VVT vs VVT delete
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Launching!
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From: Disneyland or St Louis
VVT vs VVT delete Has anyone done something as simple as this?
Put a VVT cam in and run it down the track 3 times. Post the times and trap speeds.
Delete VVT and use the same cam or cam specs, run it down the track 3 times. Post the times and trap speeds.
I have searched and searched for something like this. Dyno numbers without times and speeds are not needed
I'm about to delete the AFM/DOD parts but would like to keep the VVT if it gives me an edge. I know I can get better times with out the VVT and a bigger cam but I'm installing a Procharger with ported heads and don't need a huge cam.
Anyone with a VVT system please feel free to post track times and trap speeds. List any mods and cam specs if you can, thank you.
Put a VVT cam in and run it down the track 3 times. Post the times and trap speeds.
Delete VVT and use the same cam or cam specs, run it down the track 3 times. Post the times and trap speeds.
I have searched and searched for something like this. Dyno numbers without times and speeds are not needed
I'm about to delete the AFM/DOD parts but would like to keep the VVT if it gives me an edge. I know I can get better times with out the VVT and a bigger cam but I'm installing a Procharger with ported heads and don't need a huge cam.
Anyone with a VVT system please feel free to post track times and trap speeds. List any mods and cam specs if you can, thank you.
Last edited by No Hope; Jan 19, 2012 at 12:38 AM.
Teching In
Joined: Nov 2011
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You can make more peak torque and peak horsepower with the VVT with a stock cam as long as you can control it. I would get rid of the DOD and keep the VVT. It should play nice with the procharger. 1.8 rockers and better valve springs won't hurt.
Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 234
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From: Disneyland or St Louis
This post is going well. It must be 1 of 3 things.
A. Its posted in the wrong section.
B. Its a stupid question.
C. There is no real life track data to support the Dyno numbers that claim VVT gives you an advantage over a static cam.
Feel free to choose one and post it.
A. Its posted in the wrong section.
B. Its a stupid question.
C. There is no real life track data to support the Dyno numbers that claim VVT gives you an advantage over a static cam.
Feel free to choose one and post it.
Teching In
Joined: Nov 2011
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Probably no real data. If you un-plug the phaser and drive it you should be able to feel the difference without going to the track. The cam is advanced 7° when the phaser isn't working. You need at least 10° of retard to make max power with the stock cam. What engine do you have ? Are you going to use a D.O.D. delete kit ?
Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 234
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From: Disneyland or St Louis
Probably no real data. If you un-plug the phaser and drive it you should be able to feel the difference without going to the track. The cam is advanced 7° when the phaser isn't working. You need at least 10° of retard to make max power with the stock cam. What engine do you have ? Are you going to use a D.O.D. delete kit ?
I will have to try unplugging the phaser.
I would advise that you not unplugging the phaser, it is much much safer to go into the tune and zero all the VVT tables. This way your commanding and controlling the phaser still to keep it advanced, rather than unplugging it and letting it go uncontrolled!! Unplugging, or advancing through the tune, will cause maximum low end torque and it will ABSOLUTLY fall on its face around 5000RPM. It puts TPI to shame with how bad it is!!!!
Your problem is no one has done what exactly what your requesting, and you being very specific. I have done engine dyno tuning on VVT (L92, 3v Ford 4.6L, and 5.0L Ford 4v) engines. THere is a massive difference in the numbers, you dont need a timeslip to tell you it will be faster. I can shift the torque 60ft*lbs with the click of a few buttons.
VVT is like "having you cake and eating it too" Max torque and power through the entire operating range. Where as with a static cam you can only maximize one area.
Your problem is no one has done what exactly what your requesting, and you being very specific. I have done engine dyno tuning on VVT (L92, 3v Ford 4.6L, and 5.0L Ford 4v) engines. THere is a massive difference in the numbers, you dont need a timeslip to tell you it will be faster. I can shift the torque 60ft*lbs with the click of a few buttons.
VVT is like "having you cake and eating it too" Max torque and power through the entire operating range. Where as with a static cam you can only maximize one area.
