What to expect to the wheels
12 Second Club
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 419
Likes: 4
From: Long Beach, MS
Maybe, maybe not.
Hard to say because we don't really know what's been done. We don't know because it really appears that you don't know.
I say get it on a dyno or take it to the track, then decide that you've wasted $4k.
Hard to say because we don't really know what's been done. We don't know because it really appears that you don't know.
I say get it on a dyno or take it to the track, then decide that you've wasted $4k.
Staging Lane
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 49
Likes: 0
He is a douche, but he is also usually right. I would rather have an ******* telling me the truth than a nice person coddling me with false things.
At this point, you are to far along to worry about it. Get it on a dyno with a capable tuner and see how she does.
I say 350whp.
At this point, you are to far along to worry about it. Get it on a dyno with a capable tuner and see how she does.
I say 350whp.
The best case scenario is you would be able to crack 400whp. It all comes down to the head work, if you have every supporting mod available, and if you're on a dynojet or something more generous. I doubt that's going to happen though. If the head guy knew what he was doing then the valves wouldn't be that size in stock seats. I wouldn't have high hopes for the port work and valve job if that is really the case.
Are you sure the pistons are hypereuctectic Mahles? These engines come with them stock. If they are Mahle Powerpaks (piston + ring sets like all of the ones sold on Summit) then they are 4032 forged and can take a good bit of spray.
Are you sure the pistons are hypereuctectic Mahles? These engines come with them stock. If they are Mahle Powerpaks (piston + ring sets like all of the ones sold on Summit) then they are 4032 forged and can take a good bit of spray.
TECH Regular
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 442
Likes: 3
From: Raleigh, NC
Not many cases where a LT1 will need valves any larger than 2.00/1.56, there are plenty of 500+hp cars running around with that valve size.
If your motor isn't together yet, I'd have a conversation with you head porter about how much he knows LT1 motors versus old small block motors. Porting a set of LT1 heads in the same manner folks commonly ported old-school SBC heads is not the path to success.
The cam isn't what I would have selected, but it's not bad either. If I were in your shoes I'd just install it straight up and run it, see what it does.
The pistons are ok. Research the chamber volume and head gasket thickness you're using and try to get your compression to at least 11:1, preferably higher. 52-54cc chambers with a stock deck height and .026 gasket should get you close to that.
If your motor isn't together yet, I'd have a conversation with you head porter about how much he knows LT1 motors versus old small block motors. Porting a set of LT1 heads in the same manner folks commonly ported old-school SBC heads is not the path to success.
The cam isn't what I would have selected, but it's not bad either. If I were in your shoes I'd just install it straight up and run it, see what it does.
The pistons are ok. Research the chamber volume and head gasket thickness you're using and try to get your compression to at least 11:1, preferably higher. 52-54cc chambers with a stock deck height and .026 gasket should get you close to that.
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 118
Likes: 0
From: louisiana
He milled the top of the block I can't remember the gasket thickness he didn't use stock seats I have got find these receipts to this motor it was built a year ago,was bored .30 over so how could the pistons be stock. I guess the only thing I can do is get it finished and enjoy it
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TECH Addict
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 2,610
Likes: 4
From: Maricopa, AZ
It's becoming harder and harder to find LT1 tuners. Tuning has less to do with knowing computers as it does knowing the engine/vehicle. If you understand exactly how every sensor works with the otto-cycle and how it's effected by sensor location (ex. O2's on LT headers vs stock) and air/fuel flow pulses, you can tune anything easily. If not, you can still tune, but it'll take a little longer to pick up on.
If you think you can handle it, I'd say do it. It's a good skill to have whether you do it professionally or not. Just be ready for any curveballs along the way. Tune SLOWLY so you don't mess anything up so bad you get mechanical failures. Read, read, read, until you understand how everything is tied together. Then experiment, slowly with each perimeter and table. See the results of your work, learn as you go. And you'll get there in a year or less, improving the tune every step of the way.
