WS Sick

I amallways amazed at people when they think they can just clean something up and reuse it, I once walked into a friends garage as he was doing this exact thing, he was just cleaing up the piston ring lands and pressing the rod bolts in on his 5 ton press. I asked him if he was going to resize the big end, he said naaw the motor didnt spin a bearing. He thought it would be ok just to cycle the bolts a few time a peice in a rod vice!! we took one he was putting the bearing halves in and clamped it down, the variation from at the parting line to the center of the saddle was .002 something!!! He was convinced.

fex77k

iTrader: (2)

We can laugh and let them gamble. This is one of the most critical areas in the motor, I never half *** this part and I always measure.

quik95lt1

iTrader: (7)

exactly.....i treat every motor the same when it comes to building......the same detail and procedures i use on a 8krpm race motor are the same procedures i use on a 250hp truck motor.......if its not perfect i wont let it leave.....done end of story......

Melkor

Anyone who thinks you can change bolts, or even the clamping load and not effect the bore diameter, has never tried and quantified those results with a dial bore gauge.
Everything is a spring... to some extent or another.

fex77k

iTrader: (2)

I checked the both ends on the rods for my 396 and 388 LT1, On the LQ9 build I didn't want to mess with the small end since it has a special grove cut into it. I had to send the pistons back since the sent the wrong pins and pistons. Checked the big ends and put in some new Clevite HD bearings, ARP rod bolts new pistons and called it good.
I've seen the dirt track guys run some pretty wore out combinations, I've even seen a piston that was so loose that you could rock it back in forth in the hole. Being a tightwad is always going to cost you. I figure if I want to put money into a motor it is never a waste to have a solid and reliable bottom end to keep me from wasting the top end.

WS Sick

In my experience, the rod bearings are usually what goes out (or rod bolts in some cases) so why would you compromise this particular area. I myself have run some stupid piston clearances, but I don't like running old rod bolts and untouched rods.

quik95lt1

iTrader: (7)

heres a pic of the bearings out of my race motor at 500 passes and 4k miles on the street.......the car saw 8000+rpm every pass and everytime i took it on the street.........the bearings looked so good i wanted to put them back in lol


my housings are within a tenth of where they should be......just like any other one ive built.......its just not a space to skimp like you said ws sick.......these bearings show whats supose to happen

gregrob

iTrader: (8)

You went 500 passes in one year? Or reused the bearings?

Like it or not Mike the Katech rod bolts work. Installed the way they recommend and if the engine is healthy to begin with they will work as intended. ARPs I would not trust without resizing.

I respect that its not the way you prefer to do things, but that doesn't mean there's a fundamental reason why it won't work.

quik95lt1

iTrader: (7)

500 passes in 2 years...and no i replaced the bearings as nice as they looked lol...........and yea im not making ANY assumptions about the katech bolts.....ive never used them so i cant make a call on those.......i was more speaking about the arps........

gregrob

iTrader: (8)

Agreed

WS Sick

I'm hazy here listening to this conversation, am I to understand it correctly that the LS rods do not distort when used? Are the rods in question the facture style?

I can see being reluctant to reman a faracture rod and you have to establice a level plane on both mating surfaces before the trueing of the big end hole is made.
I'm just curious.

gregrob

iTrader: (8)

LS rods are a different design and this can be done successfully with the correct rod bolts. Always resize a Gen 1 / LT rod

WS Sick

Thank you, I have not been able to look an LS over very good, I'm still pidling with this old crap...lol

prokaw875

Bringing this back from the dead but I am in a little situation and don't know what path to take. Im doing a BUDGET junkyard 5.3 Gen III build (99-03) in my Honda S2000 and have done all the normal stuff. Fresh decked heads, pushrods, dual valvetrain, LJMS turbo 2 cam, ARP headstuds, LS9 gaskets, new mahle rings, mahle rod bearings, fresh cyclinder hone, blah blah blah.


I have the motor all together except the torqueing of the rod bolts, (the crank was never removed and is 65,000 mile factory). I was having some issues getting the exact 15lbft plus 75 * torque specs on the rod bolts so now I am at the point where some of the rod bolts I have torqued and untorqued 3 times.


1. Just run the bolts I have torqued several times and get as close to the 15+75 that I can.
2. Buy new OEM rod bolts (Which im having trouble finding a source for these)
3. Buy ARP studs and pull apart the entire motor to resize the big ends (really REALLY don't want to pull apart the motor and have the rods honed)

moehorsepower

iTrader: (3)

[QUOTE=96capricemgr;16282686]The thing is people don't understand "things we get away with" vs. "doing it right"

^^^ Key words, getting away with it (ticking time bomb) vs doing it right.(longevity)

Brother Miller

I just had my 84 tbird 5.0 rods resized on the big ends and the small ends machined for floating wrist pins.

The machine shop said to save me money that I could install the new ARP rod bolts.

I will have to get the old rod bolts out as he used them to clamp the rod cap I guess when he resized them.

Am I going to be safe in changing my rod bolts with the old ones used to resize the big ends?

Or do I need to carry my rods back with the new ARP rod bolts for him to redo his resizing job with new rod bolts?

Thanks for any info. Just want my motor right.

Again thanks.

Steven.

Vicious95Z28

iTrader: (1)

I'm pretty sure they have to be resized with the rod bolts you're planning to use. The torque spec on an ARP bolt to get correct bolt stretch is different than the stock bolts. Even now after resizing you'd run into the same issue, the rods must be resized with they bolts you plan to use.

Brother Miller

I figured that. Thanks for the info