Snyper

iTrader: (27)

The oil pump and seal were both installed correctly and the pump was the one recommended by ERL and sold to me by them. And my last motor was prelubed by turning the engine over with no spark plugs in it until I saw oil coming out of the pushrods and it worked fine. I also rechecked (before taking the caps off) the pickup to pan clearance and I had just under 1/2" which tells me that definately wasn't the problem. To be honest the pump did a pretty good job even holding that much pressure with the bearings in the condition that they were in. The oil pressure never changed from the day I started the engine(with the barbell in) which leads me to believe it was the 30 seconds and not the miles after. If driving it is what killed it I would of seen an oil pressure change. If you read my first post in my build you can see where I said I put the barbell in and got 50psi immediatly with 10w40. The day I took my car apart I had 60psi on startup with the 20w50...which indicates that there was no more damage being done. I emailed them the pictures and I will report back on what they say. To be honest, I would like them to pay for new bearings and new headgaskets and id cover the labor having my machineshop redo the block. It is going to cost me about 500$ in labor to have everything fixed so if the parts are paid for I will be okay with it.

Gray86hatch

iTrader: (83)

You had oil pressure because you had 20-50 in it. that is thick stuff. If you would have had 10-40 in it it would have been a different story.

If you didn't take the pump appart to center it to the hub it was wrong. 1/2" is too much pickup clearance.

Rolling the engine over to get oil pressure is asking for problems. you can make a preoiler really cheap that you put air pressure to and it pushes the oil thru the engine.

Honnestly I would look very very close at the pump pick up tube and pan that you are running. If things are not prefect you will have more problems.
The pump needs to be inspected now with all the trash in the oil anyway.

Tim

Gray86hatch

iTrader: (83)

this is the stuff I am using.

http://www.schumannsdynamicperforman...t-ls1-lsx.html

Snyper

iTrader: (27)

Okay well not centering the pump and the .5" of clearance isn't what caused this issue. Im starting to think you are looking for whatever reason you can(and haven't found any) to say this was user error. Even 1/2" away from the bottom theres no chance of oil starvation because of the pans design..unless I was running very low on oil..and oil level is something I check at least 2 times a week to make sure it is exactly where its supposed to be. I usually overfill the pan by 1/2 quart as an even further preventative measures. I've never had this issue with the previous 3 setups I had. This is the same pan I made 733whp on 2 years ago..on my stock engine...and the same last year. Never had an issue with the pickup and pan. The pickup tube is fairly large.

Also, with the pump being the wrong one..if that was the case why would they recommend it? I would of spend the extra money for a different oil pump if thats what they suggested. Clearly the pump was doing its job and had it not of been for the wiped out bearings the oil pressure would of beem fine. And you are right about the thicker oil and higher pressures..that was the point I was trying to make. If driving the car caused these issues then I would of seen a higher oil pressure in the beginning. I ran the 10w40 on startup..changed the oil and the oil pressures remained the same from when I had 0 miles on the motor till I took it apart leading me to believe that the oil pressure issue was there from day one.

On the first actual startup I let the car go all the way to operating temp and thats when I noticed the 15-18psi on the 10w. I shut it down changed the oil as I usually do, Let the car warm up to operating temp again and at that point it was around 22-24psi..and after a 5 mile drive it was down to 18psi...which is where it remained the whole time.

Pro Level

No Barbell, No Oil to Mains !

Snyper

iTrader: (27)

Im hoping my cam and cam bearings aren't wiped out as well. Before this i've never even known of there being a barbell plug in the back of the block. I sent my engine out with it and got it back without it. Every time Ive had my engines done id send the block with out them and get them back with them installed and never had the issue before. =(

Pro Level

You'll have to check everything, and from the looks of those main bearings, your crank is gonna need polishing or regrind. As far as the barbell, some people supply them and some people don't. It sounds like you bought a short block with no covers, so it was probably the end users responsibility to install it. I think had you pre-lubed engine first externally, you would have caught pressure problem on the gauge. And you could've diagnosed and fixed it(Barbell) before you ever put heat in the engine. All it takes is a few seconds of metal to metal contact between the journal and bearing, and theres no coming back! And as far as the blow-by you had, it wasnt , it was the bearings getting hot and cooking the oil as it passed by. Hence the smoke out the valve covers. Luckily you took that thing out. Had you listened to a couple of these posters given you the thumbs up you'd probably be in worse shape.

