SAM's 500" LS2 Project *Progress Pics*
02-23-2006, 06:18 PM
#42
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I will check for you and report back.
As for the comment about the 8's, we are honestly not sure what this baby will churn out but it should run very well with the given power it should produce.
As for the comment about the 8's, we are honestly not sure what this baby will churn out but it should run very well with the given power it should produce.
02-23-2006, 07:05 PM
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hey gray, this is david saunders in tallahassee, florida. that beast looks great. i was really excited to see some pics after you were telling me about it on the phone. i'm really looking forward to starting classes in march also.
02-23-2006, 10:48 PM
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Originally Posted by DMSZ28
hey gray, this is david saunders in tallahassee, florida. that beast looks great. i was really excited to see some pics after you were telling me about it on the phone. i'm really looking forward to starting classes in march also.
Howdy David! Glad you are getting excited to start down here in March! It has been a fun project so far. When you get down here, you will get to see this thing in ACTION!
Take care.Gray
02-24-2006, 07:55 AM
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For the 500" motor have you guys thought about one of the carb manifolds with a 4150 or 4500 throttle body? Or is the goal of this motor to remain under the stock hood with no modifications? Man, 500" is really going to use those ls7 heads. Good luck with both of those beasts
02-24-2006, 08:11 AM
#46
Gray- Are you guys going to use the spacers that ERL makes for the exhaust to compensate for the 3/4" deck plate etc... I talked to those guys and seems like they have it just about where you could fit it in an F-body without to much trouble etc...
Jeff
Jeff
02-24-2006, 08:44 AM
#47
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clearance in the block Hello all, I had the honor of working with ERL on the 500 project. The manufacturers who contributed to this project are very excited about it. It was done right...the "clean sheet of paper" design allowed us to design parts without compromise, which is beneficial to everyone.
There was a comment about clearancing on the inside of the block. If you get a chance, shoot some photo's with the rods and pistons in it to show the folks. People will be suprised how little clearancing is necessary. Sounds impossible, but normal 4" stroker assemblies require more clearancing than this does. This keeps the crankcase very strong....no deep cuts close to water or oil passages.
To achieve what ERL achieved, the entire engine was modeled. The crank, rods, pistons, cam, and timing chain are all "rotate-able" in real-time. The rod to lobe and crankcase clearance was known before the prototype parts were even ordered....down to the thousandth. That made the intake manifold spacer design easy as well. What's really cool is to "rev" the model up. The assembly becomes a blur very quickly, just like a real engine.
The engine bays for F bodies, Vette's, SSR's, the GTO, and the trucks have been measured. Engine width with standard headers won't be an issue, the only unknown is the header to steering gear clearance. We'll find out about that soon enough....S.A.M. is fitting the engine into the tightest combination right now, so we'll see.
There's a blown version in the works as well. The strength and "life" of the components weren't compromised because the architecture took this combination into account from the start. For those that were in math club, figure out the dish volume necessary to get 8.8:1 compression with a 4.5 crank and a 68cc head The piston we did for it rides up and down the bores like butter, has plenty of deck thickness, and the land thickness is right up there with a Pro Mod.
There are quite a few "special" features ERL has designed in. Little things that will make a seasoned engine builder say "I'll be damned". These features will make this a VERY durable engine....something you can put a lot of miles on. The "Superdeck 1" standard deck version incorporates these features as well. (One of those is being prepared for One Lap as we speak). Some of the things are optional to save the "average guy" a bit of money and the price will be competitive with what's out there currently. The nice thing about CNC is the design work is done only once. From there, they churn out repeatable perfect blocks every time with a minimum of expensive hand labor. That's what makes the optional features in the "full-on" version inexpensive. Features normally found outside $40k race engines.
We live in a great age! -Brian Nutter, Wiseco Piston
There was a comment about clearancing on the inside of the block. If you get a chance, shoot some photo's with the rods and pistons in it to show the folks. People will be suprised how little clearancing is necessary. Sounds impossible, but normal 4" stroker assemblies require more clearancing than this does. This keeps the crankcase very strong....no deep cuts close to water or oil passages.
To achieve what ERL achieved, the entire engine was modeled. The crank, rods, pistons, cam, and timing chain are all "rotate-able" in real-time. The rod to lobe and crankcase clearance was known before the prototype parts were even ordered....down to the thousandth. That made the intake manifold spacer design easy as well. What's really cool is to "rev" the model up. The assembly becomes a blur very quickly, just like a real engine.
The engine bays for F bodies, Vette's, SSR's, the GTO, and the trucks have been measured. Engine width with standard headers won't be an issue, the only unknown is the header to steering gear clearance. We'll find out about that soon enough....S.A.M. is fitting the engine into the tightest combination right now, so we'll see.