I like Tunerpro RT, really easy user interface: click and drag 3D graphs. If you get the XDF that Steveo made (the guy who did the $EEHack program), it makes it much easier. Read up on his tuning tips and on the links he provides for more tuning tips.
If you think you can handle it, I'd say do it. It's a good skill to have whether you do it professionally or not. Just be ready for any curveballs along the way. Tune SLOWLY so you don't mess anything up so bad you get mechanical failures. Read, read, read, until you understand how everything is tied together. Then experiment, slowly with each perimeter and table. See the results of your work, learn as you go. And you'll get there in a year or less, improving the tune every step of the way.
I like Tunerpro RT, really easy user interface: click and drag 3D graphs. If you get the XDF that Steveo made (the guy who did the $EEHack program), it makes it much easier. Read up on his tuning tips and on the links he provides for more tuning tips.
Last edited by hrcslam; Jan 4, 2016 at 02:28 PM.
96caprice comes off harsh but has good intentions, you need thick skin on the Internet or you won't get out alive. You didn't blow $4000 YET, so pause where you are, DON'T START IT, and get more information from the head porter and the shortblock builder.
The info we need from the head guy is:
New seats or stock seats?
What is the valve size intake and exhaust?
Were the heads milled? How much?
Were they ported the whole way through or just port matched?
Did he happen to measure chamber volume?
Did he get flow numbers? If so what is intake and exhaust flow?
What valve springs did he use?
And ask this one gingerly without insulting him, has he done LT1 heads before and what were the results of that build?
From the shortblock guy:
What pistons? Part number, cc, material, ring size (you want stock 1.5/1.5/3mm thin rings)
How much was the block decked?
What size and material rods? Part number or stock?
What head gaskets? Thickness and diameter and part number
What rod bolts? Stock rods resized for ARP bolts, stock replacement bolts, or aftermarket rods with what bolts?
What compression ratio did he aim for?
Your cam is on the small side but would be a good street cam. If the bottom end checks out ok, being with -5cc pistons, 1.5/1.5/3mm rings, and ARP rod bolts, you can adjust the top end to make good power. Power doesn't come from the shortblock, it comes from air in and air out (heads and cam), the bottom end just needs to have the compression, low friction, and strength to survive.
With the head gasket info, piston cc, deck height (piston depth in the hole), and head chamber cc you can calculate compression ratio, and you are aiming for 11-12:1. Stock was 10.4:1, lt4s had 10.8:1, you want a little more than that. If your heads are the weak link, you can either get some other heads, or have these touched up again by someone else. You are shooting for 0.035-0.040 quench, which is distance from the piston face to the head face, so it's piston depth in the hole + head gasket thickness. If he has the pistons at stock 0.02 in the hole and used a 0.054ish head gasket, you are WAY high on quench and low on compression, and $34 victor reinz 0.026 head gaskets can get you closer. If he decked the block 0.010, and you use an 0.026 head gasket you are perfect.
The reason I said DON'T START IT is you need a baseline tune with any aftermarket cam before startup. If you start it and are super rich, you could have fuel go past the rings, dilute the oil, and wipe your bearings and not seat your rings properly, thats how you could lose your $4000. Your cam is off the shelf, and any reputable tuner has probably had that cam come through their shop on the dyno, so if you get a mail order tune for $200, he will send you that tune and it will be close. Then you can download the software and tweak it and learn yourself. You are not sunk, if we can get more detailed information, there are things that can be adjusted to try to reach your 400rwhp goal. If your bottom end, specifically the rod bolts, are up to the task of 7000rpm, you can at worst sell your current cam for $300 and buy a bigger one for $400 and spin it to get your goal. At best, you change your head gaskets to 0.026, get 30lb injectors, a tune, and make 360-390rwhp.
The info we need from the head guy is:
New seats or stock seats?
What is the valve size intake and exhaust?
Were the heads milled? How much?
Were they ported the whole way through or just port matched?
Did he happen to measure chamber volume?
Did he get flow numbers? If so what is intake and exhaust flow?
