weird knocking sound...
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Teching In
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weird knocking sound... While I was out cruising a while back, I felt the urge to run it through some gears before going home and got to the end of 2nd gear when I saw my oil pressure drop to 0psi, I immediately let off the gas and coasted to a parking lot about 1/4 mile away then had a friend grab my jeep from my house and tow my car home. The car sat in my garage for about a year til I finally decided to tear into it to find the oil pump driveshaft was broken so I replaced it along with a new oil pump while I was in there. When I went to start it, I noticed It had developed a knock/tap towards the front of the engine. I took my valve covers off and I can hear the noise from the front around the #2 cyl. My dad thought it sounded like rocker noise and when I went to adjust the roller rockers with the engine running, I noticed something very interesting..... the noise goes away as I'm tightening the exhaust rocker on #2 but comes back after ~10 seconds.
At first I thought my cam bearings were causing the noise but the fact that the noise goes away while tightening the rocker makes me lean towards a bad lifter.
What do you guys think? Would a cam bearing knock go away like that by tightening the rocker??
Thanks in advance! and fingers crossed its just lifters lol
At first I thought my cam bearings were causing the noise but the fact that the noise goes away while tightening the rocker makes me lean towards a bad lifter.
What do you guys think? Would a cam bearing knock go away like that by tightening the rocker??
Thanks in advance! and fingers crossed its just lifters lol
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Did you check for a collapsed lifter? I know they can sound similar to that. And it'd make me lean that way since you say the noise goes away when you tighten the rocker.
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Oil pump drive shaft broken? Ain't that a solid piece of steel? Wow. I've heard of the pump housing breaking but never a shaft. I've read posts on a major after market supplier of oil pumps had thinned the housing (MOROSO ?).
Thx for the video and sharing as it helps us all. If the lifter continues to need adj then usually a wiped lobe that is grinding down. I see u adj all the vlvs yourself. Can i ask how u determined zero lash? Did u tighten the nut until the p-rod started to drag as u roll your fingers? Or tighten until the sound stopped?
Only items that would required re-adj is the lock nut is not locking or the lobe is wiped. A hyd lifter only has so much adj before bottoming out.
cardo
Thx for the video and sharing as it helps us all. If the lifter continues to need adj then usually a wiped lobe that is grinding down. I see u adj all the vlvs yourself. Can i ask how u determined zero lash? Did u tighten the nut until the p-rod started to drag as u roll your fingers? Or tighten until the sound stopped?
Only items that would required re-adj is the lock nut is not locking or the lobe is wiped. A hyd lifter only has so much adj before bottoming out.
cardo
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Thx for your honesty. My opinion is the noise adjustment method can't possibly be accurate enough and the cause of a lot of vlv train damage.
I think u need to pull the intake and examine that lobe/lifter - this will verify source.
Too many old timers use the noise method and encourage or sometimes literally harass new enthusiasts to use noise for lifter adjustment. The only time that could possibly be successful to use is with solid lifters and at one time all lifters where solid - long, long, long ago.
If u look in any shop/maintenance manual it will describe using your fingers to roll the p-rod as u tighten the lock nut until it just starts to drag = zero lash, then tighten 1/4 to 1 full turn for the adjustment (engine running or not). How anyone can think every lifter will stop making noise at the same position is just denial. Too much peer pressure here on the forums to use the "noise" method but its not only their own vlv trains they're destroying but others too.
cardo
I think u need to pull the intake and examine that lobe/lifter - this will verify source.
Too many old timers use the noise method and encourage or sometimes literally harass new enthusiasts to use noise for lifter adjustment. The only time that could possibly be successful to use is with solid lifters and at one time all lifters where solid - long, long, long ago.
If u look in any shop/maintenance manual it will describe using your fingers to roll the p-rod as u tighten the lock nut until it just starts to drag = zero lash, then tighten 1/4 to 1 full turn for the adjustment (engine running or not). How anyone can think every lifter will stop making noise at the same position is just denial. Too much peer pressure here on the forums to use the "noise" method but its not only their own vlv trains they're destroying but others too.
cardo
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Thats not true. Others have come forward to say so but there's a small bunch here that can't debate without profanity and it intimidates many. Just look on any cam mfrs w/s, heres Comps: Adjusting pre-load:
Turn the engine in the normal direction of rotation. Start with cylinder number one (1). When the exhaust valve begins to move, adjust the intake valve to the correct pre-load. To reach zero, take the pushrod between your finger tips and move it up and down while you tighten down the rocker arm. Once you feel no more vertical slack, you are at zero pre-load.