There's a blown version in the works as well. The strength and "life" of the components weren't compromised because the architecture took this combination into account from the start. For those that were in math club, figure out the dish volume necessary to get 8.8:1 compression with a 4.5 crank and a 68cc head
The piston we did for it rides up and down the bores like butter, has plenty of deck thickness, and the land thickness is right up there with a Pro Mod. There are quite a few "special" features ERL has designed in. Little things that will make a seasoned engine builder say "I'll be damned". These features will make this a VERY durable engine....something you can put a lot of miles on. The "Superdeck 1" standard deck version incorporates these features as well. (One of those is being prepared for One Lap as we speak). Some of the things are optional to save the "average guy" a bit of money and the price will be competitive with what's out there currently. The nice thing about CNC is the design work is done only once. From there, they churn out repeatable perfect blocks every time with a minimum of expensive hand labor. That's what makes the optional features in the "full-on" version inexpensive. Features normally found outside $40k race engines.
We live in a great age! -Brian Nutter, Wiseco Piston
02-24-2006, 02:42 PM
#48
Brian was great to work with on this project. All of the companies involved were fantastic to work with. Once they got past the YOUR NUTS! and saw it could work, they really helped out.
Being able to have a 4.500" stroke with a 6.8" rod in a small block was hard to comprehend. This should definetly remove any skirt scuffing and poor rod angles that are common in the strokers. The reluctor wheel and piston notches for clearance are now a non issue.
The sleeves are a full .100" thick between the cylinders in the upper portion on a 4.20 bore and thicker in the thrust direction. The deckplate is 7075-T6 (same as the aluminum rocker arms) and is locked into the block and around the sleeves for support.
I'm sure the guys at S.A.M. will do a great job (as usual) in building and testing it. Maybe after the pump gas version Brian can make some high compression pistons and .....
Being able to have a 4.500" stroke with a 6.8" rod in a small block was hard to comprehend. This should definetly remove any skirt scuffing and poor rod angles that are common in the strokers. The reluctor wheel and piston notches for clearance are now a non issue.
The sleeves are a full .100" thick between the cylinders in the upper portion on a 4.20 bore and thicker in the thrust direction. The deckplate is 7075-T6 (same as the aluminum rocker arms) and is locked into the block and around the sleeves for support.
I'm sure the guys at S.A.M. will do a great job (as usual) in building and testing it. Maybe after the pump gas version Brian can make some high compression pistons and .....
02-24-2006, 03:45 PM
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Originally Posted by briannutter
Hello all, I had the honor of working with ERL on the 500 project. The manufacturers who contributed to this project are very excited about it. It was done right...the "clean sheet of paper" design allowed us to design parts without compromise, which is beneficial to everyone.
There was a comment about clearancing on the inside of the block. If you get a chance, shoot some photo's with the rods and pistons in it to show the folks. People will be suprised how little clearancing is necessary. Sounds impossible, but normal 4" stroker assemblies require more clearancing than this does. This keeps the crankcase very strong....no deep cuts close to water or oil passages.
To achieve what ERL achieved, the entire engine was modeled. The crank, rods, pistons, cam, and timing chain are all "rotate-able" in real-time. The rod to lobe and crankcase clearance was known before the prototype parts were even ordered....down to the thousandth. That made the intake manifold spacer design easy as well. What's really cool is to "rev" the model up. The assembly becomes a blur very quickly, just like a real engine.
The engine bays for F bodies, Vette's, SSR's, the GTO, and the trucks have been measured. Engine width with standard headers won't be an issue, the only unknown is the header to steering gear clearance. We'll find out about that soon enough....S.A.M. is fitting the engine into the tightest combination right now, so we'll see.
There are quite a few "special" features ERL has designed in. Little things that will make a seasoned engine builder say "I'll be damned". These features will make this a VERY durable engine....something you can put a lot of miles on. The "Superdeck 1" standard deck version incorporates these features as well. (One of those is being prepared for One Lap as we speak). Some of the things are optional to save the "average guy" a bit of money and the price will be competitive with what's out there currently. The nice thing about CNC is the design work is done only once. From there, they churn out repeatable perfect blocks every time with a minimum of expensive hand labor. That's what makes the optional features in the "full-on" version inexpensive. Features normally found outside $40k race engines.
We live in a great age! -Brian Nutter, Wiseco Piston
There was a comment about clearancing on the inside of the block. If you get a chance, shoot some photo's with the rods and pistons in it to show the folks. People will be suprised how little clearancing is necessary. Sounds impossible, but normal 4" stroker assemblies require more clearancing than this does. This keeps the crankcase very strong....no deep cuts close to water or oil passages.