What valve springs did he use?
And ask this one gingerly without insulting him, has he done LT1 heads before and what were the results of that build?
From the shortblock guy:
What pistons? Part number, cc, material, ring size (you want stock 1.5/1.5/3mm thin rings)
How much was the block decked?
What size and material rods? Part number or stock?
What head gaskets? Thickness and diameter and part number
What rod bolts? Stock rods resized for ARP bolts, stock replacement bolts, or aftermarket rods with what bolts?
What compression ratio did he aim for?
Your cam is on the small side but would be a good street cam. If the bottom end checks out ok, being with -5cc pistons, 1.5/1.5/3mm rings, and ARP rod bolts, you can adjust the top end to make good power. Power doesn't come from the shortblock, it comes from air in and air out (heads and cam), the bottom end just needs to have the compression, low friction, and strength to survive.
With the head gasket info, piston cc, deck height (piston depth in the hole), and head chamber cc you can calculate compression ratio, and you are aiming for 11-12:1. Stock was 10.4:1, lt4s had 10.8:1, you want a little more than that. If your heads are the weak link, you can either get some other heads, or have these touched up again by someone else. You are shooting for 0.035-0.040 quench, which is distance from the piston face to the head face, so it's piston depth in the hole + head gasket thickness. If he has the pistons at stock 0.02 in the hole and used a 0.054ish head gasket, you are WAY high on quench and low on compression, and $34 victor reinz 0.026 head gaskets can get you closer. If he decked the block 0.010, and you use an 0.026 head gasket you are perfect.
The reason I said DON'T START IT is you need a baseline tune with any aftermarket cam before startup. If you start it and are super rich, you could have fuel go past the rings, dilute the oil, and wipe your bearings and not seat your rings properly, thats how you could lose your $4000. Your cam is off the shelf, and any reputable tuner has probably had that cam come through their shop on the dyno, so if you get a mail order tune for $200, he will send you that tune and it will be close. Then you can download the software and tweak it and learn yourself. You are not sunk, if we can get more detailed information, there are things that can be adjusted to try to reach your 400rwhp goal. If your bottom end, specifically the rod bolts, are up to the task of 7000rpm, you can at worst sell your current cam for $300 and buy a bigger one for $400 and spin it to get your goal. At best, you change your head gaskets to 0.026, get 30lb injectors, a tune, and make 360-390rwhp.
Last edited by bufmatmuslepants; Jan 5, 2016 at 06:01 AM.
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 118
Likes: 0
From: louisiana
96caprice comes off harsh but has good intentions, you need thick skin on the Internet or you won't get out alive. You didn't blow $4000 YET, so pause where you are, DON'T START IT, and get more information from the head porter and the shortblock builder.
The info we need from the head guy is:
New seats or stock seats?
What is the valve size intake and exhaust?
Were the heads milled? How much?
Were they ported the whole way through or just port matched?
Did he happen to measure chamber volume?
Did he get flow numbers? If so what is intake and exhaust flow?
What valve springs did he use?
And ask this one gingerly without insulting him, has he done LT1 heads before and what were the results of that build?
From the shortblock guy:
What pistons? Part number, cc, material, ring size (you want stock 1.5/1.5/3mm thin rings)
How much was the block decked?
What size and material rods? Part number or stock?
What head gaskets? Thickness and diameter and part number
What rod bolts? Stock rods resized for ARP bolts, stock replacement bolts, or aftermarket rods with what bolts?
What compression ratio did he aim for?
Your cam is on the small side but would be a good street cam. If the bottom end checks out ok, being with -5cc pistons, 1.5/1.5/3mm rings, and ARP rod bolts, you can adjust the top end to make good power. Power doesn't come from the shortblock, it comes from air in and air out (heads and cam), the bottom end just needs to have the compression, low friction, and strength to survive.
