Ported intake on my setup. Yay or nay?
Ported intake on my setup. Yay or nay? Here are the motor specs
383 Stroker
Mahle -16CC dished pistons, 4340 H-beams and Crank, ARP Hardware, Moroso 7qt oil pan and sheild. AFR 210 headswith 57cc chambers, 1.6 roller rockers, upgraded spring package. GM847 Cam. Deleted AC, MSD OVC wire set.
The motor currently has a stock 1993 intake and throttle body sitting on it. Since the car is a 1994, the fuel lines are jacked up (they have to cross over the exhaust manifold to connect). I picked up a 1995 LT1 intake, throttle body, and fuel rail setup for 60 bucks. No too shabby.
I'm going to have everything cleaned and blasted in order to hyave it painted.... but should I also look at having it ported with my setup? I know that its been beaten to death... but would I benefit at this point from a ported intake and larger throttle body?
Let me know your thoughts.
383 Stroker
Mahle -16CC dished pistons, 4340 H-beams and Crank, ARP Hardware, Moroso 7qt oil pan and sheild. AFR 210 headswith 57cc chambers, 1.6 roller rockers, upgraded spring package. GM847 Cam. Deleted AC, MSD OVC wire set.
The motor currently has a stock 1993 intake and throttle body sitting on it. Since the car is a 1994, the fuel lines are jacked up (they have to cross over the exhaust manifold to connect). I picked up a 1995 LT1 intake, throttle body, and fuel rail setup for 60 bucks. No too shabby.
I'm going to have everything cleaned and blasted in order to hyave it painted.... but should I also look at having it ported with my setup? I know that its been beaten to death... but would I benefit at this point from a ported intake and larger throttle body?
Let me know your thoughts.
OP - what is your expected HP level? In all likelihood it probably won't be worthwhile, but if you're looking for every last HP and $ is expendible then go for it.
AI actually recommended against me porting my intake but I opted for it anyway. Whether or not it helped my numbers is yet to be determined.
Expected HP level?
Not sure to be perfectly honest LOL. I just wanted a strong running 383.
The car came with a 383 stroker in it, but crappy I beams, a cast eagle crank, and VERY lightly ported stock heads. Long story short, the crank went, and I had the motor rebuilt, splayed to a 4 bolt, and a proper crank/rods/pistons put in. I didnt have the money to do heads last year when that all happened. SO, i bought a set of used AFR 210s, (set up for a solid roller cam) and had them re-done and milled. After the re-build, the car put down something like 342RWHP and 352 ftlbs of torque through an A4 with a 3200 stall. I guess i'd be happy with a solid 400 HP and around that in torque after the heads are on. The shop thats doing the work is installing the heads, my fresh intake, and re-tuning it on the dyno.
I would honestly rather start saving for a rear end if the intake isn't going to be that beneficial. The short block was set up for Nitrous, should I want to spray it in the future. I my also stick some money in the fuel system... AFAIK it has a stock pump. It DOES have lucas 42pph injectors, but I was going to buy a racetronix pump/hotwire kit plus the Speed inc fuel line relocation.... i think that may be the better place to put the money for right now.
Any ideas what I SHOULD expect out of this combo?
Not sure to be perfectly honest LOL. I just wanted a strong running 383.
The car came with a 383 stroker in it, but crappy I beams, a cast eagle crank, and VERY lightly ported stock heads. Long story short, the crank went, and I had the motor rebuilt, splayed to a 4 bolt, and a proper crank/rods/pistons put in. I didnt have the money to do heads last year when that all happened. SO, i bought a set of used AFR 210s, (set up for a solid roller cam) and had them re-done and milled. After the re-build, the car put down something like 342RWHP and 352 ftlbs of torque through an A4 with a 3200 stall. I guess i'd be happy with a solid 400 HP and around that in torque after the heads are on. The shop thats doing the work is installing the heads, my fresh intake, and re-tuning it on the dyno.
I would honestly rather start saving for a rear end if the intake isn't going to be that beneficial. The short block was set up for Nitrous, should I want to spray it in the future. I my also stick some money in the fuel system... AFAIK it has a stock pump. It DOES have lucas 42pph injectors, but I was going to buy a racetronix pump/hotwire kit plus the Speed inc fuel line relocation.... i think that may be the better place to put the money for right now.
Any ideas what I SHOULD expect out of this combo?
That is going to be rather low compression for a NA LT1.
The rest of the combination is still so poor I would not bother with spending money on porting the intake. If you want to spend more, spend it on resolving something like the low compression.
The rest of the combination is still so poor I would not bother with spending money on porting the intake. If you want to spend more, spend it on resolving something like the low compression.
Still so poor? Elaborate?