To achieve what ERL achieved, the entire engine was modeled. The crank, rods, pistons, cam, and timing chain are all "rotate-able" in real-time. The rod to lobe and crankcase clearance was known before the prototype parts were even ordered....down to the thousandth. That made the intake manifold spacer design easy as well. What's really cool is to "rev" the model up. The assembly becomes a blur very quickly, just like a real engine.
The engine bays for F bodies, Vette's, SSR's, the GTO, and the trucks have been measured. Engine width with standard headers won't be an issue, the only unknown is the header to steering gear clearance. We'll find out about that soon enough....S.A.M. is fitting the engine into the tightest combination right now, so we'll see.
There are quite a few "special" features ERL has designed in. Little things that will make a seasoned engine builder say "I'll be damned". These features will make this a VERY durable engine....something you can put a lot of miles on. The "Superdeck 1" standard deck version incorporates these features as well. (One of those is being prepared for One Lap as we speak). Some of the things are optional to save the "average guy" a bit of money and the price will be competitive with what's out there currently. The nice thing about CNC is the design work is done only once. From there, they churn out repeatable perfect blocks every time with a minimum of expensive hand labor. That's what makes the optional features in the "full-on" version inexpensive. Features normally found outside $40k race engines.
We live in a great age! -Brian Nutter, Wiseco Piston
It is definately a great time to be in Motorsports! It has also been nice dealing with everyone on this project.
Brian, it has been a blast so far and I have had a great time talking with yourself and Jud from dinner and what not from PRI and other times. Anyways, I will shoot some pictures of the block to show the machining and clearancing ERL did to make our lifes easier. We also just recieved our intake spacers for the motor so some shots of those will also be up as well.
I will also get a few pics of the ls7 heads for the inquirer from earlier on in the thread. I am sure either myself or Brian can answer some questions on this motor. Everyone down here at S.A.M. says hello to you Brian.
Originally Posted by Quick Carl
I'm sure the guys at S.A.M. will do a great job (as usual) in building and testing it. Maybe after the pump gas version Brian can make some high compression pistons and .....
Regards
Gray Arrington
www.SAMracing.com
Last edited by BigBronco; 02-24-2006 at 03:51 PM.
02-24-2006, 05:40 PM
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I just took a few shots of the cylinder heads and the Intake spacers. I also got a shot of the block with the crank and what not out of it so you can see where ERL was clearancing for the rods.
Once again, ERL was right on the money with this thing.
Once again, ERL was right on the money with this thing.
02-25-2006, 05:07 PM
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Alrighty, here is the pictures of the Intake spacers and ls7 heads. Head is equipped with the 2.200 titanium intake valve and hollow stem exhaust valve.
Brian, I will have pics of the block clearancing on Monday! Have a good weekend Ladies and Gents!
Brian, I will have pics of the block clearancing on Monday! Have a good weekend Ladies and Gents!
02-25-2006, 05:11 PM
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Think the added port length will have any effect on the torque peak rpm? With 500" and an even longer intake path that motor is going to be able to pull houses, ha ha.
02-25-2006, 05:53 PM
#54
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500 ci. ....the clutch guys will be makin' some money in 06! 402's are a good time...kinda like the hottie at the corner bar. 427's are better....I remember my first time behind one of those. You'll have to ask Warren what it's like to drop the clutch behind a 500 incher though
02-25-2006, 11:53 PM
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I am very happy to see that SAM is still setting the bar with small blocks. Please keep us posted with the progress. And if you didn't already say this, what car is it going into? Send Jud my best and tell him to keep up the good work.
Last edited by TX Tahoe Z71; 04-08-2012 at 09:12 PM.
02-28-2006, 09:52 AM
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Originally Posted by slt200mph
Nice..very nice machine work..
Gray, I wish I were still down there instead of out here in the real world again
I'm sorta surprised about the stockish compression on the big inch motor. Are you guys talking about do Hot Rod's Pump Gas Drags or Drag Week or something along those lines in the black car?
And I'm REALLY interested in the orange car and the C5R! In fact, I just bought a Silverado that's almost the same color. When the warranty runs out on it, who knows what'll end up under the hood
Tell the folks down there that I said Hi!
02-28-2006, 10:54 AM
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Originally Posted by SmokeShow99SS
whats it cost for class
wow i need to go to school, Awsome work btw
wow i need to go to school, Awsome work btw
Definately shoot me a PM and I can get all of your questions answered about the school. I can also send you a information packet if you would like. Just let me know.
Regards,
Gray Arrington
P.S. Glad to see you are doing well out there Cheston. How has everything else been? Definately send me a PM as well and I can fill you in a little bit on the orange car. As for the black car, we are just putting along with it. The car would not survive very long in the pump gas drags competition. LOL
