1969 camaro....World 427 or LS7
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Launching!
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From: New Jersey
1969 camaro....World 427 or LS7 Hey guys im new to the forum. u guys have a great site goign here. Im 17 and me and my dad work on my 69 camaro and we are getting more serious. We want to change the 89 auto vette trany to the tremmc 600 and figured its time to take the deluxe 350 out as well. I am having a huge dilemma though. I dont know if i should keep the real muscle and put in the world 427 with 520 horse and aluminum heads or go with that very sexy all new ls7. I think either one would make peoples jaw drop but im not sure which way to go. I know the world block would be so much easier to drop in but the ls7 is so sick. If anyone has put the ls7 in an older car yet or knows anybody who has, it would help a lot if i knew how hard the installation would be. I mean with the whole computer and oil deal goin it seems kinda complicated. Let me know what you guys think. Thanks a lot!
Originally Posted by airbman21
Hey guys im new to the forum. u guys have a great site goign here. Im 17 and me and my dad work on my 69 camaro and we are getting more serious. We want to change the 89 auto vette trany to the tremmc 600 and figured its time to take the deluxe 350 out as well. I am having a huge dilemma though. I dont know if i should keep the real muscle and put in the world 427 with 520 horse and aluminum heads or go with that very sexy all new ls7. I think either one would make peoples jaw drop but im not sure which way to go. I know the world block would be so much easier to drop in but the ls7 is so sick. If anyone has put the ls7 in an older car yet or knows anybody who has, it would help a lot if i knew how hard the installation would be. I mean with the whole computer and oil deal goin it seems kinda complicated. Let me know what you guys think. Thanks a lot!
The oil lines and tank are pretty simple. As long as your crossmember doesnt interfere it's no big deal. Tuning will hopefully be resolved very soon. We have developed upgraded pistons for the LS7. If you're interested in us building one for you, or a sleeved LS2, or a world products block give me a call or email jason@katechengines.com.
586-791-4120 x234
The World products 427 engine will be less expensive and easy to install, but it will just be another 69 Camaro with a gen1 engine.
The LS7 would be much lighter, and with the dry sump would be killer on track days. The cost would be much higher.
Another option would be our 402 "old school" gen3 crate engine. This engine comes with a carb and ignition system that is simple to hook up in a older car, and weighs in under 400 pounds with 575hp available. It is available to ship in shortblock form in 1 day and can be assembled and shipped in 1 week complete. It has a traditional wet sump pan.
Kurt
The LS7 would be much lighter, and with the dry sump would be killer on track days. The cost would be much higher.
Another option would be our 402 "old school" gen3 crate engine. This engine comes with a carb and ignition system that is simple to hook up in a older car, and weighs in under 400 pounds with 575hp available. It is available to ship in shortblock form in 1 day and can be assembled and shipped in 1 week complete. It has a traditional wet sump pan.
Kurt
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From: Reno, NV
I presume when you say "Delux 350", that it is not a "numbers-matching" car. If it were, from a financial perspective, you would be wise to rebuild the engine as it came from Chevy.
The LS7 is one sweet engine. It would take a little more effort to drop it into your Camaro, but I am doing something similar...running an LS7 in a stand-alone environment. Your results in a Camaro would be remarkable and a real show-stopper. There are a couple of folks on this board building Camaros and a couple doing older Vettes. One guy is doing a '53 on a C5 chassis with the LS7.
Wheel-2-Wheel (see above) has a close connection with GM, and a company called BigStuff3 (BS3). BS3 makes ignition and timing systems for many LSx applications; most recently for the LS7. The BigStuff3 system (harness and ECU) for the LS7 should be available by the end of the month, as testing is just finishing up. The combination made 548 bhp on my engine.
Also, the BS3 system is very flexible in terms of programming for future engine mods, like forced induction or N2O.
Good luck and let us know what you decide...
The LS7 is one sweet engine. It would take a little more effort to drop it into your Camaro, but I am doing something similar...running an LS7 in a stand-alone environment. Your results in a Camaro would be remarkable and a real show-stopper. There are a couple of folks on this board building Camaros and a couple doing older Vettes. One guy is doing a '53 on a C5 chassis with the LS7.
Wheel-2-Wheel (see above) has a close connection with GM, and a company called BigStuff3 (BS3). BS3 makes ignition and timing systems for many LSx applications; most recently for the LS7. The BigStuff3 system (harness and ECU) for the LS7 should be available by the end of the month, as testing is just finishing up. The combination made 548 bhp on my engine.
Also, the BS3 system is very flexible in terms of programming for future engine mods, like forced induction or N2O.
Good luck and let us know what you decide...
I'm putting an LS7 into a '68 Camaro, so that is the route that I chose. Realistically, it will probably be about 20 grand to put the LS7 in that car. Figure 14k for the LS7 crate, and I could see oil system, computer, headers, engine mounts, fuel system for fuel injection...the list goes on...costing at least an additional 6k. Not trying to discourage you, just giving you an idea of the costs involved.