Teching In
Joined: Nov 2011
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I would advise that you not unplugging the phaser, it is much much safer to go into the tune and zero all the VVT tables.
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Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Jan 2012
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From: Disneyland or St Louis
I would advise that you not unplugging the phaser, it is much much safer to go into the tune and zero all the VVT tables. This way your commanding and controlling the phaser still to keep it advanced, rather than unplugging it and letting it go uncontrolled!! Unplugging, or advancing through the tune, will cause maximum low end torque and it will ABSOLUTLY fall on its face around 5000RPM. It puts TPI to shame with how bad it is!!!!
Your problem is no one has done what exactly what your requesting, and you being very specific. I have done engine dyno tuning on VVT (L92, 3v Ford 4.6L, and 5.0L Ford 4v) engines. THere is a massive difference in the numbers, you dont need a timeslip to tell you it will be faster. I can shift the torque 60ft*lbs with the click of a few buttons.
VVT is like "having you cake and eating it too" Max torque and power through the entire operating range. Where as with a static cam you can only maximize one area.
Your problem is no one has done what exactly what your requesting, and you being very specific. I have done engine dyno tuning on VVT (L92, 3v Ford 4.6L, and 5.0L Ford 4v) engines. THere is a massive difference in the numbers, you dont need a timeslip to tell you it will be faster. I can shift the torque 60ft*lbs with the click of a few buttons.
VVT is like "having you cake and eating it too" Max torque and power through the entire operating range. Where as with a static cam you can only maximize one area.
That's why I want to keep it. There are VVT cams out that have .620" lift and duration's in the 220's. That's plenty of cam with a blower and ported heads.
I just don't see any track times posted with VVT cams listed in their mods. Should I change the OP to include any VVT track times?
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Last edited by SweetS10V8; Jan 15, 2012 at 12:21 PM.
FormerVendor
Joined: Dec 2011
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From: Sandy, UT
I'd get rid of both, in fact I did on my 2010 Camaro. Though VVT is an awesome technology, and can give you great benefits, it is pretty much in its infancy in LSx aftermarket products, and therefore not very many people can tune properly for them. Plus, going with a nice fixed timing cam can give you spectacular results as well, has been proven for decades, and has less potential problems.
We do the full LS3 conversion (minus the pistons) on all our cam swap L99s. Great power, great function, and other than labor its a great price too!
Feel free to call, email or PM us anytime!
- Jeremy
We do the full LS3 conversion (minus the pistons) on all our cam swap L99s. Great power, great function, and other than labor its a great price too!
Feel free to call, email or PM us anytime!
- Jeremy
Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 234
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From: Disneyland or St Louis
I'd get rid of both, in fact I did on my 2010 Camaro. Though VVT is an awesome technology, and can give you great benefits, it is pretty much in its infancy in LSx aftermarket products, and therefore not very many people can tune properly for them. Plus, going with a nice fixed timing cam can give you spectacular results as well, has been proven for decades, and has less potential problems.
We do the full LS3 conversion (minus the pistons) on all our cam swap L99s. Great power, great function, and other than labor its a great price too!
Feel free to call, email or PM us anytime!
- Jeremy
We do the full LS3 conversion (minus the pistons) on all our cam swap L99s. Great power, great function, and other than labor its a great price too!
Feel free to call, email or PM us anytime!
- Jeremy
I hate to say it but I'm leaning that way.
I think VVT has great potential but I don't see any sign of it at the track. I just want to go faster than the next guy and if it gives me an edge I want it. If it doesn't then it will have to go. I'm going to change the OP to include track times of any VVT set up.
I hate to say it but I'm leaning that way.
I think VVT has great potential but I don't see any sign of it at the track. I just want to go faster than the next guy and if it gives me an edge I want it. If it doesn't then it will have to go. I'm going to change the OP to include track times of any VVT set up.
I think VVT has great potential but I don't see any sign of it at the track. I just want to go faster than the next guy and if it gives me an edge I want it. If it doesn't then it will have to go. I'm going to change the OP to include track times of any VVT set up.
In the 80-90s people removed their fuel injection and went back to a carb.