Why do u think Comp Cams says that??? Do u think Comp Cams is intentionaly instructing the wrong way to adj hyd lifters??? Is Comp dummer than the half dozen bad mouths on this forum???
Wake up. Or try to explain how using noise is more accurate than rolling the p-rod with fingers? Its nearly the same effort so why not do it right? Can't u read post after post week after week someone trashed their vlv train due to bad lifter adjustment? Don't u care or are u too self righteous to care 'bout others?
cardo
Turn the engine in the normal direction of rotation. Start with cylinder number one (1). When the exhaust valve begins to move, adjust the intake valve to the correct pre-load. To reach zero, take the pushrod between your finger tips and move it up and down while you tighten down the rocker arm. Once you feel no more vertical slack, you are at zero pre-load.
Why do u think Comp Cams says that??? Do u think Comp Cams is intentionaly instructing the wrong way to adj hyd lifters??? Is Comp dummer than the half dozen bad mouths on this forum???
Wake up. Or try to explain how using noise is more accurate than rolling the p-rod with fingers? Its nearly the same effort so why not do it right? Can't u read post after post week after week someone trashed their vlv train due to bad lifter adjustment? Don't u care or are u too self righteous to care 'bout others?
cardo
Whether you use sight, sound, or feel to adjust the rockers it shouldn't matter. All three are senses that can be interpreted differently. Some people complain that you have to do it by feel. Others claim feel isn't enough and you have to do it by ear.
I watched a guy build a Ford 9" rear center section (mine, actually) by hand, without the use of dial indicators, torque wrenches, calipers, ANYTHING. I was a bit skeptical until he showed me his list of customers. He builds an average of 600 center sections per year. He's been doing it for 40 years - it was actually quite amazing watching him work. He told me "if you know you are a shoe size 10.5 but the shoe store says you're a 9, who are you going to believe?"
Whether you use sight or sound is personal preference. Some are good at one while horrible at another. I've used both with good results. I suggest you try them both and see what happens. You learn by experience, NOT BY BURYING YOUR HEAD IN A DAVID VIZARD BOOK.
Comp recommends their procedure specifically to cater to retards like cardo who lack perception and ability. Having said that, I'd love to see him around a pair of ****.
I watched a guy build a Ford 9" rear center section (mine, actually) by hand, without the use of dial indicators, torque wrenches, calipers, ANYTHING. I was a bit skeptical until he showed me his list of customers. He builds an average of 600 center sections per year. He's been doing it for 40 years - it was actually quite amazing watching him work. He told me "if you know you are a shoe size 10.5 but the shoe store says you're a 9, who are you going to believe?"
Whether you use sight or sound is personal preference. Some are good at one while horrible at another. I've used both with good results. I suggest you try them both and see what happens. You learn by experience, NOT BY BURYING YOUR HEAD IN A DAVID VIZARD BOOK.
Comp recommends their procedure specifically to cater to retards like cardo who lack perception and ability. Having said that, I'd love to see him around a pair of ****.
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Thats not true. Others have come forward to say so but there's a small bunch here that can't debate without profanity and it intimidates many. Just look on any cam mfrs w/s, heres Comps: Adjusting pre-load:
Turn the engine in the normal direction of rotation. Start with cylinder number one (1). When the exhaust valve begins to move, adjust the intake valve to the correct pre-load. To reach zero, take the pushrod between your finger tips and move it up and down while you tighten down the rocker arm. Once you feel no more vertical slack, you are at zero pre-load.
Why do u think Comp Cams says that??? Do u think Comp Cams is intentionaly instructing the wrong way to adj hyd lifters??? Is Comp dummer than the half dozen bad mouths on this forum???
Wake up. Or try to explain how using noise is more accurate than rolling the p-rod with fingers? Its nearly the same effort so why not do it right? Can't u read post after post week after week someone trashed their vlv train due to bad lifter adjustment? Don't u care or are u too self righteous to care 'bout others?
cardo
Turn the engine in the normal direction of rotation. Start with cylinder number one (1). When the exhaust valve begins to move, adjust the intake valve to the correct pre-load. To reach zero, take the pushrod between your finger tips and move it up and down while you tighten down the rocker arm. Once you feel no more vertical slack, you are at zero pre-load.
Why do u think Comp Cams says that??? Do u think Comp Cams is intentionaly instructing the wrong way to adj hyd lifters??? Is Comp dummer than the half dozen bad mouths on this forum???
