LS4 Performance Grand Prix GXP | Monte Carlo SS | Impala SS | LaCrosse Super

Low Oil Level / High Oil consumption

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Sep 5, 2006 | 11:25 AM
  #1  
BuffaloSS's Avatar
Thread Starter
TECH Addict
iTrader: (3)
 
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 2,421
Likes: 0
From: Buffalo, NY
Default Low Oil Level / High Oil consumption

I know i've read elsewhere that others have had the same issue i am, but i figured i'd throw this out there again to see if it's more common than not with other 5.3L owners.

I've racked up 12,300 miles over the past 11 months. When i last changed my oil, i had gone about 4000+ mi and was nearing 10% on the Oil Life Monitor. By that time, i had lost at least a quart of oil. During that second oil change, i only re-filled 4.5 of the 6 qt bottles of oil. I figure at MOST 1/2qt was lost to the filter and to spillage/stuff stuck in the drain pan. I switched to Mobil1 on that 2nd oil change.

How many others are changing their own oil and seeing this? How many have had a dealer say you're low? How many check their oil regularly and see that they're lower than they should be?

I'm at 20% now (roughly 5000mi so far on this oil) and i know i've dropped from the 3rd (the highest) dot on the dipstick to the 1st (lowest). I hoped M1 would stand up better in this engine, but it's not.

Is this a cause for concern that i should bring up to my dealer?

Nissan just recalled TONS of 2.5L engines due to high oil consumption. Do you think this is bad enough to warrant such a panic?

[EDIT: Also, most of this mileage is City, stop-n-go driving. If i had to estimate the amount of highway driving i've done, i'd say it's less than 4000 of these miles]

Last edited by BuffaloSS; Sep 5, 2006 at 12:36 PM.
Reply
Old Sep 5, 2006 | 01:21 PM
  #2  
Mike's 01WS6's Avatar
Launching!
iTrader: (4)
 
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 250
Likes: 0
From: St. Peters Missouri
Default

As long as the oil will stay in the cross hatched area of the dipstick its normal.
Reply
Old Sep 5, 2006 | 11:47 PM
  #3  
BigMikeGXP's Avatar
Launching!
 
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 214
Likes: 0
From: Brandon, MS
Default

I had about 8500 miles on my last oil when the oil life monitor started warning me to change it. And right around that time the low oil level warning started coming on sometimes if I parked on a slope. When I changed it at around 9000 miles it was just barely touching the bottom of the dipstick. I still have the oil I took out... going to get around to measuring it and getting it tested here soon. Looks like about 5 quarts though.

I figure 1 quart in 9000 miles is not bad. Yours being low after 4000 miles is probably due to being mostly city driving. If I had to guess most of the oil consumption is probably through the pcv system.
Reply
Old Sep 6, 2006 | 08:19 AM
  #4  
SidewaysLS4's Avatar
Staging Lane
 
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 95
Likes: 0
From: Here
Default

Dont know if this helps, but a combo of city and occasional beating on it under the guise of 'tuning' mileage totalling some 2200 miles the oil level hasnt budged on the factory oil fill.
Reply
Old Sep 6, 2006 | 05:30 PM
  #5  
SDfbody's Avatar
On The Tree
 
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 139
Likes: 0
From: South Dakota
Default

Originally Posted by BigMikeGXP
I had about 8500 miles on my last oil when the oil life monitor started warning me to change it. And right around that time the low oil level warning started coming on sometimes if I parked on a slope. When I changed it at around 9000 miles it was just barely touching the bottom of the dipstick. I still have the oil I took out... going to get around to measuring it and getting it tested here soon. Looks like about 5 quarts though.

I figure 1 quart in 9000 miles is not bad. Yours being low after 4000 miles is probably due to being mostly city driving. If I had to guess most of the oil consumption is probably through the pcv system.

You don't change your oil for 9000 miles!? Damn, I change mine at least every 3000, usually around 2000 miles, and I use fully Mobil 1. Course it takes me about 2 - 3 months to get that many miles.
Reply
Old Sep 6, 2006 | 09:37 PM
  #6  
pgbSS's Avatar
Staging Lane
 
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 67
Likes: 0
From: p-town, Il
Default

I changed my oil for the first time last weekend at 3100mi, about 70% city, 30% highway. I dumped the filter oil into the drain pan and when I filled up the used oil bottles, it only filled up about 4-3/4 qt. I was very surprised. I checked the oil after first getting the car but never did again because I didn't think a new engine would consume any oil. I filled up with Mobile1 so I'm hoping the consumption won't be as bad. I guess I'll keep an eye on it.
Reply
Old Sep 6, 2006 | 11:25 PM
  #7  
BigMikeGXP's Avatar
Launching!
 
