RoAdRaGe912

he was talking about through the different RPMs like the timing curve in the stock PCM.

Big Rick

iTrader: (1)

So now you have locked timing. I don't see where the problem using the factory optical sensor was? You've added an ignition box, that can be done using the opti anyway. So the only special thing about this setup is that you can manually set the timing, and it stays locked. It would be good for the person that doesn't have LT1 edit or something to change his timing in the computer. But for the money spent you could have bought some tuning software to control this. Nice idea, but the only thing that made you have a better ignition is the box itself, which could have been added with a harness. MSD now also has a complete opti out that does have adjustable timing.

RoAdRaGe912

actually Rick, this is a car that has spent a lot of time on your dyno. he does have LT1 edit. his problem was a horrible misfire problem in the upper RPMs. he did add a box and i don't even think the car ran with it installed and if it did run it was much worse than without it. i think his problem is in the wiring somewhere. he's been trying to track this problem down for a long time and jumping everything hopefully has proven effective.

Big Rick

iTrader: (1)

SO then it's a wiring issue? Obviously if he changed the opti then the optical sensor was replaced, so the only thing left is something in either the wire harness or the computer itself. So what would this setup offer for the LT1 guy who doesn't have a messed up harness? Manually adjustable timing is nice without having to use a laptop but MSD has now addressed this with a totally new Opti w/ built in adjustable timing. For the average LT1 guy who daily drives his car, Locked timing is not really a good thing.

RoAdRaGe912

yeah, i realize all of what you're saying. i'm just happy the car might be running right.

that car is a track only car. i agree with everything you've said also. the MSD opti isn't actally available correct? i know it's been made and i've seen the specs and adjustable timing feature (which is awesome BTW), but i can't wait for it to get out and get used.

Big Rick

iTrader: (1)

I think since the car is a track only car it is the way to go. I like using locked out timing on Power Adder cars or high compression cars. For a mild car or street car though built in advance through the distributor offers better low end power and driveability. But the Ultimate is being able to create a Timing curve via computer controlled ignitions. By the way, the car is running sick for just a cam car.

z28boysteve

iTrader: (9)

well I was just sayin that this is a wicked easy alternative, (if your a race car) to the Delteq and people always told me you need F.A.S.T. or DFI or something of the sort to run this junk.
it took me a day to install, and I can go back in 30 mins

also, the timing doesnt have to be totally locked out, you can build a curve by buying high speed retard modules but thats where it stops getting cheap... besides this is only an experiment, I spent a total of $4 on bolts and the rest has been temporarily borrowed from my dad's car.

Im just thrilled that I may possibly see what my car is capable of with the new cam, springs, retainers, rockers, lifters, throttle body and water pump lol 11.74 with a hotcam is fast....for a hotcam car...but it aint fast for a race car lol

Chris 96 WS6

iTrader: (1)

So I'm missing something..

The crank trigger is firing the coil, which is running through the cap/rotor, and the optical seciton is still running to keep the PCM happy but has no control over spark, right?

Seems to me you've just made it all the more complex. The weaknesses of both sections of the opti still exist and you've added a whole other layer of stuff on top of it which means even more stuff to go wrong.

z28boysteve

iTrader: (9)

The computer control, the factory coil, the ignition module, and the wiring harness have all been eliminated not to mention the LT1 has a weak *** stock ingnition..

Chris 96 WS6

iTrader: (1)

Actually I thought the 96-97 cars have a pretty good/hot coil, hence why there wasn't an aftermarket upgrade available. for a long time.

The stock optical section is still running, and still feeding the PCM signals, though it can't actually control the spark anymore. So I don't see how that's any better since a properly working optical section is very accurate (more accurate than the crank trigger?). So I'm not sure there's any advantage there vs. a properly running opti in good condition.

And running all that hot voltage through the cap/rotor doesn't solve anything, because that's really the biggest problem with the opti to begin with. The high voltage, particularly with the amplifier boxes, causes ozone buildup and eventually arching and crossfiring inside the cap. This solution doesn't appear to do anything about that.

Don't get me wrong, you get a big from me for thinking outside the box, I just don't really think the end result really improves anything.

thesoundandthefury

iTrader: (3)

I've thought alot about this, and the only way I can see the Opti ever being completely eliminated while maintaining the stock PCM would be to create some sort've black box that could act as a cam position simulator and take the pulse signals from whatever aftermarket crank trigger wheel you decided to use and convert them mathematically to match the timing codes programmed into the PCM.

Since the crank and cam are connected through a timing chain and turn in unison, there's an element of predictability to be expected. If someone were able to crack the PCM's timing codes, they could write a new set of codes that would match up with the trigger wheel being used, and then by using those codes have the black box convert the pulse signals from the trigger wheel to match the pulse signals that the Opti wheel WOULD have sent.

It would be a blind leading the blind situation at best...

z28boysteve

iTrader: (9)

lol --->me<---no where near an electrical engineer
lol then, your black box idea and MSD pro billet front drive would make for a sick distributor.

Renegade

iTrader: (1)

The problems you explained kinda sounded like a warped valve guide, but I'm glad to hear it was ignition related and you fixed it