Wake up. Or try to explain how using noise is more accurate than rolling the p-rod with fingers? Its nearly the same effort so why not do it right? Can't u read post after post week after week someone trashed their vlv train due to bad lifter adjustment? Don't u care or are u too self righteous to care 'bout others?
cardo
I'm not saying that its better to do the adjustment by sound, but it IS a heck of a lot quicker and easier. I would wager a guess that THOUSANDS of LT-1 owners have adjsuted rockers like this and have never had a valvetrain part fail because of it. But that logic ******* escapes you. OOPS, there I go intimidating people again.
OP- Make your own mind up. Look at all the threads where Card0 has injected his opinion on this, and make your own mind up. IMHO, there is nothing wrong with adjusting by sound. This is the opinion of throusands of people who adjust rockers, not just LT-1 owners. So I guess that Mr. "by the ******* book" knows all, and what Ive done to my engines (since I started messing with vlavetrains years ago, with ZERO FAILURES i might add) was so wrong that it must be a christmas miracal that I haven't blown **** up yet. My god, I must be blessed! Now if you don't mind, I'm going to buy a lottery ticket.
If I followed instructions to the letter with all the misprints half the **** I own wouldn't ever work. I also trust "The Pro's" to know what they are doing when I dont. Fact is of the two things I have had built by "Pro's" Both have failed now multiple times. Just because they build the part does not mean they have a clue on how to use it or apply it. They know theory not reality. I don't see comp assembling someones valve train everyday. Because of that I would trust "Some Guy" that uses it and makes it work everyday over the manufacture. Use what works
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Teching In
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I know how to adjust my valvetrain both by feel and ear....just thought it was faster doing it by ear for what I was trying to do. I'll take my intake off tonight or maybe tomorrow and upload pics of my lifter. Any other opinions on what it could be from hearing the video. I also checked the oil and see no shavings at all and its squirting a good amount of oil from the rockers.
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U got it wrong again. Retards can't follow instructions because they can't read plain english and they have to use profanity to explain themselves. SMH too.
Who said a thing 'bout D. Vizard?? I quoted Comp Cams. How 'bout my GM maintenance manual? Pretty much the same method. Oh its the butt hurt clown that trashed his Golen block and blames it on Golen is sharing his hack experiences again. He hates facts. Yeh man bet he does it by smell too cause his post really stinks.
Plenty of clowns here that insist on the noise method even though we can read someone has vlv train noise/problems at least every week here. The truth is the OP used it and now has at least a trashed lifter. Too many new enthusiasts posting lifter problems to ignore it.
cardo
Who said a thing 'bout D. Vizard?? I quoted Comp Cams. How 'bout my GM maintenance manual? Pretty much the same method. Oh its the butt hurt clown that trashed his Golen block and blames it on Golen is sharing his hack experiences again. He hates facts. Yeh man bet he does it by smell too cause his post really stinks.
Plenty of clowns here that insist on the noise method even though we can read someone has vlv train noise/problems at least every week here. The truth is the OP used it and now has at least a trashed lifter. Too many new enthusiasts posting lifter problems to ignore it.
cardo
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My valvetrain was adjusted with the engine off method to begin with, before this whole oil pump drive shaft thing so the rockers were adjusted "correctly" to begin with. This time around I only adjusted them again to make sure they were still good and not the cause of the noise. I will take off my intake tomorrow after work and post some pics, I'm really hoping a its a lifter or even a can lobe wouldn't mind doing a cam swap just don't want to do cam bearings
Cardo can't read apparently.
I followed a factory Saturn manual once when rebuilding a 1.9 liter. We fillowed everything step by step. Turns out the cam was 90 devrees off, and on first start.we.bent valves and busted a couplen of rocker arms.
I followed a factory Saturn manual once when rebuilding a 1.9 liter. We fillowed everything step by step. Turns out the cam was 90 devrees off, and on first start.we.bent valves and busted a couplen of rocker arms.
Man I cant type today... Haha point is tjat mobody is bashing Cardo's methods. If he wants to do it that way, its perfectly valid. But dont act like you somehow know more than others who have been here longer and have worked on a lot more than you. The sound method is perfectly valid. It has been used for longer than you have likely been alive. Acting like its a horrible thing to do and telling people it is is an absolute lie and you know it.
Not this **** again...
My opinion is if you don't know what you're doing while adjusting valves, regardless of method used, you can cause "a lot of vlv train damage." It's up to you whether or not you want to take responsibility for your own screw up or blame the method used.
My opinion is if you don't know what you're doing while adjusting valves, regardless of method used, you can cause "a lot of vlv train damage." It's up to you whether or not you want to take responsibility for your own screw up or blame the method used.