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Johnson 2116 Lifter Question

 
Old 01-30-2016, 05:55 PM
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Default Johnson 2116 Lifter Question

Does anyone know if it is normal for these to require about .100 longer pushrod than LS7 lifters or even 2110’s? I went to order my pushrods and the guy told me that the length sounded too long to him for my setup. I have LSX with pistons .014 in the hole, TFS255 heads, CHE LS3 rockers and Johnson 2116 lifters. Just looking for any experience with the 2116’s. We measure them at 7.930
.. Thnx
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Old 01-30-2016, 10:42 PM
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Yes you will need longer. How much I'm unsure of.
Just last night I had my 2116 and LS 7 lifters with a pushrod sitting in them and the 2116 was shorter in overall height.
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Old 01-31-2016, 03:14 AM
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I know mine were on the long side but you would be best off assembling everything and measuring for pushrods. Unless you are going with a known grind and lifter, you should always mock it up and measure then get the correct length.
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Old 01-31-2016, 09:02 AM
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Originally Posted by tadams72 View Post
I know mine were on the long side but you would be best off assembling everything and measuring for pushrods. Unless you are going with a known grind and lifter, you should always mock it up and measure then get the correct length.
Thatís exactly what we did. Just the guy I was ordering the Mantons through(not Manton) told me that was too long on my combination and had me doubting what we had done.
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Old 01-31-2016, 09:27 AM
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7.813 and 7.826 that's what my rods spec'd out at with the 2116 a/o lifters. That's including preload.
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Old 01-31-2016, 09:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Undertow74 View Post
7.813 and 7.826 that's what my rods spec'd out at with the 2116 a/o lifters. That's including preload.
What heads is that with?
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Old 01-31-2016, 09:57 AM
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Mms 235
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Old 01-31-2016, 10:52 AM
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Well my Mantons came in at something like 8.063/8.048 on TFS 255s. So many things influence pushrod length. If you have measured properly, don't worry about what someone else is saying. Too many people think "oh it's an LS so it needs 7.4" pushrods." Yeah that math only truly works if you are doing a cam swap with the same lifters and base circle on the cam. You have changed much more than that so go with your numbers and verify when you receive your new pushrods.
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Old 01-31-2016, 11:02 AM
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Exactly, the only true way to know is to measure. Trust me my measurements were off the first 2 times I measured I have no idea really how, took me a third time to get it correct with zero lash. Now I have a set of manton rods just laying in my garage.
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Old 01-31-2016, 02:02 PM
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Havoc told me they require about .190 longer than LS7s
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Old 03-12-2019, 12:19 PM
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"mchicia1", which "havoc" user (there are many) measured the lifters and got 190.
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Old 03-21-2019, 10:22 AM
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I have used these also and they needed longer pushrods. Don't go off of what an internet measurement is.... you must take the time and measure them to do it properly.
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Old 03-21-2019, 12:59 PM
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Spend $20 on the pushrod tool, spend $50 on 8" digital calipers, and measure for your proper length. It is the only way to do it.
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Old 03-26-2019, 09:41 AM
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Originally Posted by MuhThugga View Post
Spend $20 on the pushrod tool, spend $50 on 8" digital calipers, and measure for your proper length. It is the only way to do it.
THIS. I just ordered my Manton pushrods for my LSnext 388 and the only way they would sell them to me was if I measured with this method. I tried using the bolt turn method the first go around and it's just not accurate enough. Went to Harbor Freight and bought a 8" caliper and remeasured all of them with the checker to zero lash and provided Manton that measurement. They then added in the .030 preload and .008 the iron block will grow at temp.
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Old 03-26-2019, 07:38 PM
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Originally Posted by blackdak318 View Post
THIS. I just ordered my Manton pushrods for my LSnext 388 and the only way they would sell them to me was if I measured with this method. I tried using the bolt turn method the first go around and it's just not accurate enough. Went to Harbor Freight and bought a 8" caliper and remeasured all of them with the checker to zero lash and provided Manton that measurement. They then added in the .030 preload and .008 the iron block will grow at temp.
how did you confirm that rocker bolt turn wasnt accurate enough?
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Old 03-26-2019, 09:05 PM
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Ive had issues getting the same length to work in multiple cookie cutter builds actually.
Much more than morel.
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Old 03-27-2019, 09:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Floorman279 View Post
how did you confirm that rocker bolt turn wasnt accurate enough?
Compared my bolt turn method measurements against the zero last plus preload measurements. My bolt turn measurements were way off compared to the zero lash and measure. More than half of my pushrods would have been incorrect with the bolt turn method. Just talk to any pushrod manuf. I explained how I measured via the bolt turn method to Johnson Lifters, Trend, and Manton and they all told me don't use that method, use the zero lash, measure, then add your preload. The johnson lifter guy wasn't even aware the bolt turn method was a thing.
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Old 03-27-2019, 09:37 AM
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Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
Ive had issues getting the same length to work in multiple cookie cutter builds actually.
Much more than morel.
They want the tolerances so tight on these I'm not surprised you need different lengths, but it is a PITA. On my build I was able to use the same length for all the exhausts, but I have 5 different lengths needed for the intakes.
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Old 03-27-2019, 02:23 PM
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Thats not what i meant. I mean with basically the same cams on the same vehicles they would come out way off.
Ive measured preload with a modified pushrod using the turns and have never had an issue. Ive tried math and had customers use math and its correct sometimes. Thats why i tell them always measure.
Since you are working with basically a triangle its definitely not straight linear movement also.
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Old 03-27-2019, 04:21 PM
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I agree and basically told the Johnson guy that what he was telling me was nuts. Their preload + - of only .005 is damn near impossible to truly hit given what we are dealing with and all the variables. On top of that I told him I bought the lifters used and it melted his brain. He told me the tolerances in the lifter are so tight that even a human hair getting into it could stick the plunger or limit flow. I told him that even if I bought new I could easily open the package and leave it in the garage for dust/hair to get into and that they shouldn't design parts that can only be correctly used with installed in a HEPA filtered NASA clean room. I think their expectations were a bit far fetched given most of us are just guys doing this **** in our garage.
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