Snyper

iTrader: (27)

I sent them my block to resleeve with the plug installed. They send me back my resleeved block with the plug missing which is why I didn't catch it..or even think to look for it. And I knew better than to keep driving it. The mellings pump would work just fine on a factory LS2 block. Just the sleeves were upgraded, not the oiling system..so to say the pump isn't enough is just wrong. The crank will need to be polished..it really didnt look too bad. Even the thrust surface has very minor surfacing markings.

KILLERARMY

If when i get my motor from ERL Performance,what do i need have check before the motor is placed in the car.I don"t want any type of crap pop up like this.

Pro Level

So did you assemble your own engine or did ERL assemble it ?

NemeSS

iTrader: (127)

dam.
sorry to hear. did you do anything to pre lube the motor before firing it?

Snyper

iTrader: (27)

Yes, I've had 4 motors built in the past 8 years and ive always unhooked the coils and the injectors and turned the motor over usually seeing oil coming out of pushrods within 30 seconds. This time I saw no oil but figured(and was told) it was because I didn't soak the lifters and they needed to fill up. I was also told by Seth at ERL that using that method would be fine. I was even told by him letting the engine run for 30 seconds that way shouldn't of caused any damage that these motors can take a beating.

Slowhawk

iTrader: (12)

The bearings were probly shot from the first startup. It happens and we've seen it a few times.Between dry cranking it(no barbell) and then starting with no barbell I would probly point to that as the cause.

FYI- We ussually prime the engine on the stand before install - pour oil into the oil pickup while turning the motor by hand. Then just fire it in the vehicle. Haven't had an issue doing this.

Snyper

iTrader: (27)

Well I emailed ERL this morning and waiting on a response. If they will provide me with new headgaskets and bearings I will gladly pay my guy to rebuilt thus putting any future "warranty" issues on him. I feel as though its fair enough. I will have to shell out another 500$ in labor though.

Snyper

iTrader: (27)

Update. Finally got a response back from ERL and they have agreed to provide me with new bearings and new head gaskets. Needless to say despite the fact that my motor is toast and is going to cost me money I am more than happy with the agreement. I will still have to spend about 500$ in labor which to me is justified since I didn't check for the plug, regardless of if I knew about it or not, before putting it together.

Tirefire

iTrader: (1)

I received my AES 390 long block a while back and did everything these guys on this forum say to (e.g. center my pump, check for clearance on my pick-up and bottom of my oil tray etc.) Well, when I went to prime my engine while on the engine stand with a starter I did not get any oil pressure. What I did then was fill the **** out of it with oil and then tried again, which finally did the job. Now that I'm finally getting my stuff (Lonnies double pump system, 80 ib injectors and Aster bracket) I hope I dont have any issues when I fire up my engine for the first time!! I've invested so much money at this point that I'd probably drive off a cliff. Also I don't understand some of these people who say you should'nt crank your engine to prime your engine if that's what we've been told by our engine builders???? I hope all ends well for you bro!!

crainholio

iTrader: (2)

If you can turn the crank by hand fast enough to build oil pressure, I'm leaving my wife and marrying you.

S10xGN

iTrader: (11)

Crain, you are sooooo screwed! See post #1 here...

Che70velle

iTrader: (6)

...can't wait to see how this turns out. Boy is your wife gonna be pissed.

crainholio

iTrader: (2)

Ha ha! I had no idea it was possible with such slow crank rotation. I'll be sticking w/ the wife though...