View Poll Results: Do you guys downshift when decelerating?
Yes, all the time.
232
22.92%
Yeah, most of the time
355
35.08%
Nope, once in awhile though
355
35.08%
Never
70
6.92%
Voters: 1012. You may not vote on this poll
Downshifting
11-02-2006, 03:50 AM
#121
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It doesnt wear that much on the clutch. Your retarded if you think down shifting will wear out you clutch. Unless your stupid and slip it like a bitch it wont wear out any different.
11-02-2006, 05:47 AM
#122
Originally Posted by Dex
It doesnt wear that much on the clutch. Your retarded if you think down shifting will wear out you clutch. Unless your stupid and slip it like a bitch it wont wear out any different.
12-11-2006, 04:54 PM
#125
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Originally Posted by BayAreaSS
I downshift sometimes when coming to a stop or when i need slow down some. But i mostly do it when i want to be heard by another car.
same here bud
12-16-2006, 10:08 AM
#126
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I vote yes all the time.
Downshifting saves the brakes and has no adverse affects on the clutch
I've only replaced front pads because of a seized up slide pin.
And the car has 113k on the original clutch.
Downshifting saves the brakes and has no adverse affects on the clutch
I've only replaced front pads because of a seized up slide pin.
And the car has 113k on the original clutch.
12-16-2006, 03:59 PM
#127
Originally Posted by Justin00SS
Nobody is saying that it wears out your clutch any faster. We are saying that is it just uneeded wear and tear on the clutch, tranny, engine, etc when all you really have to do is push in the clutch and mash the brakes a little.
12-17-2006, 08:51 PM
#129
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Do you guys downshift when slowing down? If you do... how? and at what rpm? You cause more wear on the clutch the more you use it, right? When I downshift I tend to ease off the clutch slowly so i slow down more smoothly, but doesn't that cause more wear on the clutch than if you let off it quick? I read that dumping the clutch at a fairly high rpm isn't nearly as bad as "riding" the clutch or easing off it slowly.
Using this logic makes me question why we even downshift. Of course I'm talking about when you're decelerating, not accelerating . By not downshifting you're transferring more of the energy and wear it takes to slow down to the brakes, right? Wouldn't that make more sense?? Since brakes are cheap and easy to replace compared the clutch... Wouldn't this cause less wear and tear on the clutch... and the transmission for that matter?
Using this logic makes me question why we even downshift. Of course I'm talking about when you're decelerating, not accelerating . By not downshifting you're transferring more of the energy and wear it takes to slow down to the brakes, right? Wouldn't that make more sense?? Since brakes are cheap and easy to replace compared the clutch... Wouldn't this cause less wear and tear on the clutch... and the transmission for that matter?
When you're slowing down on the brakes, your momentum will be shifted, you'll feel that lurch, you step on the clutch and go to neutral and you feel the momentum change, then you rev match and get into the lower gear, you let the clutch out fast before the rpm drops and you will feel only the same amount of momentum shift as you already had just slowing down with the brakes.
I'm a heavy duty mechanic. I've watched a video of an instructor who double clutched every gear. He rev matched up and down. If you're not using the clutch, you're not fully engaged in the gear.
I've ridden with a friend in his frieght shaker and he tried to get it into gear from a dead stop. After a few grinds I yelled at him to please use the clutch to at least get going.
He let me park the thing after he dropped the trailer. I used the clutch in every shift and it was smooth.
If you rev match, you don't put extra wear and tear on the synchros. You actually save them as you've done the job of matching the gear to the engine before you let the clutch out.
I had 64K+ miles on my C5 when my clutch went out. Bought the car at 27K miles. It was already dogged. Had trouble speed shifting to second. Sent it out to get rebuilt.
Clutch went bad at the pressure plate. Three of the spring fingers got stuck. When I loosend up the attaching bolts of the plate, they snapped back into place. I could have just replaced the pressure plate and reused my friction, as it was in that good condition. Very little wear compared to a new one. Flywheel and pressure plate too. Metal fatigue of the diaphragm is all that was wrong. Don't know if always double clutching made it wear out faster. When I double clutch going up, I don't have to rev match, just going to neutral and the lack of load on the heavy flywheel is enough to get if a few rpm higher to let go of the torque bind in the trans.
In a tractor trailer situation, you still have to blip the throttle, for the lack of synchronizers. Not the situation in cars.
Last edited by Castrellon; 12-17-2006 at 08:59 PM.
12-18-2006, 12:05 PM
#130
Originally Posted by 300bhp/ton
Geeze some of you Americans have no idea about driving manual cars, lol 
No serioiusly riding the clutch is BAD as a rule because it's basically slipping it which will case wear. This is up or down shifting.
HOWEVER the key to good driving is smoothness so dumping the clutch is not the best manoeuvre , plus if you do this when slowing down it can cause a lot of stress on the drivetrain and unsettle the car.
But the biggest thing with a manual is you can do most/much of the braking with the engine. This gives you far more control than an automatic. Hence ALL circuit and rally cars are always manual and never auto
So yes you should use the engine to brake. If you are driving quick cross country the you should use the brakes as little as possible because the engine will do the rest.
Heel and toe is a good technique, but difficult to perfect and in some cars near impossible due to pedal locations. But if you can "blip" the throttle between down shifts to match the revs then it won't unsettle the car, this allows a smoother faster transition and cornering ability.
Doing this will not damage the gearbox at all, it is common every day practice. Lorry drivers use this to great affect also as the brakes on a big rig are easy to over heat (least in years gone by).
