t56 swap! FINALLY
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From: connecticut
actually gonna need a new clutch, looked at it real good today and the material is getting pretty close to the rivits holding the clutch together, sooooo now im shopping for a new clutch
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From: connecticut
and possibly a new flywheel now, took a look at the flywheel and about an inch of it is milled off.....so now what? if i buy a new one do i have to go somehwere and have it balanced for my motor? i really hope not. trying to make this swap quick. when i start pulling the tranny out of the camaro i dont want to have to stop and go get another flywheel or whatever. any ideas?
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From: Maricopa, AZ
That's a good question. Maybe a machine shop can match the balance of a new one to the old one? Not sure. I know people have replaced the flywheels without having to re-balance everything again though. I can't believe an inch has been milled off! That's nuts! How thick is it now?
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From: connecticut
That's a good question. Maybe a machine shop can match the balance of a new one to the old one? Not sure. I know people have replaced the flywheels without having to re-balance everything again though. I can't believe an inch has been milled off! That's nuts! How thick is it now?
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finally finished the swap! everything went very good, resurfaced old flywheel and it worked out, no vibrations, only concerns are im smelling tranny fluid when i get on the throttle and do some fast shifts. im pretty sure its tranny fluid im smelling, not clutch burning, but it could be that too, stage 3 xtd clutch chattered horribly but after 120miles its nearly gone, the 2.73s arnt too bad, getting out of 1st seems fine to me, 6th is nearly unusable, at 75/80mph im at 1200rpms lugging.
also another concern is sometimes, mainly in reverse, the clutch is not fully disengaging when the pedal is depressed. i understand the master/slave is a sealed unit and cant b bled. resevoir is full of fluid. sometimes i feel like if i press the clutch twice it works, could just be getting lucky though im not sure. any possible remedy to this?
also another concern is after about 75 miles i came back from a drive and i swear i can hear my flywheel/ clutch rotating, i also get some pedal vibration now too, i didnt do any launches or anything, did some hard 2-3 shifts and drove for a few hours. hope i didnt screw up the break in process, any thoughts on that?
also another concern is sometimes, mainly in reverse, the clutch is not fully disengaging when the pedal is depressed. i understand the master/slave is a sealed unit and cant b bled. resevoir is full of fluid. sometimes i feel like if i press the clutch twice it works, could just be getting lucky though im not sure. any possible remedy to this?
also another concern is after about 75 miles i came back from a drive and i swear i can hear my flywheel/ clutch rotating, i also get some pedal vibration now too, i didnt do any launches or anything, did some hard 2-3 shifts and drove for a few hours. hope i didnt screw up the break in process, any thoughts on that?
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Oh okay, I was under the impression it was self bleed, and every time u use it it bleeds? Guess I was wrong, I'll look into it, didn't see a way to bleed it though, and it's not new, off of my doner car
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if hydraulics are 20+ years old, they are likely tired. You can buy new for around $120
these systems are not self bleeding. They are factory sealed. You can bleed them by pumping slave slowly while someone watches for bubbles up top. But if the MC or slave is failing, bleeding won't help.
Reverse is the 1st gear failing hydraulics affect (no syncro).
You can put the rear end up on jack stands, start motor, put in gear holding down pedal...if rear wheels turn the clutch is not fully disengageing
these systems are not self bleeding. They are factory sealed. You can bleed them by pumping slave slowly while someone watches for bubbles up top. But if the MC or slave is failing, bleeding won't help.
Reverse is the 1st gear failing hydraulics affect (no syncro).
You can put the rear end up on jack stands, start motor, put in gear holding down pedal...if rear wheels turn the clutch is not fully disengageing
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From: Kernersville, NC
There is a rubber diaphragm in the clutch fluid reservoir and also a hole in the lid of the reservoir. When the cap is tightened for the reservoir, the slave cylinder, down at the clutch, is to be pushed into the cylinder a certain amount when you tighten the cap. That rubber diaphragm then seals, the outside of the diaphragm is at atmosphere pressure and when you release the slave, as it pushes out, that puts a vacuum to the clutch system....thus it should help any air in the system to move to the top of the reservoir.
When people open that lid to check the clutch fluid, then simply put it back on without pushing back in on the slave cylinder, holding it, then sealing the lid.... they don't realize they are screwing up the self bleeding of the system.
Some people even throw the rubber diaphragm away without realizing what it is for....or if that diaphragm is torn or damaged, it will not self bleed as it can't form a vacuum in the system even if maintenance is performed properly on the system.
To manually bled the system, loosen the reservoir cap, remove the slave cylinder, hold it vertical with the actuator down, push in the actuator in about 1 inch, then release, lather, rinse, repeat as desired.
I'll need to open up my factory service manual, but I think you need to push the actuator into the slave about 2 inches, hold, and tighten cap while holding the actuator in the slave cylinder. Have someone tighten the cap while you hold the actuator in the slave cylinder.
If the unit is new, it should already be bled and ready to go. Just don't mistakenly pull the reservoir off the line while installing it(been there, done that, it sux to create yourself more work).
Last edited by ACE1252; Mar 30, 2016 at 10:35 PM.