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 214
Likes: 0
From: Brandon, MS
Default

Originally Posted by SDfbody
You don't change your oil for 9000 miles!? Damn, I change mine at least every 3000, usually around 2000 miles, and I use fully Mobil 1. Course it takes me about 2 - 3 months to get that many miles.
Im gonna get it tested to see if that is a good interval or not. Thats how long it took the oil monitor to reach 0% oil life. I may start going for about 7000 since it does seem to consume a little oil.

One funny thing is that you get a warning on startup when you reach 5% oil life. After you reach 0% it quits warning you at all. Its like the computer gives up and figures you are never going to change it.
Reply
Old Sep 7, 2006 | 07:59 AM
  #8  
SidewaysLS4's Avatar
Staging Lane
 
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 95
Likes: 0
From: Here
Default

Originally Posted by BigMikeGXP
After you reach 0% it quits warning you at all. Its like the computer gives up and figures you are never going to change it.

Haha, I see these cars got smart. When I was in school I worked at a gas station and you should have seen all the mechanical mayhem from people not looking at or changing oil. Notable instances were the new caddy driven by an old lady, "change oil now" on the dashboard, 12K miles, and around 3-4 quarts low (nothing on the dipstick when checked). Probably never changed. And of course the numerious puzzled expressions when asking what that noise under the hood was and finding from me there was no oil in the engine a few times. I guess all those flashing lights on the dash must have been just suggestions to have the car serviced, eh? People leasing cars were the worst, I'd tell them they are about 3 quarts low and they would say "just put a quart in, it's a lease and I'm getting rid of it soon". After seeing all this (in a wealthier area no less, I'd hate to see what it would be like in poorer areas), I cannot see how people could buy a used car.

If I remember right GM extended the oil life monitor "lifespan" of the oil in the 2003 model year. So I figure in 5 years or so we will find out if that extended interval was good or if we will see lots of cars with low oil pressure from chewed up crank bearings when the oil breaks down and the filter starts bypassing due to being plugged full of crud due to a long change interval.
Reply
LS1 Tech Stories

The Best V8 Stories One Small Block at Time

story-0

Topdon ONE vs. Artidiag 800 BT2: Which is the Diagnostic Tablet For You?

 Pouria Savadkouei
story-1

Gas Monkey Built a 6-Wheel Ferrari Testarossa With a Corvette LT4 Engine

 Verdad Gallardo
story-2

7 Most Reliable High-Performance Engines GM Has Ever Built

 Verdad Gallardo
story-3

Amazing '71 Camaro Restomod Is Modern Muscle Car Under the Skin

 Verdad Gallardo
story-4

6 Common C5 Corvette Failures and What's Involved In Repairing Them

 Pouria Savadkouei
story-5

Retro Modern Bandit Pontiac Trans AM Comes With Burt Reynolds' Autograph

 Verdad Gallardo
story-6

Top 10 Greatest Cadillac V Series Performance Models Ever, Ranked

 Pouria Savadkouei
story-7

Top 10 Most Powerful Chevy Trucks Ever Made!

 
story-8

Hennessey's New Supercharged Silverado ZR2 Has 700 HP

 Verdad Gallardo
story-9

Coachbuilt N2A Anteros Is an LS2-Powered C6 Corvette In Italian Clothes

 Verdad Gallardo
Old Sep 7, 2006 | 08:39 AM
  #9  
BuffaloSS's Avatar
Thread Starter
TECH Addict
iTrader: (3)
 
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 2,421
Likes: 0
From: Buffalo, NY
Default

Originally Posted by pgbSS
I changed my oil for the first time last weekend at 3100mi, about 70% city, 30% highway. I dumped the filter oil into the drain pan and when I filled up the used oil bottles, it only filled up about 4-3/4 qt. I was very surprised. I checked the oil after first getting the car but never did again because I didn't think a new engine would consume any oil. I filled up with Mobile1 so I'm hoping the consumption won't be as bad. I guess I'll keep an eye on it.
I was in the same boat as you with this thinking. It's a brand new car...why should i be checking the oil all the time? If it breaks, it breaks!

I think i filled up about as much as you.