And it works out to 10.5:1 compression. I went as far as I could on the heads, and I'm running a .026 head gasket. I don't see it as a huge deal (mabey i'm wrong)
I mean, I'm not looking to make HUGE power N/A. I want something decent. at 10.5:1 I figure I could either spray it, or throw a blower at it at some point and run a bit of boost. Its also a plus to be able to run on pump gas.
What is so wrong with the motor?
And it works out to 10.5:1 compression. I went as far as I could on the heads, and I'm running a .026 head gasket. I don't see it as a huge deal (mabey i'm wrong)
I mean, I'm not looking to make HUGE power N/A. I want something decent. at 10.5:1 I figure I could either spray it, or throw a blower at it at some point and run a bit of boost. Its also a plus to be able to run on pump gas.
What is so wrong with the motor?
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Still so poor? Elaborate?
And it works out to 10.5:1 compression. I went as far as I could on the heads, and I'm running a .026 head gasket. I don't see it as a huge deal (mabey i'm wrong)
I mean, I'm not looking to make HUGE power N/A. I want something decent. at 10.5:1 I figure I could either spray it, or throw a blower at it at some point and run a bit of boost. Its also a plus to be able to run on pump gas.
What is so wrong with the motor?
And it works out to 10.5:1 compression. I went as far as I could on the heads, and I'm running a .026 head gasket. I don't see it as a huge deal (mabey i'm wrong)
I mean, I'm not looking to make HUGE power N/A. I want something decent. at 10.5:1 I figure I could either spray it, or throw a blower at it at some point and run a bit of boost. Its also a plus to be able to run on pump gas.
What is so wrong with the motor?
.Your compression is just about stock, and with our reverse cooling we can safely run ~12:1 on pump gas. Pistons should be flat tops, -5cc,not a big 16cc dish. Your cam choice is old technology, and a custom grind will make similar power with better street manners.
Heads are fine for your goals. I would port the stock intake just to make it match your AFRs ports better.
Last edited by Puck; Apr 11, 2013 at 06:38 PM.
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I don't think it would hurt your situation......in the right hands its prob worth a few......I ported my stock intake on my old 355 combo (out of the box TFS 195's, an AI cam similar to the 847 and 11.3:1 CR) and I picked up about 10 to the tire.....AI did the inlet porting on it and I did the rest.......ran well
Still so poor? Elaborate?
And it works out to 10.5:1 compression. I went as far as I could on the heads, and I'm running a .026 head gasket. I don't see it as a huge deal (mabey i'm wrong)
I mean, I'm not looking to make HUGE power N/A. I want something decent. at 10.5:1 I figure I could either spray it, or throw a blower at it at some point and run a bit of boost. Its also a plus to be able to run on pump gas.
What is so wrong with the motor?
And it works out to 10.5:1 compression. I went as far as I could on the heads, and I'm running a .026 head gasket. I don't see it as a huge deal (mabey i'm wrong)
I mean, I'm not looking to make HUGE power N/A. I want something decent. at 10.5:1 I figure I could either spray it, or throw a blower at it at some point and run a bit of boost. Its also a plus to be able to run on pump gas.
What is so wrong with the motor?
The LT4 was 10.8:1 so you are shooting for lower than this engine was available with stock. Yet not low enough for decent boost use. Just plain dong things wrong.....................
I will agree. The motor is a pretty mismatched combination. Porting the intake will not be worth your time. Before porting the intake I would try to find a better cam for your horribly low N/A compression. The valve events on that 847 are nowhere near ideal for what you have. In my opinion right now you are stuck trying to polish a turd. A harsh reality. Another option, change the heads to lower the compression and put some boost on it.
I could always use a stock thickness gasket and boost it.
with a .041 gasket i would have 10:1 compression.
What would you consider a decent cam for this setup? I know there are TONS of haters when it comes to the GM847 cam.... I like the sound and the power it produces. Remember, this isn't an all out race car here..... i cruise in it normally, and it sees the track literally twice a year if I'm lucky.
with a .041 gasket i would have 10:1 compression.
What would you consider a decent cam for this setup? I know there are TONS of haters when it comes to the GM847 cam.... I like the sound and the power it produces. Remember, this isn't an all out race car here..... i cruise in it normally, and it sees the track literally twice a year if I'm lucky.
I could always use a stock thickness gasket and boost it.
with a .041 gasket i would have 10:1 compression.
What would you consider a decent cam for this setup? I know there are TONS of haters when it comes to the GM847 cam.... I like the sound and the power it produces. Remember, this isn't an all out race car here..... i cruise in it normally, and it sees the track literally twice a year if I'm lucky.
with a .041 gasket i would have 10:1 compression.