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From: Kernersville, NC
Looks like I've got too much stroke on the actuator in my above directions....insert dirty joke 1 here...
The factory manual says to push the actuator into the cylinder 20mm, hold, and then put the cap on. From there, it says to hold the slave vertical, push the actuator in 10mm, release, lather, rinse, repeat as desired. This makes sense as by sealing it 20mm in, then releasing and going in 10mm strokes, vacuum is on the system as you work the actuator...insert dirty joke 2 here....
The way I describe it in my previous post, you are bleeding it at atmosphere pressure.....doing as the manual describes it, I think would work better.
I'll post up the bleeding pages from the manual in a hour or so. There is a error in the manual, as they say that 20mm = 0.0787in and 10mm=0.0390in.....pretty sure that's supposed to be 0.787in and 0.390in.
Interestingly enough, the last step of the directions is to fill the reservoir with fluid to level if needed....I've always done that as the first step.....
There is no question that the system works fine without a vacuum...I ran it that way for years before needing to bleed the clutch after mistakenly pulling the reservoir off the line one day. That's when I dove into the manual and discovered they were putting a vacuum on the system when bleeding.
The factory manual says to push the actuator into the cylinder 20mm, hold, and then put the cap on. From there, it says to hold the slave vertical, push the actuator in 10mm, release, lather, rinse, repeat as desired. This makes sense as by sealing it 20mm in, then releasing and going in 10mm strokes, vacuum is on the system as you work the actuator...insert dirty joke 2 here....
The way I describe it in my previous post, you are bleeding it at atmosphere pressure.....doing as the manual describes it, I think would work better.
I'll post up the bleeding pages from the manual in a hour or so. There is a error in the manual, as they say that 20mm = 0.0787in and 10mm=0.0390in.....pretty sure that's supposed to be 0.787in and 0.390in.
Interestingly enough, the last step of the directions is to fill the reservoir with fluid to level if needed....I've always done that as the first step.....
There is no question that the system works fine without a vacuum...I ran it that way for years before needing to bleed the clutch after mistakenly pulling the reservoir off the line one day. That's when I dove into the manual and discovered they were putting a vacuum on the system when bleeding.
Last edited by ACE1252; Mar 30, 2016 at 09:56 PM.
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interesting read. I have removed my reservoir cap many times with both the stock sealed system and my current McLeod (Wilwood) MC/GM slave and not had any problems.
Had not heard of the push slave piston in x", hold, have someone put rubber and cap back on reservoir and then release slave thus inducing vacuum in the system...if I understand the procedure correctly
Ace. Does the FSM show a diagram of the LT1 6 speed "pull" type clutch?. The illustration you post looks to be for a push clutch with the slave/TO bearing over the input shaft
Had not heard of the push slave piston in x", hold, have someone put rubber and cap back on reservoir and then release slave thus inducing vacuum in the system...if I understand the procedure correctly
Ace. Does the FSM show a diagram of the LT1 6 speed "pull" type clutch?. The illustration you post looks to be for a push clutch with the slave/TO bearing over the input shaft
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From: connecticut
great info thanks ace, i followed the instructions, still hard to get into reverse, also dont have rev lockout hooked up, partly the reason, but its definetly alot better, also notice the clutch disengages fully now. thanks for the info, very helpful i appreciate it, now i have zero issues! besides the tranny fluid smell when i get on the throttle and do some quick shifts. thanks guys i appreciate all the help! btw just incase anyone is wondering, i have concluded from my reasearch and now experience that from the factory, any lt1 flywheel can go on any lt1 motor, they will all appear to be balanced differently but that is due to the difference in the castings of the flywheel, has nothing to do with lt1 motor, all factory flywheels will work with lt1s
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there is a way to wire the reverse lock out where if your PCM is programed as stock it works under 3 mph
or just wire it to brake pedal. For me I always have my foot on the brake when putting into reverse anyway
otherwise you will have to "force" it into reverse without the reverse lock out solenoid being wired in some way
or just wire it to brake pedal. For me I always have my foot on the brake when putting into reverse anyway
otherwise you will have to "force" it into reverse without the reverse lock out solenoid being wired in some way
You don't have it hooked up or didn't? If the solenoid is not connected it will be in an "block" position and it will be extremely difficult to get the shifter into reverse. Also, the connector to that solenoid is identical to another connector on that same harness.
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From: Kernersville, NC
Figure 2 is on the next page and does show the T56 hydraulic setup.
As my car is a '96, I pulled those pages from that manual.
Here is a link to download various 4th Gen F-body factory service manuals.
https://www.mediafire.com/?40mfgeoe4ctti
Last edited by ACE1252; Mar 31, 2016 at 07:52 PM.
Thread Starter
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From: connecticut
i never had rev lockout hooked up, the solenoid or whatever it is that bolts up to the tranny with the plug is physically broken, but im able to consistantly get it into reverse, just takes a little umph thats all. now time for the next part, tuning, ordered a16pin obd1 connector, gonna take a shot at tuning today, think i will make another thread reguarding tuning since this is also new to me, unless someone can point me in the right direction. will be tuning with eehack made by steveo who posted here as well, along with tunerpro to edit the bins to mess around with it, not going to do too much messing as i dont know what the hell im doing lol