With M1 and all-city driving, i'm down about a qt right now with 20% on the OLM. However, it is noticeably (seemingly) cooler with the M1 (much less engine heat)
Reply
Old Sep 8, 2006 | 11:00 AM
  #10  
PunkerPontiac's Avatar
On The Tree
iTrader: (1)
 
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 109
Likes: 0
From: South Central PA
Default

ummm...guys...if you wait until your oil life monitor tells you to change it you are not very smart. I don't care what anyone says... 3,000 miles on my oil is the limit. I don't care if it synthetic or conventional. I'd rather spend the $11 (i work for a gm dealer so i get everything at cost) every 3,000 than go 6 or 7 thousand just to save that little amount of money (i would even if i had to pay full price). After all, it cheaper than buying a new motor or rebuilding the one i have.
Reply
Old Sep 11, 2006 | 12:39 AM
  #11  
BigMikeGXP's Avatar
Launching!
 
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 214
Likes: 0
From: Brandon, MS
Default

Originally Posted by PunkerPontiac
ummm...guys...if you wait until your oil life monitor tells you to change it you are not very smart. I don't care what anyone says... 3,000 miles on my oil is the limit. I don't care if it synthetic or conventional. I'd rather spend the $11 (i work for a gm dealer so i get everything at cost) every 3,000 than go 6 or 7 thousand just to save that little amount of money (i would even if i had to pay full price). After all, it cheaper than buying a new motor or rebuilding the one i have.
Its not about saving money... it is just pointless to change it when it doesn't need to be changed. Unless you go mud riding in you car or run your engine at 300*F I seriously doubt you are going to have engine wear problems.

Get a good oil and oil filter and everything will be fine. The rest of the car will tear up loooong before your engine fails due to excessive wear.
Reply
Old Oct 19, 2006 | 09:48 AM
  #12  
Kazmaniac's Avatar
TECH Fanatic
 
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,190
Likes: 0
Default

I use full synthetic Valvoline in my Camaro SS LS1, which gets 2,000 very hard miles a year. No problems, but looking at your intervals, mine is only a third of that. Although I've never seen a LT1 / LS1 powered Z28 or Z28SS blow blue smoke out the back either. We all know these cars weren't driven by grandma to church.

I use semi-synthetic Valvoline (Durablend?) in my MCSS, and changed it when it had 5,000 mines, and 60% left on the OCM. That's like an estimated 12K oil change interval - WOW! I probably do 95% highway getting around town.

I feel if you use the OCM as a guide, you should at least buy the good oil and filter. I use the NAPA Gold 1522 on both cars, which I think is an inch longer than the stock filters. Hopefully it helps with better filtration and more media. Cost is around $7.

Mobil 1 was THE oil in the 90's, but I was under the impression that Mobil 1 would tend to exaggerate any oiling issues / leaks. I agree that it's good oil, but I chose the Valvoline because of that issue. I'm sure they're "all the same" these days.

I will look at my situation more closely - thanks for the warning. I won't go the 12K w/o an oil change. I leased Imp's before this car, followed GM OCM recommendations, usually 9,000 miles, but never really felt good about it, but hey - the General said so. I'm thinking 6K w/ the Durablend is where I'm at.
Reply
Old Oct 19, 2006 | 11:17 AM
  #13  
Area47's Avatar
TECH Fanatic
 
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,732
Likes: 0
From: K.C.
Default

check the pcv system. i noticed mine was doing it too. seems to be the typical ls1 stuff. might want to invest in a catch can
Reply
Old Oct 19, 2006 | 03:08 PM
  #14  
bartonmd's Avatar
Teching In
 
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
Default

Just FWIW, I know this thread is old, but I'll tell you that you can actually change your oil too much, especially synthetic... Changing synthetic at anything under 3000 miles actually wears the engine out faster than changing synthetic every 10,000 miles, because the long-lasting additive packages in full synthetic oils activate with heat and time, so they don't fully activate until between 2 and 3000 miles... If you do oil analysis on different OCI's, you'll see that ~90% of the wear during an OCI comes during the first 1000-2000 miles, while the additives aren't yet active. If you don't believe me, do a search for the SAE test document titled something about "oil change intervals and effects" or something...

Mike
Reply
Old Oct 20, 2006 | 03:49 PM
  #15  
Mike's 01WS6's Avatar
Launching!
iTrader: (4)
 
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 250
Likes: 0
From: St. Peters Missouri
Default

Originally Posted by bartonmd
Just FWIW, I know this thread is old, but I'll tell you that you can actually change your oil too much, especially synthetic... Changing synthetic at anything under 3000 miles actually wears the engine out faster than changing synthetic every 10,000 miles, because the long-lasting additive packages in full synthetic oils activate with heat and time, so they don't fully activate until between 2 and 3000 miles... If you do oil analysis on different OCI's, you'll see that ~90% of the wear during an OCI comes during the first 1000-2000 miles, while the additives aren't yet active. If you don't believe me, do a search for the SAE test document titled something about "oil change intervals and effects" or something...