Today people remove VVT, because they dont understand it. Have fun removing awesome technology. Ive heard many many stories of guys that raced in the 70s trying to make their engines VVT, but couldnt. Because they understood the advantages of having the cam advanced for low end and retarding it to keep top end performance. Now that the OEMs have spent millions and brought the technology to the masses everyone is afraid of it.
Call New Era, they have been working on VVT and have a step or two above from Comp's work. They of course are keeping it G14 classified and will only work on it themselves. I heard from Morgan's posting that it is bad **** and I agree with SweetS10 it's is like a holy grail!! I wouldn't remove it, I'd exploit it!
In the 70s people took of their HEIs and put back on points
In the 80-90s people removed their fuel injection and went back to a carb.
Today people remove VVT, because they dont understand it. Have fun removing awesome technology. Ive heard many many stories of guys that raced in the 70s trying to make their engines VVT, but couldnt. Because they understood the advantages of having the cam advanced for low end and retarding it to keep top end performance. Now that the OEMs have spent millions and brought the technology to the masses everyone is afraid of it.
In the 80-90s people removed their fuel injection and went back to a carb.
Today people remove VVT, because they dont understand it. Have fun removing awesome technology. Ive heard many many stories of guys that raced in the 70s trying to make their engines VVT, but couldnt. Because they understood the advantages of having the cam advanced for low end and retarding it to keep top end performance. Now that the OEMs have spent millions and brought the technology to the masses everyone is afraid of it.
Hmm...getting an L76 longblock soon so this makes me interested in keeping VVT. Due to GMPP ecu/harness I'm getting for only $500 I won't use the VVT now but may keep as a future option.
This new technology is amazing, and right now we offer 3 different versions of VVT camshafts that we have spent countless hours testing on both engine and chassis dynos. We are planning on producing more in the future because being able to have more control over the valvetrain is never a bad idea, and those who are opposed should probably study into it a little more.
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This new technology is amazing, and right now we offer 3 different versions of VVT camshafts that we have spent countless hours testing on both engine and chassis dynos. We are planning on producing more in the future because being able to have more control over the valvetrain is never a bad idea, and those who are opposed should probably study into it a little more.
Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 234
Likes: 0
From: Disneyland or St Louis
In the 70s people took of their HEIs and put back on points
In the 80-90s people removed their fuel injection and went back to a carb.
Today people remove VVT, because they dont understand it. Have fun removing awesome technology. Ive heard many many stories of guys that raced in the 70s trying to make their engines VVT, but couldnt. Because they understood the advantages of having the cam advanced for low end and retarding it to keep top end performance. Now that the OEMs have spent millions and brought the technology to the masses everyone is afraid of it.
In the 80-90s people removed their fuel injection and went back to a carb.
Today people remove VVT, because they dont understand it. Have fun removing awesome technology. Ive heard many many stories of guys that raced in the 70s trying to make their engines VVT, but couldnt. Because they understood the advantages of having the cam advanced for low end and retarding it to keep top end performance. Now that the OEMs have spent millions and brought the technology to the masses everyone is afraid of it.
I didn't say I was going to remove it, I was just leaning that way.
After hours of searching and going back and forth, I think the best thing for me to do is install a some forced induction and wait till I need a new top end before I make a decision. By that time maybe the benefits will be more clear.
Does that sound good?
Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 234
Likes: 0
From: Disneyland or St Louis
This new technology is amazing, and right now we offer 3 different versions of VVT camshafts that we have spent countless hours testing on both engine and chassis dynos. We are planning on producing more in the future because being able to have more control over the valvetrain is never a bad idea, and those who are opposed should probably study into it a little more.
If anyone should have some before and after track times it should be Texas Speed. Your Cams are the ones I have been looking at.
.62 is a lot of lift for a VVT system. Have you had any problems? Is it true that the stronger springs have an effect on the VVT system? If someone buys the hollow stem valves what kind of spring set up can they get away with.
This next question might be a dumb one but I don't care I have been wanting to ask it ever since I started reading about VVT. From what I understand the VVT system works off oil pressure. Why don't they install a DC servo motor with a shaft encoder that works off the ECM instead of the oil system?