With the head gasket info, piston cc, deck height (piston depth in the hole), and head chamber cc you can calculate compression ratio, and you are aiming for 11-12:1. Stock was 10.4:1, lt4s had 10.8:1, you want a little more than that. If your heads are the weak link, you can either get some other heads, or have these touched up again by someone else. You are shooting for 0.035-0.040 quench, which is distance from the piston face to the head face, so it's piston depth in the hole + head gasket thickness. If he has the pistons at stock 0.02 in the hole and used a 0.054ish head gasket, you are WAY high on quench and low on compression, and $34 victor reinz 0.026 head gaskets can get you closer. If he decked the block 0.010, and you use an 0.026 head gasket you are perfect.
The reason I said DON'T START IT is you need a baseline tune with any aftermarket cam before startup. If you start it and are super rich, you could have fuel go past the rings, dilute the oil, and wipe your bearings and not seat your rings properly, thats how you could lose your $4000. Your cam is off the shelf, and any reputable tuner has probably had that cam come through their shop on the dyno, so if you get a mail order tune for $200, he will send you that tune and it will be close. Then you can download the software and tweak it and learn yourself. You are not sunk, if we can get more detailed information, there are things that can be adjusted to try to reach your 400rwhp goal. If your bottom end, specifically the rod bolts, are up to the task of 7000rpm, you can at worst sell your current cam for $300 and buy a bigger one for $400 and spin it to get your goal. At best, you change your head gaskets to 0.026, get 30lb injectors, a tune, and make 360-390rwhp.
The info we need from the head guy is:
New seats or stock seats?
What is the valve size intake and exhaust?
Were the heads milled? How much?
Were they ported the whole way through or just port matched?
Did he happen to measure chamber volume?
Did he get flow numbers? If so what is intake and exhaust flow?
What valve springs did he use?
And ask this one gingerly without insulting him, has he done LT1 heads before and what were the results of that build?
From the shortblock guy:
What pistons? Part number, cc, material, ring size (you want stock 1.5/1.5/3mm thin rings)
How much was the block decked?
What size and material rods? Part number or stock?
What head gaskets? Thickness and diameter and part number
What rod bolts? Stock rods resized for ARP bolts, stock replacement bolts, or aftermarket rods with what bolts?
What compression ratio did he aim for?
Your cam is on the small side but would be a good street cam. If the bottom end checks out ok, being with -5cc pistons, 1.5/1.5/3mm rings, and ARP rod bolts, you can adjust the top end to make good power. Power doesn't come from the shortblock, it comes from air in and air out (heads and cam), the bottom end just needs to have the compression, low friction, and strength to survive.
With the head gasket info, piston cc, deck height (piston depth in the hole), and head chamber cc you can calculate compression ratio, and you are aiming for 11-12:1. Stock was 10.4:1, lt4s had 10.8:1, you want a little more than that. If your heads are the weak link, you can either get some other heads, or have these touched up again by someone else. You are shooting for 0.035-0.040 quench, which is distance from the piston face to the head face, so it's piston depth in the hole + head gasket thickness. If he has the pistons at stock 0.02 in the hole and used a 0.054ish head gasket, you are WAY high on quench and low on compression, and $34 victor reinz 0.026 head gaskets can get you closer. If he decked the block 0.010, and you use an 0.026 head gasket you are perfect.
The reason I said DON'T START IT is you need a baseline tune with any aftermarket cam before startup. If you start it and are super rich, you could have fuel go past the rings, dilute the oil, and wipe your bearings and not seat your rings properly, thats how you could lose your $4000. Your cam is off the shelf, and any reputable tuner has probably had that cam come through their shop on the dyno, so if you get a mail order tune for $200, he will send you that tune and it will be close. Then you can download the software and tweak it and learn yourself. You are not sunk, if we can get more detailed information, there are things that can be adjusted to try to reach your 400rwhp goal. If your bottom end, specifically the rod bolts, are up to the task of 7000rpm, you can at worst sell your current cam for $300 and buy a bigger one for $400 and spin it to get your goal. At best, you change your head gaskets to 0.026, get 30lb injectors, a tune, and make 360-390rwhp.