Mike
Put down the crack!
Reply
Old Oct 21, 2006 | 04:06 PM
  #16  
bartonmd's Avatar
Teching In
 
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
Default

Originally Posted by Mike's 01WS6
Put down the crack!
Sucks to find out you've been wasting your money AND being counter-productive, doesn't it?

being a degreed engineer, myself, I put a lot of stock in what a real-live SAE test report says.

What I said is true for synthetics, in particular, because the additive packages have to last longer than regular oil... Standard dino oil's additive packages only take in the 500 mile neighborhood to start working...

I'll post up a summary of the SAE report on Monday when I'm at my work computer, but I found the summary with a Google search, so it should be pretty easy to find... I think it was on a TDI forum...

Mike
Reply
Old Oct 22, 2006 | 08:50 AM
  #17  
bartonmd's Avatar
Teching In
 
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
Default

From here: http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2117291





I suggest some lite reading from http://www.sae.org "Title: Extended Oil Drain Intervals - Conservation of Resources Or Reduction of Engine Life (Part Ii)"
After reading that you may never change your oil again at even 10,000 miles!

There are millions of miles of oil analysis that not only prove short duration changes increase wear but also result in a lack of additive activation in the motor. If you own a Jiffy Lube then I would expect you to subscribe to the "3,000 mile Mentality" myth.

Oil addiitives are activated by heat and pressure. Due to the additives having to hold up over time ie longer than 10,000 miles the formulations take a certain period of time to become active in protecting the motor. Draining the oil at lets say 3,000 miles simply means the additives have just become active at the point you are draining your oil! In other words you are increasing wear by about 500% doing 3,000 mile drain intervals!

Oils that carry the extended drain ratings such as 506.01, 507.00 etc mean that the additives are formulated to remain active for periods up to 2 years, 40,000kms or 640 hours of usage. Oils like Mobil 1 0w40 are formulated to withstand 400F sump temps WITHOUT breaking down and losing viscosity. Furthermore the oils cannot break down due to the PAO makeup of the oil. These oils do not rely on elastomers like the conventional oils do. This means that the oil can fully protect your motor at any temperature without the conern of thermal break-down and thinning out of grade.

If you doubt the 10K oil change intervals perform an oil sample at 1,000 miles. Most cars with a fresh sump of oil will peak out at the 1,000 mile mark. After that the wear metals may increase by only 5-10% over the course of 10,000 miles! Nearly 90% of the engine wear occurs in the first 1,000 miles on an oil change! Increasing oil change frequency increases the duration your engine spends in the activation period of the additives and greatly increases the damage in your motor from failing to follow the guidlelines of the manufacturer.

Just looking at iron in a VW motor typical readings are around 20-35ppm after 15,000 miles of use maximum on a motor that has more than 60,000 miles. The oil filter is not capable of filtering this much metal simply because the wear metals are so small they can't be filtered from the oil. Also because there is so little wear metal you do not get wear as a result of the metal being suspended in the oil.

Dispersants require time to bond to the wear metals and byproducts in your engine oil. As byproducts such as soot (gasoline or diesel make soot just different sizes which discolor the oil) are created additives coat them and prevent them from clumping and becoming larger. Typical soot particles in diesel oil are in the nanometer range in terms of size 10 times smaller than what any bypass filter can even capture which is rated at 2 microns absolute. Your oil filter in your motor is rated at capturing particles in the 7 micron range with only a 75% first pass rating...Bottom line is your car would last forever if you change the oil every 20,000 miles and NEVER replace the oil filter simply because your motor is not making enough metal or by-products to ever get captured! Oils especially those for diesels can handle upwards of 8% soot, that my friend is a LOT of soot! to put that in perspective a typical motor after 25,000 miles without an oil change or filter change will only have 1% soot in the oil. This oil will appear tar black yet the oil still has 80% of its rated levels of protection remaining!

Most oils are limited by time in the sump rather than miles due to sulfur in the fuel. Most gasoline motors can safely go 2 years between changes when using quality oils formulated for extended drains such as Mobil 1 0w40 and Truck and SUV 5w40. These oils along with those sold as VW 506.01 have very high TBN ratings that neutralize acid formation for upwards of two years (1 year in diesels due to higher sulfur content wich causes the acids).

Heres the deal, forget the myths about frequent oil changes and basing your perceptions on how the oil looks. The best advice is use a quality oil and drain it at the specified interval. The worst thing you can do to a modern car is overmaintain it, yes this is possible due to the very specific regimine that VW engineers figured out to keep your car running at peak performance with maximum durability.