4th to 2nd gear block changes are common as you can go from high speed to lower speed with plenty of control and enter a corner in the correct gear to accelarate out.
another bonus is fuel efficency. When an engine is coasting and down revving it won't be using any fuel. So by maximising downshifting and engine braking you can increase your mpg.
In my TR7 doing that on a daily 50 mile round commute to work and back I could increase my over all average MPG by 3mpg (24 to 27) which is a pretty big percentage.
No serioiusly riding the clutch is BAD as a rule because it's basically slipping it which will case wear. This is up or down shifting.
HOWEVER the key to good driving is smoothness so dumping the clutch is not the best manoeuvre , plus if you do this when slowing down it can cause a lot of stress on the drivetrain and unsettle the car.
But the biggest thing with a manual is you can do most/much of the braking with the engine. This gives you far more control than an automatic. Hence ALL circuit and rally cars are always manual and never auto
So yes you should use the engine to brake. If you are driving quick cross country the you should use the brakes as little as possible because the engine will do the rest.
Heel and toe is a good technique, but difficult to perfect and in some cars near impossible due to pedal locations. But if you can "blip" the throttle between down shifts to match the revs then it won't unsettle the car, this allows a smoother faster transition and cornering ability.
Doing this will not damage the gearbox at all, it is common every day practice. Lorry drivers use this to great affect also as the brakes on a big rig are easy to over heat (least in years gone by).
4th to 2nd gear block changes are common as you can go from high speed to lower speed with plenty of control and enter a corner in the correct gear to accelarate out.
another bonus is fuel efficency. When an engine is coasting and down revving it won't be using any fuel. So by maximising downshifting and engine braking you can increase your mpg.
In my TR7 doing that on a daily 50 mile round commute to work and back I could increase my over all average MPG by 3mpg (24 to 27) which is a pretty big percentage.
I used to use it when people cut me off all the time.
Just get out in front of them, downshift into 2nd at 70 mph and then watch them freak out when the back of your car flies at them without the brake lights coming one
!!!(JJ I only did that once and even Mahatma Gandhi would have done it to the over aggressive 16 year old girl in her 8 ton SUV.
12-25-2006, 01:29 AM
#132
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Originally Posted by Justin00SS
Nobody is saying that it wears out your clutch any faster. We are saying that is it just uneeded wear and tear on the clutch tranny, engine, etc when all you really have to do is push in the clutch and mash the brakes a little.
01-08-2007, 10:27 PM
#134
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Originally Posted by TigerWoodsJr
I rarely downshift, im a nuetral and coast kinda guy, just downshift when im in hard driving mode or being load, hehehe.
01-09-2007, 01:44 PM
#135
Originally Posted by Dex
So unneeded wear and tear will not wear out a clutch early
I'm talking about downshifting when coming to a stop at a redlight or stopsign.
Downshifting when going around turns or just driving around is fine.
01-11-2007, 03:30 AM
#136
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Originally Posted by Justin00SS
I think we are confusing each other.
I'm talking about downshifting when coming to a stop at a redlight or stopsign.
Downshifting when going around turns or just driving around is fine.
I'm talking about downshifting when coming to a stop at a redlight or stopsign.
Downshifting when going around turns or just driving around is fine.
01-11-2007, 06:35 AM
#137
Originally Posted by Dex
So whats the diffence? Slowing down using the engine is the same no matter what. The only difference is one your coming to a complete stop and the other your only slowing down a little for a curve or whatever.
Though is it the same as far as effects on the disk?
As far as engine wear is concerned isn't the only real wear on the valvetrain.
Am I just a moron who doesn't know what I am talking about though. I can understand clutch wear no matter what. Isn't anything letting go and then touching it again going to wear it (even a little bit) as oppose to just leaving it there?
01-11-2007, 07:05 AM
#138
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Originally Posted by Genesis_26317
Though is it the same as far as effects on the disk?
As far as engine wear is concerned isn't the only real wear on the valvetrain.
Am I just a moron who doesn't know what I am talking about though. I can understand clutch wear no matter what. Isn't anything letting go and then touching it again going to wear it (even a little bit) as oppose to just leaving it there?
As far as engine wear is concerned isn't the only real wear on the valvetrain.
Am I just a moron who doesn't know what I am talking about though. I can understand clutch wear no matter what. Isn't anything letting go and then touching it again going to wear it (even a little bit) as oppose to just leaving it there?
It won't wear out the valvetrain any faster than the rest of the engine. It shouldn't wear anything out faster. Engines don't break from trying to slow down they break when your trying to go fast
and normally driver error 
This isn't real hard to understand it very simple concept of normal driving. They were made to do this stuff.
I personally don't use the engine in my car to slow down. It doesn't slow me down enough to use it. The brakes work a lot better. Unless its a panic stop and even then it seems like i'm down shifting to fast for it to be useful. My brakes work really good
01-12-2007, 08:09 AM
#139
Originally Posted by Dex
So whats the diffence? Slowing down using the engine is the same no matter what. The only difference is one your coming to a complete stop and the other your only slowing down a little for a curve or whatever.
No need to keep power to the wheels because you are gonna stop.
Downshifting so as to that you don't bog the engine is just plain driving.
01-12-2007, 04:16 PM
#140
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i downshift 100% of the time. as long as the car isn't jerking when you let the clutch out you are fine. downshifting is part of driving a manual car. they go together like spaghetti and meatball