serious high revving, solid roller, specific type of race engine........it doesn't matter what oil you use.
Its hilarious how many people I hear at shows and events talking about their super-duper special synthetics......and they are rebuilding and having internal problems with 10,000-20,000-30,000 miles. I laugh and tell them I use the cheapest crap Castrol GTX 20w50 available in my 8 year old 427ci stroker and I'm sailing past 140,000 miles. Of course they don't believe it....they're loss.
20w50 is all I will ever put in my LSx engines. Including my new 441ci coming soon. Makes no sense to use lighter oil.
.
06-21-2010, 07:33 PM
#35
Its really nothing to scratch your head over....people put WAY TOO much thought into oil...FOR BASICALLY STOCK or moderately modded LSx engines (450-600 RWHP). It just doesn't matter what oil you use, they all work just fine....AS LONG AS ITS KEPT CLEAN.
AND AGAIN...unless you are having a serious high revving, solid roller, specific type of race engine........it doesn't matter what oil you use.
Its hilarious how many people I hear at shows and events talking about their super-duper special synthetics......and they are rebuilding and having internal problems with 10,000-20,000-30,000 miles. I laugh and tell them I use the cheapest crap Castrol GTX 20w50 available in my 8 year old 427ci stroker and I'm sailing past 140,000 miles. Of course they don't believe it....they're loss.
20w50 is all I will ever put in my LSx engines. Including my new 441ci coming soon. Makes no sense to use lighter oil.
.
AND AGAIN...unless you are having a serious high revving, solid roller, specific type of race engine........it doesn't matter what oil you use.
Its hilarious how many people I hear at shows and events talking about their super-duper special synthetics......and they are rebuilding and having internal problems with 10,000-20,000-30,000 miles. I laugh and tell them I use the cheapest crap Castrol GTX 20w50 available in my 8 year old 427ci stroker and I'm sailing past 140,000 miles. Of course they don't believe it....they're loss.
20w50 is all I will ever put in my LSx engines. Including my new 441ci coming soon. Makes no sense to use lighter oil.
.
Again, what special synthetics are you speaking of??? So funny you make these claims but cant back them up with any evidence. You better tell all the low budget race teams who run Mobil 1 Ow-40 and go a whole season or more on high power motors that the oil they are using is junk..lol. Why dont you tell your same story over and over...... You dont even know anything about oil yet you make these outlandish claims. A 20w-50 is not needed in a stock clearanced motor. News flash, its not 1955 anymore. Technology has progressed believe it or not. Top synthetics are used for a reason, THEY LUBRICATE BETTER UNDER EXTREME PRESSURE AND HEAT. Do your homework before you spead mistruths to people who dont even know what different base oil groups there are or what the "w" stands for in oil viscosity ratings.
06-21-2010, 07:59 PM
#36
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Its really nothing to scratch your head over....people put WAY TOO much thought into oil...FOR BASICALLY STOCK or moderately modded LSx engines (450-600 RWHP). It just doesn't matter what oil you use, they all work just fine....AS LONG AS ITS KEPT CLEAN.
AND AGAIN...unless you are having a serious high revving, solid roller, specific type of race engine........it doesn't matter what oil you use.
Its hilarious how many people I hear at shows and events talking about their super-duper special synthetics......and they are rebuilding and having internal problems with 10,000-20,000-30,000 miles. I laugh and tell them I use the cheapest crap Castrol GTX 20w50 available in my 8 year old 427ci stroker and I'm sailing past 140,000 miles. Of course they don't believe it....they're loss.
20w50 is all I will ever put in my LSx engines. Including my new 441ci coming soon. Makes no sense to use lighter oil.
.
AND AGAIN...unless you are having a serious high revving, solid roller, specific type of race engine........it doesn't matter what oil you use.
Its hilarious how many people I hear at shows and events talking about their super-duper special synthetics......and they are rebuilding and having internal problems with 10,000-20,000-30,000 miles. I laugh and tell them I use the cheapest crap Castrol GTX 20w50 available in my 8 year old 427ci stroker and I'm sailing past 140,000 miles. Of course they don't believe it....they're loss.
20w50 is all I will ever put in my LSx engines. Including my new 441ci coming soon. Makes no sense to use lighter oil.
.
You don't really think what you said is true do you?
Your argument is that you have a 427 that has ran fine for eight years on conventional oil, therefore the advantages of using sythetic oil are pure fantasy? Come now. I guess you've been using fram filters all that time, so we should all use those too. After all, why use superior substances to lubricate your engine when none of us have a "serious high revving, solid roller, specific type of race engine"?
The funny part is the morons like yourself who try to explain your ignorance and refusal to conform to new technology by saying "I've been having the same castrol 10w40 for four years and my motor aint coughed once!"
There's nothing wrong with using conventional oil but please don't try to explain how it provides anywhere near the wear protection or lubrication of a quality synthetic paired with a quality filter.
06-21-2010, 08:56 PM
#37
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Yes, thanks, C6Z. I lost count of seat time, but use A6's and R6's. I use a remote SS filter and taps to/from the block to twin oil coolers. It runs 220* oil and 180* water at 93* ambient sustained runs, with this power level. Since rebuilds are so very expensive I am all ears on this important matter. I'm not quite clear on the types of oil bases. I actually thought M1 was OK for me.
06-21-2010, 09:45 PM
#38
TECH Enthusiast
Its really nothing to scratch your head over....people put WAY TOO much thought into oil...FOR BASICALLY STOCK or moderately modded LSx engines (450-600 RWHP). It just doesn't matter what oil you use, they all work just fine....AS LONG AS ITS KEPT CLEAN.
AND AGAIN...unless you are having a serious high revving, solid roller, specific type of race engine........it doesn't matter what oil you use.
Its hilarious how many people I hear at shows and events talking about their super-duper special synthetics......and they are rebuilding and having internal problems with 10,000-20,000-30,000 miles. I laugh and tell them I use the cheapest crap Castrol GTX 20w50 available in my 8 year old 427ci stroker and I'm sailing past 140,000 miles. Of course they don't believe it....they're loss.
20w50 is all I will ever put in my LSx engines. Including my new 441ci coming soon. Makes no sense to use lighter oil.
.
AND AGAIN...unless you are having a serious high revving, solid roller, specific type of race engine........it doesn't matter what oil you use.
Its hilarious how many people I hear at shows and events talking about their super-duper special synthetics......and they are rebuilding and having internal problems with 10,000-20,000-30,000 miles. I laugh and tell them I use the cheapest crap Castrol GTX 20w50 available in my 8 year old 427ci stroker and I'm sailing past 140,000 miles. Of course they don't believe it....they're loss.
20w50 is all I will ever put in my LSx engines. Including my new 441ci coming soon. Makes no sense to use lighter oil.
.
Those super duper synthetics where created for reasons...
Shear stability is one area that a synthetic oil simply "pants" your super duper gtx oil.
Among a thousand others.
As for your "data" set of your buddies doing rebuilds etc etc etc.. ummm let me ask you? did the same person build each of those motors? No? ohh... How about do they all drive the same way? No? ohhhh.... Do all those motors run N/a? or N2o, Or boost? Not all the same? ohhh...
And No i dont think a 50w oil is too much... Is it ideal? Nope.