And check out here too: http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?p=885843

I have not read the "actual" SAE paper on it, because they want $10 to download it, but I've read several "summarys" that read almost exactly like this, so I'm not worried about it really... Plus, I couldn't post the report up on the 'net, because they are a bit sticky about copyright stuff...

Mike
Reply
Old Oct 22, 2006 | 06:05 PM
  #18  
eddiemoney's Avatar
TECH Enthusiast
iTrader: (2)
 
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 716
Likes: 0
From: Eastern Iowa
Default

I don't buy it, im not pushing my car past 5000K intervals.
Reply
Old Oct 23, 2006 | 02:17 AM
  #19  
Mike's 01WS6's Avatar
Launching!
iTrader: (4)
 
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 250
Likes: 0
From: St. Peters Missouri
Default

You cannot compare the stuff you read about VW TDI (diesel) engines to a gas engine, the oils are totally different.
Reply
Old Oct 23, 2006 | 06:48 AM
  #20  
bartonmd's Avatar
Teching In
 
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
Default

Originally Posted by Mike's 01WS6
You cannot compare the stuff you read about VW TDI (diesel) engines to a gas engine, the oils are totally different.
first off, no they aren't... They have SLIGHTLY different additive packages, but in fact, they are just simply harder on oil (turbocharged, more soot, longer run time while the engine is cold, higher (acid forming) sulfer content in the fuels, etc)

Second, it's an SAE test report on gasoline engines! This particular summary of the SAE test report on gasoline engines is just from a TDI forum!

Mike

Last edited by bartonmd; Oct 23, 2006 at 06:58 AM.
Reply



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:52 AM.

story-0
Topdon ONE vs. Artidiag 800 BT2: Which is the Diagnostic Tablet For You?

Slideshow: We take a close look at the ONE and Artidiag 800BT2 diagnostic tools from Topdon and the reasons to buy one over the other.

By Pouria Savadkouei | 2026-05-28 11:05:11


VIEW MORE
story-1
Gas Monkey Built a 6-Wheel Ferrari Testarossa With a Corvette LT4 Engine

Slideshow: The controversial Ferrari F6 swaps its original flat-12 for a Corvette Z06-derived LT4 V8 and sends power to four rear wheels through a custom-built drivetrain.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-05-26 18:23:54


VIEW MORE
story-2
7 Most Reliable High-Performance Engines GM Has Ever Built

Slideshow:These GM engines didn't just make huge power, they survived abuse, boost, track days, and six-digit mileage with a reputation for refusing to quit.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-05-21 16:45:27


VIEW MORE
story-3
Amazing '71 Camaro Restomod Is Modern Muscle Car Under the Skin

Slideshow: This heavily modified 1971 Camaro mixes classic muscle car styling with a fifth-generation Camaro interior and modern LS3 power.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-05-12 18:06:42


VIEW MORE
story-4
6 Common C5 Corvette Failures and What's Involved In Repairing Them

Slideshow: From wobbling harmonic balancers to failed EBCMs, these are the issues that define long-term C5 ownership and what repairs typically involve.

By Pouria Savadkouei | 2026-05-07 18:44:57


VIEW MORE
story-5
Retro Modern Bandit Pontiac Trans AM Comes With Burt Reynolds' Autograph

Slideshow: A modern Camaro transformed into a retro icon, this limited-run "Bandit" build blends nostalgia with brute force in a way few revivals manage.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-04-21 13:57:02


VIEW MORE
story-6
Top 10 Greatest Cadillac V Series Performance Models Ever, Ranked

Slideshow: Cadillac didn't just crash the high-performance luxury vehicle party, it showed up loud, supercharged, and occasionally a little unhinged...

By Pouria Savadkouei | 2026-04-16 10:05:15


VIEW MORE
story-7
Top 10 Most Powerful Chevy Trucks Ever Made!

Slideshow: Top ten most powerful Chevy trucks ever made

By | 2026-03-25 09:22:26


VIEW MORE
story-8
Hennessey's New Supercharged Silverado ZR2 Has 700 HP

Slideshow: Hennessey has turned the Silverado ZR2 into a 700-hp off-road monster with supercharged V8 power and a limited production run.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-03-24 18:57:52


VIEW MORE
story-9
Coachbuilt N2A Anteros Is an LS2-Powered C6 Corvette In Italian Clothes

Slideshow: A one-off sports car that looks like a vintage Italian exotic-but hides a C6 Corvette underneath-just sold for the price of a new mid-engine Corvette.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-03-23 18:53:41


VIEW MORE