383 Oil pan Part #
383 Oil pan Part # This may be a dumb question. Does anybody know a brand, link or part number for an oil pan with a built in windege tray? With the ARP studs the stock windege tray does not let the connecting rods clear. So if anyone with any experience with this situation or know how I should fix it please let me know. Thanks!
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Canton+15-242t
If you get that pan make sure it is that exact part number, and not one that states it fits a SBC or 3rd gen f-body. Those pans will make contact with either the steering rack or k-member.
There have also been reports of problems with the windage tray on the Canton regarding filling it full to its 6qt capacity and having windage issues. This happened to me running a 3.875 crank as well as a couple of other members running stock cranks. One person, and myself just run 5.5 quarts instead and it's fine. The other put a Moroso windage tray into the Canton pan and has had no issues.
If you get that pan make sure it is that exact part number, and not one that states it fits a SBC or 3rd gen f-body. Those pans will make contact with either the steering rack or k-member.
There have also been reports of problems with the windage tray on the Canton regarding filling it full to its 6qt capacity and having windage issues. This happened to me running a 3.875 crank as well as a couple of other members running stock cranks. One person, and myself just run 5.5 quarts instead and it's fine. The other put a Moroso windage tray into the Canton pan and has had no issues.
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Swamp
you can use either the 3 stock extended studs or Miloden makes them. Don't know if ARP does.
just put 1/8" washers between studs & oil pump & windage tray to raise it away from crank. you can use a stock pan. confirm clearance of rotating assembly and pan as some slight clearance may be necessary. My #2 rod bolt just "scraped" the bottom front of pan. I put the pan on motor while on stand without pan gasket and had a friend rotate motor by hand while I held my ear to bottom of pan. There was a slight scrape on pan from #2. with a gasket it cleared but I just put pan on a thick folded towel and used a wooden baseball bat (big end) to push pan bottom out slightly from inside. Not talking about beating on it, just a little push from the inside was all it needed.
you can use either the 3 stock extended studs or Miloden makes them. Don't know if ARP does.
just put 1/8" washers between studs & oil pump & windage tray to raise it away from crank. you can use a stock pan. confirm clearance of rotating assembly and pan as some slight clearance may be necessary. My #2 rod bolt just "scraped" the bottom front of pan. I put the pan on motor while on stand without pan gasket and had a friend rotate motor by hand while I held my ear to bottom of pan. There was a slight scrape on pan from #2. with a gasket it cleared but I just put pan on a thick folded towel and used a wooden baseball bat (big end) to push pan bottom out slightly from inside. Not talking about beating on it, just a little push from the inside was all it needed.
Some of the top race engine builders throw those windage trays away. Thinking now is get rid of anything that could slow the oil's return to the sump where the oil pump can pick it up. I haven't used a windage tray for several years. The guys at Reher & Morrison Racing Engines (I have known David Reher for close to forty years) were the first ones to recommend me doing that.
Depending on your rods, you may need a pan dimpled along the rails for rod bolt clearance.
Depending on your rods, you may need a pan dimpled along the rails for rod bolt clearance.
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Brett Foote A phonecall and sending the pan back for fixing would've fixed this problem. Considering they're handmade, there is always room for error. Anything custom has the potential for issues like this. We haven't had any issues, and we've sold a bunch of them.
I run just the tray in the canton pan on mine with a set of normal length studs, ive had no issues with my 242t from canton on the contrary to what is said here on the boards.....I fill mine with the 6qts and have never seen a windage issue at all with a 3.75" crank, my counterweights are very small and contoured to cut oil so this may be why im outside the realm of complaints
Mike, if you do not have a high volume oil pump (think you know better), you can use 4 qts in the pan plus what the filter holds, pitch the windage tray (slows oil returning to the sump) and run a minimum 5 hundredths quicker in a race that counts. Go ahead and run six qts while playing and testing.
If you kept your bearing clearances on the tight side, 0-10 Royal Purple is another 5. Some guys run it all the time. I use 6 qts of 5W20 in "bracket mode".
If you kept your bearing clearances on the tight side, 0-10 Royal Purple is another 5. Some guys run it all the time. I use 6 qts of 5W20 in "bracket mode".
The Moroso tray is coated to shed oil and louvered. Far as slowing drainage how much oil can really be trapped on top of the tray? If you could get 8oz to hang out up there that would be a HUGE amount, for those who don't remember conversions the typical 5 quart sump is 160oz.
If the tray slows a car down I would have to guess it is an aerodynamics thing restricting the air moving around behind the pistons.
I think Mike raises a very real possibility that windage control issues may depend as much on the crank shape as the tray or pan. I have seen windage issues on an LT1 when assembled without the factory tray, but at the same time can believe what Ed is saying abut some applications being faster without the tray, and this would go a long ways towards explaining why some guys have issues with the Canton setup while some don't. The guys that don't might just have a crank and rod combo that is aerodynamically cleaner. Mike did a good job of coming up with an idea that takes everyone's observations into account rather than just blindly dismissing anyone who didn't see the same he did.
If the tray slows a car down I would have to guess it is an aerodynamics thing restricting the air moving around behind the pistons.
I think Mike raises a very real possibility that windage control issues may depend as much on the crank shape as the tray or pan. I have seen windage issues on an LT1 when assembled without the factory tray, but at the same time can believe what Ed is saying abut some applications being faster without the tray, and this would go a long ways towards explaining why some guys have issues with the Canton setup while some don't. The guys that don't might just have a crank and rod combo that is aerodynamically cleaner. Mike did a good job of coming up with an idea that takes everyone's observations into account rather than just blindly dismissing anyone who didn't see the same he did.
My recommendation, and what I practice, comes from David Reher and Bruce Allen of Reher & Morrison Racing Engines, who had a hand in designing and original testing of Moroso's Chevy race oil pans. They did extensive testing with clear plastic pans on one of their dynos. The oil doesn't stack up on top of the tray, just hits it and slows down on it's way to the sump. I'll take their word for it. If your endurance racing, and run a lot of oil, use the tray. If your trying to go fast, you reduce windage by running thinner and less oil, and no tray.
I have known David for forty years, and Bruce for several. They know more about race engines than anybody I know, and they test everything. I buy some of my engine parts from them, and have never been steered wrong by advice I have gotten from one of them.
I have known David for forty years, and Bruce for several. They know more about race engines than anybody I know, and they test everything. I buy some of my engine parts from them, and have never been steered wrong by advice I have gotten from one of them.
MOST of us have street and strip cars we want to corner and drive for extended periods, cornering oil control is different from drag oil control and decent sump capacity is a good thing on the street.
I don't want to try and take a big sweeping onramp under power with 4 quarts in the pan and risk having too much get stuck by g-forces under the outside valvecover and starve the pan.
I don't want to try and take a big sweeping onramp under power with 4 quarts in the pan and risk having too much get stuck by g-forces under the outside valvecover and starve the pan.
.....unfortunately I left my clearances a bit loose, so I've got some heavier oil in it, going to go one step thinner it should be fine I never street drive it anymore anyway.......what I did do was put a few holes in the top of my windage tray to help drain back, I read the same articles ed about the tray just slowing the drain back down.... 