As far as putting the LS7 in the car, it shouldn't be much worse than putting an LS1 in, which isn't too bad. The potential issues I see are, obviously the oil lines, oil drain, computer, accesories and I'm sure I'll find more when I start putting the engine in the car. The subframe you use could effect these issues, too. I plan to go with an aftermarket sub, which ought to make my life a little easier. The computer issue should be solved in the near future, but right now it is a definite issue. One of the oil drains could blocked by the subframe, especially if it is stock. I have no way of knowing this without trying it, however. The oil pan itself looks like it ought to clear the stock sub, but that is only an educated guess. Search for info on LS1's in first gens, and that really should tell you what is involved.
All that said, LS7 in '69 would be sweet. After all, that's why I'm putting one in the '68.
As far as putting the LS7 in the car, it shouldn't be much worse than putting an LS1 in, which isn't too bad. The potential issues I see are, obviously the oil lines, oil drain, computer, accesories and I'm sure I'll find more when I start putting the engine in the car. The subframe you use could effect these issues, too. I plan to go with an aftermarket sub, which ought to make my life a little easier. The computer issue should be solved in the near future, but right now it is a definite issue. One of the oil drains could blocked by the subframe, especially if it is stock. I have no way of knowing this without trying it, however. The oil pan itself looks like it ought to clear the stock sub, but that is only an educated guess. Search for info on LS1's in first gens, and that really should tell you what is involved.
All that said, LS7 in '69 would be sweet. After all, that's why I'm putting one in the '68.
Thread Starter
Launching!
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From: New Jersey
I really like that 402 because it incorporates the lightweight engine and the car style as well. its easy to install and has the horsepower im looking for. I am just wondering if it is worth it to go fuel injected. I mean for 3 grand more is it worth it?what are the benefits, easy start up and being able to program and adjust your motor better? i think i just have to choose fuel injected or carb. what do you guys think?
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Verdad Gallardo How much do you want to drive the car? If it's just weekends, nice days, etc. a carb is fine, but for everyday, fuel injection is tremendously better.
I have a '69 Olds 442, which has a mild 455, and of course it has a carb. It's an Edelbrock, which is a very accurate carb as far as mixture is concerned, but it can't compare to the accuracy of FI. No having to deal with a choke or worrying about the tune changing with the weather is a great thing.
Once you go to any sort of LS1, you won't want to go back to anything else.
I have a '69 Olds 442, which has a mild 455, and of course it has a carb. It's an Edelbrock, which is a very accurate carb as far as mixture is concerned, but it can't compare to the accuracy of FI. No having to deal with a choke or worrying about the tune changing with the weather is a great thing.
Once you go to any sort of LS1, you won't want to go back to anything else.
Thread Starter
Launching!
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From: New Jersey
Thanks for your help guys i think im going to go with the 402 fuel injected ls2 but i have another question. i want my car to sound sick and im not sure if the cam in that motor will do it. what exhaust headers and cam should i put in the 402 to make it sound and perform the best?
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From: Reno, NV
Originally Posted by airbman21
You are probably right but why?Im kidan new at the whole electronics thing haha. And what is the 427 warhawk? the world motors website really stinks.
- Hot and cold starts are much easier.
- No "loading up" issues at idle.
- No fuel starvation" with hard breaking, acceleration, or cornering.
- Better fuel economy and emissions.
- No fiddling with weather or altitude changes.
- EFI is more expensive.
- The installation is more complex with a throttle body, manifold to support injectors and fuel rails, ECU, sensors and wires.
- It's more complicated to dial in.
Lastly, I am sure a World Products big "small block Chevy" is a great product...state-of-the-art. But, my experience has been that the design of the "high-performance" SBC seems to use a little more oil than the LSx series. Also, with a "power tune" on a carb setup, the guy behind you may get some tears in his eyes from the rich exhaust.
Summary, I would definitely go EFI and LSx. It's a little harder, but you will be glad you did. And, there is a lot of knowledgable help here from folks have done it.
Keep us posted...
Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Jan 2006
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From: New Jersey
U guys are the best you helped me make the right decision so quickly. i cant thank you enough. Next question would be what tranny gets hooked up to this beast motor? im not sure if the tremmec 600 can be put in there and that was the way i was going to go. what would be the best tranny to put in there with all of ur experience. I also have the american thunder flowmaster 2.5 inch exhaust system i dont know what to put on the new engine. which headers as well. any information im going to need while dropping this engine and tranny in will help. thanks a lot
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Joined: Nov 2004
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From: Reno, NV
Originally Posted by airbman21
...Next question would be what tranny gets hooked up to this beast motor? im not sure if the tremmec 600 can be put in there and that was the way i was going to go. what would be the best tranny to put in there with all of ur experience. I also have the american thunder flowmaster 2.5 inch exhaust system i dont know what to put on the new engine. which headers as well. any information im going to need while dropping this engine and tranny in will help. thanks a lot
You are on the right path. Keep searching for first-gen swaps. Read, read, read this board. Look at the profiles of the people that have responded to you. From there, you can find their posts, many of which will be about the topics you are looking for. You may also have noticed there is a "swaps" section from the main page. Also, be sure to take advantage of the search capabilities. For example: "first gen", "1st gen", "69 camaro", etc. Lots of good threads here...