What would you consider a decent cam for this setup? I know there are TONS of haters when it comes to the GM847 cam.... I like the sound and the power it produces. Remember, this isn't an all out race car here..... i cruise in it normally, and it sees the track literally twice a year if I'm lucky.
using a thick gasket to lower compression is bad for quench.
Really expensive to think you have a clue and only ask questions once it is too late
I don't know everything, but here are a couple of things I have found:
1) If you don't cut the top off the manifold, your wasting your time porting it. There is so little to gain you would never see it on the race track. There is a lot more found working at a more generous runner entry in the plenum than anywhere else but port match at the heads. Unless you just need a lot more cross section (not much material there for that) for a big, high RPM engine, I have not found much in the area between the entry and port match on my flow bench.
2) The bigger the cam, the more static compression you want. As these guys have said, that cam likes at least 11.5-1 to 12.0-1. Even the LT4 "Hot" cam (not really much hot about that cam. LOL) likes 11.5-1. The factory B body head gaskets are my reccomendation. Either those, or the .028" Cometic gaskets.
I'm assuming your pistons are a few thou below the deck? .040" total deck is plenty safe. My old 383" has a total deck of .036", no carbon build up there. :-)
I would run no more than .040". There is power there.
3) That cam makes power with good heads and compression. The guy that bought my driven every day for two years blue printed 355" short block bolted the 847 cam in, with a set of Lloyd's LT1 heads on it, and made 455 rwhp. I don't think it's a dog. I would not put it in a street driven B body.
Not trying to argue or offend, just sharing what I have found.
1) If you don't cut the top off the manifold, your wasting your time porting it. There is so little to gain you would never see it on the race track. There is a lot more found working at a more generous runner entry in the plenum than anywhere else but port match at the heads. Unless you just need a lot more cross section (not much material there for that) for a big, high RPM engine, I have not found much in the area between the entry and port match on my flow bench.
2) The bigger the cam, the more static compression you want. As these guys have said, that cam likes at least 11.5-1 to 12.0-1. Even the LT4 "Hot" cam (not really much hot about that cam. LOL) likes 11.5-1. The factory B body head gaskets are my reccomendation. Either those, or the .028" Cometic gaskets.
I'm assuming your pistons are a few thou below the deck? .040" total deck is plenty safe. My old 383" has a total deck of .036", no carbon build up there. :-)
I would run no more than .040". There is power there.
3) That cam makes power with good heads and compression. The guy that bought my driven every day for two years blue printed 355" short block bolted the 847 cam in, with a set of Lloyd's LT1 heads on it, and made 455 rwhp. I don't think it's a dog. I would not put it in a street driven B body.
Not trying to argue or offend, just sharing what I have found.
Last edited by Ed Wright; Apr 14, 2013 at 09:35 AM.
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That cam makes power with good heads and compression. The guy that bought my driven every day for two years blue printed 355" short block bolted the 847 cam in, with a set of Lloyd's LT1 heads on it, and made 455 rwhp. I don't think it's a dog. I would not put it in a street driven B body.
Not trying to argue or offend, just sharing what I have found.
Not trying to argue or offend, just sharing what I have found.
Ed, 455 RWHP from a 355 c.i. LT1 running a hydralic roller GM 847 cam is VERY impressive! Two (2) quick questions:
1) What RPM did peak HP come in at? And,
2) What was the static compression ratio on that motor?
First off, I want to apologize to the OP for stealing his thread for just this one (1) post, but .......
Ed, 455 RWHP from a 355 c.i. LT1 running a hydralic roller GM 847 cam is VERY impressive! Two (2) quick questions:
1) What RPM did peak HP come in at? And,
2) What was the static compression ratio on that motor?
Ed, 455 RWHP from a 355 c.i. LT1 running a hydralic roller GM 847 cam is VERY impressive! Two (2) quick questions:
1) What RPM did peak HP come in at? And,
2) What was the static compression ratio on that motor?
Sad to see someone stick a bottom of the catalog cam in a bone stock 150k shortblock, bolt on some local no-name ported heads, only spin it to 6k, and make 350rwhp through an M6...then vehemently defend their poor decisions since its just a "budget build".
I'm willing to bet that 355 he is talking about had more time assembling and checking clearances in it then most shops spend prepping and assembling strokers...and it shows
. First off, I want to apologize to the OP for stealing his thread for just this one (1) post, but .......
Ed, 455 RWHP from a 355 c.i. LT1 running a hydralic roller GM 847 cam is VERY impressive! Two (2) quick questions:
1) What RPM did peak HP come in at? And,
2) What was the static compression ratio on that motor?
Ed, 455 RWHP from a 355 c.i. LT1 running a hydralic roller GM 847 cam is VERY impressive! Two (2) quick questions:
1) What RPM did peak HP come in at? And,
2) What was the static compression ratio on that motor?